Welcome! Here are the website rules, as well as some tips for using this forum.
Need to contact us? Visit https://heatinghelp.com/contact-us/.
Click here to Find a Contractor in your area.
If our community has helped you, please consider making a contribution to support this website. Thanks!
Best Of
Re: Just wanted to thanks the good men of this forum for helping me thru my 1st winter
@CoachBoilermaker said: " Also, got the original service guy in. He only changed filter, nozzle, strainer. No brushing/vacuuming, and I've let that go. He said my 1945 boiler does not have the heat exchanger nipples that need brushing, b/c the gap is wider (or something like that)".
Wrong. Even a boiler of that vintage can get dirty. How would he know if he didn't even open it up 😡 ?
Re: t VHE ^ cold start flame back out the tubes
i don't know what a vhe 6 is but look for the boiler being scooted and for burners that are damaged or clogged. Some burners have designs that rust out and collapse or are damaged of they aren't set up right. make sure you have enough combustion air, that you don't have a sealed off room around the boiler or an attic fan or something. if it is soot or you don't find either of those things, you need someone that understands combustion.
mattmia2
1
Re: U.S. Radiator Corp 20-4 Steam Boiler
measure the edr of the steam emitters connected to the boiler.
I wouldn't worry about the hot water loops unless it is over 30% of the output if the boiler and even then it won't be an issue unless the edr just matches the heat loss of the building. you could do some comparison of the output of the boiler to the heat loss of the building, as long as the boiler is bigger shouldn't be a problem.
mattmia2
2
Re: Rheem Hybrid water heater changing operating modes on its own.
SALLYM, thank you for the insight! I will be sure to call Rheem and add to the customer complaints.
My heating bill the past two months (Jan & Feb in missouri) were terrible. I decided to investigate and realized my hybrid water heater was pushing way more cool air into our 1,200sqft HEATED basement than originally thought it would. It would be impossible to tell the basement was heated at all. Ok, simple fix right? Just switch to electric👍 two days later it’s blowing cool air into the basement again😑. I’ll try scheduling it in the app and see if that works for me, by some miracle. Explaining this issue seems like people just want to hate on the hybrid water heaters. We like ours and we like the options… when they work
My heating bill the past two months (Jan & Feb in missouri) were terrible. I decided to investigate and realized my hybrid water heater was pushing way more cool air into our 1,200sqft HEATED basement than originally thought it would. It would be impossible to tell the basement was heated at all. Ok, simple fix right? Just switch to electric👍 two days later it’s blowing cool air into the basement again😑. I’ll try scheduling it in the app and see if that works for me, by some miracle. Explaining this issue seems like people just want to hate on the hybrid water heaters. We like ours and we like the options… when they work
Re: Its on every plumbing exam.......
some nicknames and exceptional branding/marketing
sammy screws (rod anchors, sammy is a brand)
kindorf/kindorf clamps (slotted strut channel, strut clamps, kindorf is a brand)
pipe rest (riser clamp)
loop hanger, sprinkler hanger, swivel hanger
fish plate, ceiling plate, hanger plate, square plate
union (actually wants coupling, for the spanish speaking folk)
black pipe (actually wants nh pipe)
nh tee wye (sanitary tee, though some guys actually want a wye which is why anyone who asks for a tee wye I have ask tee or wye.)
teflon (ptfe tape, teflon is a brand)
johni-bolts (closet bolts)
mission coupling (transition coupling, mission is a brand)
offset wrench (wants end wrench)
fernco coupling (flexible rubber cplg, fernco is a brand)
sawzall/sawzall blades (reciprocating saw/blades, sawzall is a Milwaukee trademark)
silver solder (wants sterling solder, contains no silver) unless it's an hvac guy, then stay-brite it is.
the trap with the threads at the end (milwaukee/utility trap)
the fitting with the 2" on the side (side outlet elbow)
shemale (extension cplg)
At the end of the day, all that matters is that you understood.
not nicknames but common mistakes
Not reading a reducing tee correctly, larger size run x run x bull.
Sweat reducing male/female adapters should read sweat size first, then thread size.
Not knowing ID/OD plumbing/hvac and understanding how you should order depending on if you are in a plumbing or hvac supply. unless ordering 1/4 and 3/8 refrigeration coils/compression fittings, then plumbers also use OD.
Not knowing caulk vs silicone
Angle danfoss radiator valves when pipe is coming up from the ground, should use side mount valves.
pro dope on oil lines
sammy screws (rod anchors, sammy is a brand)
kindorf/kindorf clamps (slotted strut channel, strut clamps, kindorf is a brand)
pipe rest (riser clamp)
loop hanger, sprinkler hanger, swivel hanger
fish plate, ceiling plate, hanger plate, square plate
union (actually wants coupling, for the spanish speaking folk)
black pipe (actually wants nh pipe)
nh tee wye (sanitary tee, though some guys actually want a wye which is why anyone who asks for a tee wye I have ask tee or wye.)
teflon (ptfe tape, teflon is a brand)
johni-bolts (closet bolts)
mission coupling (transition coupling, mission is a brand)
offset wrench (wants end wrench)
fernco coupling (flexible rubber cplg, fernco is a brand)
sawzall/sawzall blades (reciprocating saw/blades, sawzall is a Milwaukee trademark)
silver solder (wants sterling solder, contains no silver) unless it's an hvac guy, then stay-brite it is.
the trap with the threads at the end (milwaukee/utility trap)
the fitting with the 2" on the side (side outlet elbow)
shemale (extension cplg)
At the end of the day, all that matters is that you understood.
not nicknames but common mistakes
Not reading a reducing tee correctly, larger size run x run x bull.
Sweat reducing male/female adapters should read sweat size first, then thread size.
Not knowing ID/OD plumbing/hvac and understanding how you should order depending on if you are in a plumbing or hvac supply. unless ordering 1/4 and 3/8 refrigeration coils/compression fittings, then plumbers also use OD.
Not knowing caulk vs silicone
Angle danfoss radiator valves when pipe is coming up from the ground, should use side mount valves.
pro dope on oil lines
dko
5
Re: Gorton air eliminator, condensation/sweating in summer
The valve in the feeder unit may be leaking, but it can be rebuilt.
Re: Gorton air eliminator, condensation/sweating in summer
If its leaking by it doesn't change the numbers.
pecmsg
1
Re: Rheem Hybrid water heater changing operating modes on its own.
I find this topic interesting end enlightening, and like all conversations, you have to look at the big picture to see what's going on. I think Ethical Paul is assuming that every home these are placed in are old, with uninsulated basement walls and wide open expanses that are not being used for anything other than spider storage. It is implied that these HP water heaters are running on "FREE" energy, when in reality they are not. Someone paid to heat the air in the basement, especially in homes with finished basements. The rH control is a secondary sales feature that has nothing to do with the heating of DHW.
Full disclosure, I've never worked on one, but my 50 years worth of field experience tells me there a rat out there somewhere. The technicians I've spoken to that are working on them in the field tell me that these units are so incapable of handling the demands, that they spend most of their time running on the heating elements (99% efficient, not 400%) and that the mechanical room is so cold you could hang meat in it, even with a gas or oil fired boiler in the same room, so the consumer leaves the door to the mechanical room open, thereby cooling off the balance of the basement, causing the thermostat to call for heat. Tell me again how efficient these systems are?
Sometimes the Government gets a wild hair up their but and pushes an agenda without really looking at the big picture. Like CFT lighting and the associated UV radiation that is causing major failures of plastic components, including PEX tubing, solar PV with a 20% efficiency and a life expectancy that is less than required to hit an economic breakeven without significant Federal subsidies, and will have to be removed and di$po$ed of with that not being taken into consideration on the initial economics.
The equipment manufactures have no choice but to fall in line, or be over run by the competition. Then marketing gets involved, and pushes silly ideas like "FREE" energy and dehumidification to justify the additional expense. Before you hack my head of and throw it out with the wash, understand that I understand the premise of being as efficient as one can be (COP's of 3 or 4), but I also understand the connected loads (human beings), energy sources (conditioned versus non conditioned space or OSA) and the consumers willingness to stand around and wait for a slow compressor to heat their water to a temperature that they can quickly shower in, all in the name of carbon reduction.
I think one thing that really irritates me in this whole GREEEN SCENEario, is the lack of attention to Solar Thermal (60 to 80% efficient with unknown life expectancies) and NO mention of drain waste heat recovery heat exchangers, which by the way are MANDATORY in new construction in Montreal, and can reduce basic DHW heating energy by 50% (excluding solar thermal contributions) , can be employed now without the need for Federal subsidies.
Why do you think solar PV is so popular with the DOE ? Because it can spin the electrical meter backwards, which is exciting. Solar thermal can't spin the gas meter backwards. It can only stop it and that isn't as sexy as spinning a meter backwards. Bureaucrats are running the DOE. I wonder how many of them own stock in Teslas Power Wall and Solar PV systems... HP water heaters should be drawing their "FREE ENERGY
from outside the conditioned home, but that would require additional materials and labor that will jack the price of an installed system upward, affecting the economics and bottom line ROI, and the Marketing department will fight it all the way to Washington DC
I also think that ALL energy conservation products should have a "Cradle to Grave" environmental listing, that will allow the consumer to look at the options, and make an intelligent economic decision, instead of forcing subsidies down their throat with the attitude of "This is what we have to offer, take it or leave it...". We need to have a bigger voice in what the government is forcing upon us. We are ALL paying for the subsidies, wether we use it or not.
Rant over, open to civil conversations about how to REALLY reduce energy consumption, which I do believe is important, regardless of politics. Waste not, want not.
Full disclosure, I've never worked on one, but my 50 years worth of field experience tells me there a rat out there somewhere. The technicians I've spoken to that are working on them in the field tell me that these units are so incapable of handling the demands, that they spend most of their time running on the heating elements (99% efficient, not 400%) and that the mechanical room is so cold you could hang meat in it, even with a gas or oil fired boiler in the same room, so the consumer leaves the door to the mechanical room open, thereby cooling off the balance of the basement, causing the thermostat to call for heat. Tell me again how efficient these systems are?
Sometimes the Government gets a wild hair up their but and pushes an agenda without really looking at the big picture. Like CFT lighting and the associated UV radiation that is causing major failures of plastic components, including PEX tubing, solar PV with a 20% efficiency and a life expectancy that is less than required to hit an economic breakeven without significant Federal subsidies, and will have to be removed and di$po$ed of with that not being taken into consideration on the initial economics.
The equipment manufactures have no choice but to fall in line, or be over run by the competition. Then marketing gets involved, and pushes silly ideas like "FREE" energy and dehumidification to justify the additional expense. Before you hack my head of and throw it out with the wash, understand that I understand the premise of being as efficient as one can be (COP's of 3 or 4), but I also understand the connected loads (human beings), energy sources (conditioned versus non conditioned space or OSA) and the consumers willingness to stand around and wait for a slow compressor to heat their water to a temperature that they can quickly shower in, all in the name of carbon reduction.
I think one thing that really irritates me in this whole GREEEN SCENEario, is the lack of attention to Solar Thermal (60 to 80% efficient with unknown life expectancies) and NO mention of drain waste heat recovery heat exchangers, which by the way are MANDATORY in new construction in Montreal, and can reduce basic DHW heating energy by 50% (excluding solar thermal contributions) , can be employed now without the need for Federal subsidies.
Why do you think solar PV is so popular with the DOE ? Because it can spin the electrical meter backwards, which is exciting. Solar thermal can't spin the gas meter backwards. It can only stop it and that isn't as sexy as spinning a meter backwards. Bureaucrats are running the DOE. I wonder how many of them own stock in Teslas Power Wall and Solar PV systems... HP water heaters should be drawing their "FREE ENERGY
from outside the conditioned home, but that would require additional materials and labor that will jack the price of an installed system upward, affecting the economics and bottom line ROI, and the Marketing department will fight it all the way to Washington DC
I also think that ALL energy conservation products should have a "Cradle to Grave" environmental listing, that will allow the consumer to look at the options, and make an intelligent economic decision, instead of forcing subsidies down their throat with the attitude of "This is what we have to offer, take it or leave it...". We need to have a bigger voice in what the government is forcing upon us. We are ALL paying for the subsidies, wether we use it or not.
Rant over, open to civil conversations about how to REALLY reduce energy consumption, which I do believe is important, regardless of politics. Waste not, want not.
Re: Gorton air eliminator, condensation/sweating in summer
Is it cold?
The only way it can sweat is if it's cold.
Does your boiler run to make domestic hot water?
ChrisJ
1
Re: AO smith ECC code
This long thread points out what i posted a couple of years ago:
For the most part these units are not repairable. They are treated like a throw away appliance.
The MFGs put these out in the field without proper testing and they know they will fail and build that into the price. They don't care.
@iamknotdot just run it on electric.
With two people and your water uses is low a 40 or 50 gallon electric is more than enough
