Carrier moves jobs to Mexico

DanHolohan

http://www.dailyjournal.net/view/story/64a87c5ffb4e4027b837c26918af0266/IN--Carrier-Corp-Plant-Closure

Robert O'Brien

The continuing destruction of manufacturing in this country.

Abracadabra

Willis Carrier is turning in his grave

KC_Jones

Putting more pressure on competitors to follow suit. I work for a global Industrial HVAC/Refrigeration manufacturer and so far we have no plans to go into Mexico. We compete with some of those companies (like Guntner) who manufacture in Mexico. We can't beat their price so we have to use superior quality and customer support to get the business. It makes it quite difficult for us, but I hope we never change. We do manufacture in other countries, but only to more readily supply those markets. We actually build in the US to ship into Mexico...I guess we are backwards?! lol

ChrisJ

KC_Jones said:

Putting more pressure on competitors to follow suit. I work for a global Industrial HVAC/Refrigeration manufacturer and so far we have no plans to go into Mexico. We compete with some of those companies (like Guntner) who manufacture in Mexico. We can't beat their price so we have to use superior quality and customer support to get the business. It makes it quite difficult for us, but I hope we never change. We do manufacture in other countries, but only to more readily supply those markets. We actually build in the US to ship into Mexico...I guess we are backwards?! lol

Shame it seems 90% of Americans don't care about either of those.

Look at the support you get from most companies and then look at the quality of the products.

Robert O'Brien

How do the Germans build quality products in a very expensive business environment? I can't believe they have a lower labor cost than the USA.

hot_rod

Those jobs will flock back from Mexico when Donald is in charge:)

KC_Jones

Robert O'Brien said:

How do the Germans build quality products in a very expensive business environment? I can't believe they have a lower labor cost than the USA.

Guntner (the company I mentioned) is a German company building their product in Mexico. Don't believe for a second the Germans are "above" that business model.

Sal Santamaura

hot rod said:

Those jobs will flock back from Mexico when Donald is in charge:)

While scrolling down through this thread, I was thinking that it would be impossible for politics not to come up. Just as I was going to compose a post saying so, Bob's post appeared. Moot point now.

hot_rod

Sal Santamaura said:

hot rod said:

Those jobs will flock back from Mexico when Donald is in charge:)

While scrolling down through this thread, I was thinking that it would be impossible for politics not to come up. Just as I was going to compose a post saying so, Bob's post appeared. Moot point now.

Humor not politics, it's now an entertainment business.

Harvey Ramer

Their have been some manufacturers that learned some pretty expensive lessons by doing things like that.

CMadatMe

I actually see this as a opportunity for all the presidential candidates to show us what they can do. Good questions to submit for tonight's Debate and the upcoming Republican debate.

Paul48

They can do nothing. They will do as they're told, by those families that do run this country, and the rest of the world, as a whole. Put whichever figure-head you select in office, then hold your breath, waiting for him to do anything that might not benefit Wall Street.

SlamDunk

Robert O'Brien said:

How do the Germans build quality products in a very expensive business environment? I can't believe they have a lower labor cost than the USA.

Volkswagen has a large plant in Mexico. But then, BMW and Mercedes have large plants in South Carolina. Volkswagen also has a large plant in Tennessee. Reminds of a grade school test:

Mexico is to the US as the US is to XXXXX?

Paul48

The manufacturer I work for is in the process of taking from the workers now. Once they have taken everything they can, over the next 3 to 5 years, they'll close our plant and move everything to Mexico and China. The latest is a high deductible medical insurance, which they blamed on Obama-care. That is a bald-faced lie. They did it because it benefited them. The insurance would save the house, in the event of a catastrophic illness, but we have to take 1000's out of our pockets annually for medical care, on top of ridiculous weekly premiums. This is the way every publicly traded company in the US is going. Maybe not today, but soon. Neither the "Donald", or any of the other idiots are going to fix this mess. It can only be done by the workers on a global scale. It's more than politics, it's the reality we are living in.

Robert O'Brien

Buderus casts their iron boilers in Germany and Viessmann assembles their condensing boilers there, although I know some components are imported.

4Johnpipe

WOW Carrier secured a lucrative federal funded job barbecue they were made in USA...sad state of affairs...

CMadatMe

This is what happens with conglomerates that are publicly traded on the market. These companies have only one purpose in life. Profit, Profit, Profit and leave devastation for the middle class American family.

Bernie Sanders might take things too far left, but you know what, the guy is right.

njtommy

Lol.

CMadatMe

You know what the sad part is... Contractors will continue to buy the product instead of finding an American Made product that supports American Jobs. Daiken, a Japanese Company invested 410 Million to build a plant opening this year in Texas. Guess they scared Carrier out to Mexico to be able to compete and increase profits at the same time.

BobC

@Chris They claim it's all for the stockholder but the only ones who make out are the CEO and his cronies, everybody else gets bupkis.

Time for a new Teddie Roosevelt to crack open the new conglomerates.

Bob

hot_rod

I doubt you could install a 100% made in America hydronic system? Also the tools to install it. And even companies you think are "All American" may be owned by offshore holding companies.

There needs to be global trade, but is needs to be a two way street. China needs to buy more than just Jeeps from the US.

Tough knowing Milwaukee Tool is now owned by the Chinese, although so far quality seems to be staying high.

Paul48

Walmart and McDonalds now pay as much as most manufacturers here, now. When there are no other jobs, you can build a plant, and get skilled help at starvation wages. The only way business and the wealthy were willing in the past, to share anything with the workers, was to force them. The wealthy found a way to beat that system, and another way has to evolve. The French had it right...when changes were proposed to their labor laws that would hurt the workers, they took to the streets as a nation.

CMadatMe

hot rod said:

I doubt you could install a 100% made in America hydronic system? Also the tools to install it. And even companies you think are "All American" may be owned by offshore holding companies.

There needs to be global trade, but is needs to be a two way street. China needs to buy more than just Jeeps from the US.

Tough knowing Milwaukee Tool is now owned by the Chinese, although so far quality seems to be staying high.

For the most part you are 100% correct. In reality the American Consumer is their own worse enemy. They watch American companies lay off workers, move outside the US, then purchase those same products they make outside our borders.

The definition of insanity isn't it?

KC_Jones

We have a plant in China, American company making roots in China to sell only to the China market. I love telling people that. We are employee owned and honestly it is an incredible way to go. I have worked for publicly traded companies before and the benefits and pay can't even come close to how I am treated now. It can be done AND kept in this country to benefit all involved including the workers. Companies prove it every day in this country, but those companies aren't shown in our news very often....people don't seem to care enough about good news since it doesn't get ratings. Rating the news...yeah that makes sense?!

CMadatMe

KC_Jones said:

We have a plant in China, American company making roots in China to sell only to the China market. I love telling people that. We are employee owned and honestly it is an incredible way to go. I have worked for publicly traded companies before and the benefits and pay can't even come close to how I am treated now. It can be done AND kept in this country to benefit all involved including the workers. Companies prove it every day in this country, but those companies aren't shown in our news very often....people don't seem to care enough about good news since it doesn't get ratings. Rating the news...yeah that makes sense?!

Quick question. So it's an American company using Chinese workers to make products for the China market? Am I to believe that this company brings 100% of its profits into the US to be taxed? Does it bring those profits in and reinvest it to create more jobs here or think about making that product here and selling it over there?

KC_Jones

As far as I know those profits stay in China. We have profit sharing program and the China profits are not counted in anything we collect, actually none of the international profits are counted. We only collect from domestic profits. I am not an accountant so that's about as much as I can tell you.

Paul48

I remember back in the day, when NAFTA was being argued "for and against", and the pencil-necked geeks would say ,"we need to be part of the global economy". Someone should have told them we were.....We were the leader of the global economy. In Bush's last 6 months in office, he fast-tracked more trade agreements. Not too long ago Obama announced, he was fast-tracking more trade agreements. Now....for a president that was elected his first term because of a promise to re-write the trade agreements.....why would he do that?

CMadatMe

KC_Jones said:

As far as I know those profits stay in China. We have profit sharing program and the China profits are not counted in anything we collect, actually none of the international profits are counted. We only collect from domestic profits. I am not an accountant so that's about as much as I can tell you.

Don't be surprised in 5-7 years when they move all their mfg over there and only a corporate office and distribution center is in the US..

KC_Jones

We are employee owned the employees would have to agree to that. We control 52% of the stock....private stock.

njtommy

How much could they be possibly saving with moving to Mexico?

Paul48

The last company I worked for, before they moved everything out, had a plant in Mexico. They didn't pay their management there enough to own an automobile. They had a fleet of lease vehicles for them. You tell me how much they save.

hot_rod

So the fence on the border may in fact stop US workers from getting across to Mexico for a job

DanHolohan

Here's management giving the word to the employees: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3ttxGMQOrY

Robert O'Brien

This transcends politics......

Fred

Sickening! They announce this knowing that they will get some huge retention bonus to stay and make the transition happen and then they will manage/coordinate the production from the comfort of their homes or some plush office here in the states and at the same time expect these employees to "keep up the good work" until the doors are closed. Just plain sick.

Harvey Ramer

I heard a while back that Nordyne did the same thing.

Johnson controls tried it a decade ago and ended up replacing thousands of leaking coils under warranty. Kind of hurts the profit margin. They brought it back to the states if I am correct.

The biggest problem manufacturers have, particularly in china, is quality control. In some high tech industrial industries especially. From what I've been told it's a constant fistfight, a lot of lost money and almost not economically justifiable anymore.

Robert O'Brien

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/22/business/apple-america-and-a-squeezed-middle-class.html?_r=1&hp=&pagewanted=all

ChrisJ

Harvey Ramer said:

I heard a while back that Nordyne did the same thing.

Johnson controls tried it a decade ago and ended up replacing thousands of leaking coils under warranty. Kind of hurts the profit margin. They brought it back to the states if I am correct.

The biggest problem manufacturers have, particularly in china, is quality control. In some high tech industrial industries especially. From what I've been told it's a constant fistfight, a lot of lost money and almost not economically justifiable anymore.

Somehow they do just fine in electronics. Look at mobile phones and computer parts. Mostly China and Taiwan and quality is quite good.

I suspect you can get the same quality in China as you can anywhere assuming you're willing to pay for it. My guess is most choose the lowest bidder and you get what you pay for. Leaky coils.

Eric_32

hot rod said:

I doubt you could install a 100% made in America hydronic system? Also the tools to install it. And even companies you think are "All American" may be owned by offshore holding companies.

There needs to be global trade, but is needs to be a two way street. China needs to buy more than just Jeeps from the US.

Tough knowing Milwaukee Tool is now owned by the Chinese, although so far quality seems to be staying high.

This is just terrible news... to see another American company move ofshore..

My 10+ year old Hole Hawg just bit the dust. Something in the chuck sounds terrible when you press the trigger. I drilled up so many new houses with that thing I couldn't even begin to count. It owes me nothing.... So I went out and picked up a new one without hesitation. Less than two weeks.... It won't engage low speed.... only has high speed. Doesn't matter where the switch is positioned... The reverse switch is different on it also and seems much lower quality than the older drill. Going back for an exchange.

hot_rod

Closer to home.