Get rid of NATURAL GAS?

Tim McElwain

The condo complex that I live in is all gas! That being said we are being told that the gas has to go away. I requested from the office to burn coal and wood and they flipped out! Wonder what is the matter with them. After all hundreds of thousand have been over come and died from NATURAL GAS! IS THAT NOT TRUE?????

pecmsg

Let the law suites begin. 

realliveplumber

Its an agenda thats being pushed by people that don't know what they are talking about.

The people that do know what they are talking about better start talking pretty quick.

random12345

Can you explain a little more about your situation? I'm curious what they mean by "gas has to go away." They are going to tear out the gas lines, or just prevent new ones from being connected when new condos are built? What state are you located in?

Mad Dog_2

Timmie...Unfortunately, we are going to have to let them FALL ON THEIR FACES! Politicians (vast majority) don't really listen to us about ANYTHING...They are always the "smartest men in the room."  What would we actually know???  Go ahead, lock the gas cocks off,  ban #2 Fuel oil, and coal..of course  evil coal!  When the grid blows out and frys from massive amperage draw on inadequate transmission lines, and people are freezing 🥶 to death in their own homes, Hospitals 🏥 with inadequate and  no heat, their folly will be exposed. The American people will then see..probably too late.....this is Too Utopian too fast...Mad Dog 🐕 🤣 

fentonc

Without reference to locations, timelines and actual numbers, this is just a 'politics' thread. Where's your condo located? What's the current gas usage? What is your current electric service rated for?

kcopp

Timmie is in Rhode Island. Is this LP or Natural?

Steamhead

@Tim McElwain , what do they propose to replace the gas with? When do they propose to do it?

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes

I think Berkeley was the first city to ban gas in new construction. Other cities have followed. Pretty soon, they will ban gas replacement appliances, boilers and water heaters.

What's coming? Heat pumps and electric appliances.

If you're young and in the gas trades, consider other options to transition to as gas goes away.

I love working with gas, but it's time has come.

Erin Holohan Haskell

fentonc said:

Without reference to locations, timelines and actual numbers, this is just a 'politics' thread. Where's your condo located? What's the current gas usage? What is your current electric service rated for?

Thank you. Well said.

Please respect site rules and leave the politics out of it.

ChrisJ

Well.

There's another reason not to live in an apartment whether you buy it or not

retiredguy

@Tim McElwain; I was overcome by a commercial rusted out, poor burning, natural gas furnace in a commercial warehouse, once in 40+ years of servicing coal, nat gas, propane, fuel oil, and electric units. I am so glad that the moron politicians finally heard my "cry for help" and have decided to ban these very dangerous gas burning devices. They have their heads so far up their butts that they will never have one serious rational thought that makes any sense.

Lord, please help us!

WMno57

fentonc said:

Without reference to locations, timelines and actual numbers, this is just a 'politics' thread.

To an older homeowner who may be coasting into his golden years in his retirement home, telling him he has to rip out a perfectly good gas furnace or boiler, IT'S NOT JUST POLITICS. Especially when the homeowner has had a long career in the Natural Gas Industry.
I am curious as to the details of how the Condo Board intends to force this De-Gasification. Perhaps @Tim McElwain will share those details with us at some point. Hopefully he won't be put off by a few cancel culture Wallies who try to silence others by waiving the "No Politics" flag anytime a viewpoint different than theirs comes along.
@Erin Holohan Haskell This is your site. As a Libertarian, I will be first in line to point out the First Amendment does not apply to you and your site which is your private property. You can regulate speech on your site however you like. However you may wish to consider how you plan for your site to go forward in a Heating and Energy world where politics now touches everything. I suspect your objective is to prevent arguing between Wallies which makes the Wall a less fun place to hang out. Perhaps "No Politics" can evolve into "Be Polite, and no Disrespect to fellow Wallies"?

ChrisJ

@WMno57 I have never seen Erin or Dan interfere when a political discussion remained polite and kind.

However, such threads are extremely rare.

99 times out of 100 they turn into a "Your side is ruining my country" arguments.

GGross

WMno57 said:

fentonc said:

Without reference to locations, timelines and actual numbers, this is just a 'politics' thread.

To an older homeowner who may be coasting into his golden years in his retirement home, telling him he has to rip out a perfectly good gas furnace or boiler, IT'S NOT JUST POLITICS. Especially when the homeowner has had a long career in the Natural Gas Industry.
I am curious as to the details of how the Condo Board intends to force this De-Gasification. Perhaps @Tim McElwain will share those details with us at some point. Hopefully he won't be put off by a few cancel culture Wallies who try to silence others by waiving the "No Politics" flag anytime a viewpoint different than theirs comes along.
@Erin Holohan Haskell This is your site. As a Libertarian, I will be first in line to point out the First Amendment does not apply to you and your site which is your private property. You can regulate speech on your site however you like. However you may wish to consider how you plan for your site to go forward in a Heating and Energy world where politics now touches everything. I suspect your objective is to prevent arguing between Wallies which makes the Wall a less fun place to hang out. Perhaps "No Politics" can evolve into "Be Polite, and no Disrespect to fellow Wallies"?

This post is just an off topic political discussion though, nobody is even disagreeing with the OP, but it is off topic and there already public forums to discuss those topics. Facebook, Twitter, reddit etc. Personally I am extremely put off by the recent rise in totally off topic political posts that don't even discuss a heating or cooling system. It doesn't mean I even disagree with what the person is posting, it just is not the place to post it

FStephenMasek

The results of the elections in 2024 will determine if this bizarre and evil foolishness continues, or is stopped. That is not long from now, so the best thing to do now is nothing, other than vote properly, and support candidates who are opposed to this vile foolishness. I'll think about this thread when I fire-up my AMG GLE 63S this morning .

ChrisJ

FStephenMasek said:

The results of the elections in 2024 will determine if this bizarre and evil foolishness continues, or is stopped. That is not long from now, so the best thing to do now is nothing, other than vote properly, and support candidates who are opposed to this vile foolishness. I'll think about this thread when I fire-up my AMG GLE 63S this morning .

And there it is.............................

See @WMno57 ?

Now that a grenade has dropped watch the thread turn into a war.

WMno57

@ChrisJ, this thread doesn't have to turn into a war.
I do think the OP @Tim McElwain, given his contributions to this site has every right to post here about his home. I believe he is entitled to share his feelings about what is going on with his home and his condo board.
There are a couple Wallies who love to throw the "No Politics" flag whenever a viewpoint they don't agree with is presented. Since they only throw this flag when viewpoints of one side of the political spectrum are presented, they're hypocrites.
Cancel culture is a crutch for those who don't have the brain cells to have a reasoned conversation about difficult topics. If someone has a different opinion than I on something, great, I'll still listen to their thoughts. If they can't communicate, learn how.
It may surprise some here to know that I sometimes listen to (gasp) NPR. Opposition research.

FStephenMasek said:

I'll think about this thread when I fire-up my AMG GLE 63S this morning .

Nice ride! But only eight cylinders?
How about a backup ride for inclement weather? A beater with a heater.
A friend of mine has this for sale. You need a V12!
https://franksclassiccars.com/inventory/1995-mercedes-benz-sl600-red-roadster-6-0l-389hp-v12-engine/
What will it take to get you behind the wheel?

The Steam Whisperer

AS I've said many times already, the hard numbers just don't seem to work for an all electric HVAC. We simply don't have the grid or generating capacity, especially if you also add in electric cars. It took over 100 years to build the current grid, how long will it take to make it about 6 to 8 times the current capacity to meet both HVAC and electric vehicle needs? In the shorter term, we can spend a fraction of the cost and improve existing systems and buildings to achieve 30 to 40% reductions in building emissions to help reverse environmental impacts and save a bunch of money of HVAC costs. Even if electricity can be made without dangerous levels of pollution, just baseloading with electric to cover about 1/2 of peak design loads will reduce direct fossil fuel burning by about 90%. I am really interested to see what happens in 100% heat pump heated buildings in Chicago, when we get a week of -20F temperatures. The COP will drop to about 1, so you'll have to figure enough electrical capacity as though you are heating with electric resistance only.

ChrisJ

The Steam Whisperer said:

AS I've said many times already, the hard numbers just don't seem to work for an all electric HVAC. We simply don't have the grid or generating capacity, especially if you also add in electric cars. It took over 100 years to build the current grid, how long will it take to make it about 6 to 8 times the current capacity to meet both HVAC and electric vehicle needs? In the shorter term, we can spend a fraction of the cost and improve existing systems and buildings to achieve 30 to 40% reductions in building emissions to help reverse environmental impacts and save a bunch of money of HVAC costs. Even if electricity can be made without dangerous levels of pollution, just baseloading with electric to cover about 1/2 of peak design loads will reduce direct fossil fuel burning by about 90%. I am really interested to see what happens in 100% heat pump heated buildings in Chicago, when we get a week of -20F temperatures. The COP will drop to about 1, so you'll have to figure enough electrical capacity as though you are heating with electric resistance only.

A week of -20F?
You're talking about Chicago and not Anchorage or International Falls correct?

Erin Holohan Haskell

For those who are wondering, here's where we stand on political discussions:

In the 26 years we've been running this forum, we've seen how quickly political discussions can turn into nasty arguments. A few years ago, we opened up a category called the Politics of Heating thinking we'd try again to have respectful dialogue on these important heating-related topics. It didn't take long for arguments/name calling to begin, though, so we dropped the category.

Occasionally we'll let a discussion that's bordering on politics continue if it's respectful and related to our industry, but we've found that these discussions often go off topic into issues that are entirely political and unrelated to heating. Even in this thread, people are being called hypocrites and off-topic political subjects like immigration are being brought up. When this happens, we have to close the discussion because it's unproductive, polarizing, and unrelated to our mission here.

We've built something different on Heating Help with the focus on HVAC education and helping one another. Political arguments not only distract from that and make this an unpleasant place to be, but they also threaten our family business.

Please respect our site rules and keep your political opinions to yourself. Thank you.