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Re: I get all the weird ones...

Seems to me that maybe there's another way altogether, @Tom_133 ? As I read through your comments, one of the reasons they want to maintain temperature in the building — and possibly the only one which really is important (though working a freezing cold building isn't much fun…) is the hydraulic system. Which is not unreasonable.

So… completely different approach. First, include in the hydraulic system a heat exchanger to maintain the temperature of the hydraulic fluid. Now this may require some thought and additional piping, as the fluid in the hydraulic cylinders doesn't recirculate, and for installations with long piping to the cylinder it might be necessary to have recirculation lines to keep the fluid warm enough. But that's a detail. (An alternative would be a cold compatible fluid, such as is used on aircraft — but that's not cheap).

Then to keep the workers warm enough to work (never mind keeping OSHA happy) the various work stations would be provided with infrared local radiant heaters (gas or electric) and, possibly, heated floor mats.

The concept isn't totally out of the blue — that's how we handle dairy milking parlours.

Jamie Hall

3

Re: I get all the weird ones...

Tell them straight up, it's not going to work. They need to figure out a different strategy for material handling. Without knowing the process, I can't really offer suggestions. If they insist on trying to heat a 5k sf building with a 22x18 door hanging wide open, walk away. Working for idiots is financially risky and you won't get any satisfaction.

Harvey Ramer

8

Re: Replacing cast iron radiator with smaller one

That's a gorgeous radiator. As dabrakeman said, remove, sandblast, powder coat....it needs to have its dignity and beauty showcased. Add a TRV if better temperature control. Mad Dog

Mad Dog_2

1

Re: Evaluating Ductless Install Quotes

there’s a lot to do to install these. Get a bad contractor and throw the entire system out in a few years.
forget what you see on line as a price for equipment there is so much more that’s needed.

pecmsg

1

Re: Need help with new install of radiant with Buderus cast iron boiler

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1863500#Comment_1863500

The proper 4-way setup with an actuator (mechanical actuator, not thermostatic) and outdoor reset, will aim to protect the boiler, and also aim for the correct mix outlet temp based on the outdoor temperature.

Let's do a hypthetical. Consider how much concrete you have on your floor. Now lets assume that you could heat your space to the exact indoor comfort you are looking for, while the outside temp is -10, by supplying a constant 110f supply to your manifold. Now let's fast forward to a day it is 35f outside. With a thermostatic mix valve you are still going to be supplying 110f water to your slab (a "dumb" miux valve just set by hand will also do this assuming the boiler setpoint remains constant, though it will eventually overheat even more), by the time the temp reaches the desired comfort level, the slab is hot, and the heat in the mass of your slab will continue transferring to the space thus over shooting the temperature you are looking for inside. Now let's say you only need 80f water on that 35f day, with a mechanically actuated mixing valve, and properly setup ODR control, you will be supplying the exact temp water needed to maintain the comfort level in your space. In theory you can match the load precisely and the system runs constantly, to maintain a perfect comfort level in the space.

These are features that are basically built in to modulating condensing boilers, no mix valve needed for those with a single temp system, and no worry of cool return water temp. and all of the above is ignoring the potential damage that overheating a big concrete slab can cause

GGross

1

Re: Need help with new install of radiant with Buderus cast iron boiler

I guess I just wasn't understanding the concept or advantage of the "dumb" 4 way vs going with a thermostatic valve like Kaos was showing in his setup. The thermostatic would keep a constant/regulated temp going to the system, It seems like with the 4 way it would fluctuate as the boiler cycles? Or does that just not matter if it was being controlled with ODR from the 256?

I like where we are heading though!

ajping3830

1

Re: Evaluating Ductless Install Quotes

And gas for the truck and truck insurance and and liability insurance and workers comp insurance and the time it take to put a quote together, run the office, do the billing and payroll and bookkeeping, truck repairs, employee training on you system. He also has to make a profit to stay in business

If you don't like the pricing don't complain to the contractor, Massachusetts is one of the most over regulated states in the country. i know, I have lived here 72 years.

EBEBRATT-Ed

2

Re: Evaluating Ductless Install Quotes

TL;DR: You're buying a lot more than the equipment.

I can't say much about your particular installers, but while it doesn't take much skill to slap a mini split on the wall & cash a check, a good install takes quite a bit of skill and experience. And not especially cheap tools. And insurance. And licensing. And training. And warranty.