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What am I doing wrong

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Comments

  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    heat loss from
    living room 15565
    bedroom 6065
    kitchen 7351
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    the slanfin calculator gives what baseboard product should be put in each room
    would this help knowing?
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
    No each rad manufactor has its own correction.
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    thought i would put it out there
    what can i do to help?
    measure the radiators again?
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
    List the SF of each room. The heatloss for each room. We did this last year, and it seemed out of balance. I can't find that page.........yet. Many pages.
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    i can figure out the square footage of each room, I have the slant fin right here
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
    Okay, and the heatloss.
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    front hall 44 st 5496 heat loss
    liv rm 266 sf 15565 hl
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
    Keep,it all in one post please.
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    hall 24 sf 327 hl
    dngrm 148.50 sf 6379 hl
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    hall 24 sf 327 hl
    mid hl 61.25 723 hl
    masbed 156sf 6065 hl
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    bath 42 sf 2353 hl
    kitcn 231 sf 7351 hl
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    sorry
    office 99 sf 4266 hl
    pr 25 sf 1271 hl
    2 bed 121 sf 1360 hl
    2nd floor
    hall 63 sf 116 hl
    bed 154 sf 6527 hl
    kit 140 sf 5472 hl
    bath 56 sf 2604 hl
    dr 121 sf 3224 hl
    livrm 192 sf 7499 hl
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    anything else I can help with?
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    by giving all the room sizes and loss, how will this help fining out how big of radiator I need for the living room?
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    if this is going to cost me around 1,000 bucks, I can not afford it
  • SWEI
    SWEI Member Posts: 7,356
    Probably double that if you want two of those nice vertical panels. Possibly half that if two commodity wall panels will do the job. In materials.
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    I can not see myself spending 2 grand on radiators for that room
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    what is commodity wall panels?
  • SWEI
    SWEI Member Posts: 7,356
    We're not supposed to talk pricing here, but Myson publishes their list prices online and there are several retailers as well. The Select line (piped from the sides) is one of the least expensive options out there. The T6 line (piped from the bottom as are the Buderus rads and includes a TRV valve body) costs a little bit more. The vertical models are roughly twice as much.
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    I am sorry, and I forgot when I was talking about prices.
    Please forgive me.
    I will look it up on the net, as your suggested.
    Do I know what btus I am looking for? I imagine i need to know this, before looking at radiators
    thanks
  • Zman
    Zman Member Posts: 7,611
    Mark,
    A low tech solution would be to partially cover the radiators that are over performing. You could experiment by partially covering them with blankets.
    There are limits to how far you can throttle down the flow in order to reduce output.
    This might be a good solution for a guy with your carpentry skill set.
    If needed, you could increase the water temps to get the living room up to temp.
    Your posts would be easier to follow if you incorporated all your thoughts into one post. You can always edit the post if you need to add a detail.
    Carl
    "If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough"
    Albert Einstein
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    good morning carl
    Hope you had a nice turkey day
    all my radiators have valves, would it not be good, to close each of them a little, or would I be restricting flow to much?
    would that hurt the efficiency of the system?
  • Zman
    Zman Member Posts: 7,611
    There is nothing wrong with that approach, it just may not be enough. Those valves are not really designed for that so the sweet spot between too much flow and not enough flow may be difficult to find.
    It sound like the reason the living room is under performing is that the rads are partially covered making the house imbalanced.
    You options are:
    Add radiation to living (expensive)
    Reduce flow to other rooms (might work)
    Partially cover other radiators .

    Covering the radiators might be a simple as putting a plant shelf with an apron on top, reducing the convective flow.

    I don't think you are under radiated as much as you are imbalanced (I am talking about the house ;) . I am sure if you increased the boiler temps a bit the living would heat just fine, you would however be way too hot in the other rooms.

    Carl
    "If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough"
    Albert Einstein
    Gordy
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    Carl
    This is the house i grew up in, the living room has always been the coldest room in the winter.
    on the 1st floor, most of the radiators are behind a covering. except the bedroom and the office
    Radiator boxes either my father made, or I made.
    but the 2nd floor, none of the radiators boxed.
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
    I did not know this.......about other radiators being boxed........
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
    edited November 2015
    The calculated EDR of a radiator is based on unrestricted convective air flow. When you start boxing in a radiator, and restricting air flow through the columns it changes the output.

    As far,as I recall the only rad mentioned was the living room.
    SWEI
  • Zman
    Zman Member Posts: 7,611
    Mark,
    I would consider altering (making more holes) at some of the under performing rads and covering the over performing ones.
    You could also add small computer fans to the radiator boxes in the living.
    "If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough"
    Albert Einstein
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    Carl
    I have a small fan, larger than a computer fan behind the living room rads, and it is connected to an attic thermostat, so when the heat gets up there, the fan kicks in.
    Since the water temp is much lower than before, I had too lower the thermostat temp
    The living room is really the only bad room.
    I have not been upstairs, but my tenant says it was comfortable, actually, last week, i saw his window open, and i saw $ coming out the window
  • Zman
    Zman Member Posts: 7,611
    Are you able to confirm that you have adequate flow to the living room rads? What is the supply and return water temps to those radiators?
    "If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough"
    Albert Einstein
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    The valves are wide open on those radiators, i did not measure temps to them, unless the valves are broken and are in a semi closed position. The living room radiators are over the boiler room, they are the 1st radiators off the boiler.
    to the touch, they are warm
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    right now the circs are on medium, should i keep them that way, or increase them? and tweak the other radiators that are ideal temp
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    Sorry Gordy, i didn't see your response until now
    yes, most of the radiators are boxed on the 1st floor, the 2nd floor is not boxed at all.
    2 radiators on the 1st floor are not boxed
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
    Mark I tried to correlate radiation to heat loss but some of your heat loss rooms are not labled according to what the room names for radiation are.
  • Zman
    Zman Member Posts: 7,611
    Mark,
    You do understand that the covers, or lack of covers, are the major factor in the imbalance of your system?
    "If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough"
    Albert Einstein
    SWEISteve Minnich
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    Carl
    I know that it's harder to give heat, with the covers on'
    this is something that I should have said from the beginning
    Gordy
    I thought I got everything right, but it's possible I made a mistake, if you tell me wht rooms are in question, i will bring out the calculator again
  • Zman
    Zman Member Posts: 7,611
    It is nearly impossible to compare the output of radiators mathematically based on surface area when some are covered with home made covers and some are not. You have thrown in a huge unknown.
    I think it is down to trial and error...
    "If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough"
    Albert Einstein
    SWEI
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    I understand now, but I didn't even think of it before, when I 1st showed up on this site.
    Could it be possible, that the boiler will not heat my house properly at 0 degrees or minus 0?
    I messed up, I totally see it now, I should have said something a long time ago
  • Zman
    Zman Member Posts: 7,611
    Mark,
    It is only a balancing issue. You have plenty of boiler to overcome the heat loss for the building. It is just difficult to calculate the difference in output with so many unknowns.
    You can experiment with this by partially covering some of the rads and seeing how the balance changes.
    "If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough"
    Albert Einstein
  • maybemark
    maybemark Member Posts: 1,131
    If it comes down to it not working with the boxes, I'll have to take them off

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