What am I doing wrong

Gordy

So you could fudge your reset curve a little more. Unless you like the temps in all the other rooms. Forget about the living room for now.

Paul48

Four inch duct fan= $20.........

FranklinD

I wonder where that living room radiator falls in the piping scheme...our living room rad was always the coolest until I set my bumblebee circ to speed 2 (using the hydronic formula I should be using speed 1). I assume it's because my system (gravity) was designed for a long-burning coal fire in which all radiators would get hot eventually, not expecting them to all warm equally in 10-15 minutes.

Anyway, boosting my flow another 3 gpm really helped with the living room. Then this year I freed up and re packed all the radiator valves, and spent a week fine tuning them all for what seems to be an ideal balance.

If the mod/con is direct piped, I assume your options for pump speed may be limited. I'm not sure on that (I have cast iron and it doesn't care about minimum flow rates). But perhaps the radiator valve adjustments would help. It does take some time and patience is required, but it may be worth a shot.

Best of luck!

Paul48

For God's Sake........He has these radiators inside an insulated box!!!!!!!!!!!!!

maybemark

Franklin
The living room are the 1st 2 radiators off the boiler. It is direct piped. I am on med speed on my circs. when i as on low, I saw that the water was not getting to all the radiators.
I do need to adjust the valves to try and get a closer balance.
Paul
That statement was a bit extreme. The box is not insulated at all.
But, the box does have serious problems as far as transferring the heat out of the box

maybemark

Gordy
I imagine i can play with the curve a little, but, would it be better to play with the valves of the radiators, or, change the curve, because it is a little warm in the house. Correct me if I am wrong, if I play with the curve a little, would that make my living room even colder? or if i play with the valves, would that help warm up the living room a little bit

Gordy

Balancing can get tedious. As you valve off warm rads that are to warm. That flow gets diverted to other rads in the system. since you have a constant speed circulator your flow rate will increase slightly as radiators get closed. It's a balancing act that may require going back to each radiator to readjust.

Gordy

Trvs do this for you automatically. But it requires some bypass piping.

maybemark

Gordy
I don't have a problem going to each radiator a few times, rather than paying more money and more labor into this system, unless I really need too.
If I turn down the valves, flow would be less? Can this be compensated by increasing the circs to hi, instead of medium as they are set at now?

Paul48

No Mark.........That statement was not extreme, at all. The box is made of materials that insulate it. To suggest that adjusting flow rates can somehow change that fact, is akin to "throwing the baby out, with the bath water".

Gordy

this may sound like a stupid question, but your absolutely certain both the living room rad valves are fully open, and I don't just mean the knob turned all the way open.

maybemark

gordy
Yes, the valves on the living room radiators are fully open.
Paul, I'm not going to argue with you

Gordy

Is the living room rads the first in the supply piping series? How many after that one before the return comes back to the boiler?

maybemark

Yes, living room is #1. I think 7 or maybe 8 and this is only a guess are after the living room.
Remember, my house is split with 2 mains and i am not sure

maybemark

my office area is one of the last radiators and right now it's 71 back here

maybemark

the living room is 65 right now
my bedroom with the valve dialed down is 71

maybemark

my house is too hot for me, I think 69 or 70 would be good

Gordy

keep tuning.

maybemark

the boiler?
and what would you suggest I tune ?

SWEI

Aren't the radiators piped as a parallel return? I don't recall mention of any series loops -- or did I miss something?

maybemark

the system and set point are at 95, , the boiler water and set point was sensor is saying 41, which i think might be close

maybemark

I have 5 main pipes in the basement, half the house has a 2" supply amd return, the other half has a supply and a return.
the closer it gets to the back of the house, the mains get smaller

maybemark

sorry, 4 main pipes
each radiator has a supply and a return

Gordy

Right Kurt I can't remember I would assume so. So Mark look at the first radiator in the basement mark the supply pipe from the main goes up to the rad, and the return from the rad goes down to the return main. That's parallel piped. I'm sure it is that.

Gordy

If that is the case the trvs would not need bypasses. Makes things easier.

maybemark

Gordy,and Kurt
each radiator has it's own supply and return
whay all of a sudden you think differently. Did I say something wrong?

Gordy

I messed up Mark way back when I said the trvs would need bypasses. That is only true when rads are piped in series.

maybemark

I never said they were in series, from the very begining, i said, the house is slit in half. 1 main supply and 1 main return, on both sides of the house

Gordy

And I said I messed up.

maybemark

as far as i know, all the radiators are this way, obviously, when they are in the walls I can not see the pipes and how they run

maybemark

well, your not the only one that messed up, I never told anyone that most of the radiators have covers on them

Gordy

The collective has given you the tools to rectify your problems. The rest is up to you whether or not you use them. This has been takin as far as it can be from my keyboard.

maybemark

what is a trv?
someone said, I would need to put them on the good radiators?
why would this be better than playing with the valve, or curve?

maybemark

Gordy
thanks for all your help

Paul48

The amount of labor, and or, price to have someone else install thermostatic radiator valves on all the good radiators, would be outrageous.

maybemark

Paul
why would that be suggested to me, if the cost would be extreme, why not just turn down the valves until i get it right?

Paul48

Damned if I know Mark.

maybemark

I'll try turning the good radiators down, and see what happends, if i do this, should i increase the circs to high? Or tune the boiler a little different?

Gordy

Because it saves you from adjusting valves. the trv does it automatically. It holds the dialed temp of the room, and throttles the radiator flow automatically to keep the desired temp you set the trv to.

Google them, and read up on how they work.

Paul48

You may succeed in cooling the other rooms off. That will not change the fact, that you can't warm the living room. Maybe the guys that suggested TRV's missed the fact that you nixed the possibility of a repair costing $1000 a couple hundred posts back.