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Boiler losing water

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Comments

  • General
    General Member Posts: 120
    Froze???
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
    It's a Slant Finn. They are one of the better companies for customer service/Product support. Let's continue to hope it's just the skim pipe though.
  • General
    General Member Posts: 120
    We are going to attempt to take off the side and top to see if we can tell where it is leaking....there isn't much space
  • j a_2
    j a_2 Member Posts: 1,801
    Post a pic. and be a little more descriptive…It is not uncommon at all for a boiler section to leak…but your description is unclear…at least to me….Truth be told warranties are not all there cracked up to be….Installed by, service records, are just couple of questions they will ask…..Hope its just a fitting...
    Patchogue Phil_2
  • General
    General Member Posts: 120
    It has been cleaned every year since 2006 by the same company that installed.....trying to get pics to load
  • General
    General Member Posts: 120
    Heres 1
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
    Can't tell anything from that pic. you're going to have to get behind that panel and take a close-up of the actual source of the leak.
  • General
    General Member Posts: 120
    They are trying but might not be possible without taking off piping...
  • General
    General Member Posts: 120
    No....its not any of the 3 fittings....cant post any pics that you would be able to see anything....
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 16,231
    Fred said:

    ChrisJ said:

    Even if the block is damaged I'd say slim chance of warranty replacement.

    From what I've heard they will use any excuse under the sun to deny replacement and the fact something froze automatically voids it.

    Nothing froze on this boiler. That was another thread :)
    Oh.

    I'm sorry. :(
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • General
    General Member Posts: 120
    Could only get side and front panel away a few inches..Husband says its dripping somewhere between the tankless coil and the heat exchanger.
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
    Maybe it the gasket around where the the coil mounts that's leaking. That would be good also. (Well not as good as not having a problem but so much better than the block leaking).
  • General
    General Member Posts: 120
    Ha....that was my husbands suggestion after looking at the diagram. So, I am thinking of calling slant fin for a pro recommendation? Not going back with the knucklehead....
    what would you suggest?
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 16,231
    Personally, i wouldn't put much faith in what Slant Fin has to say.

    Where are you located? Perhaps we can recommend someone we all trust.
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • General
    General Member Posts: 120
    That would be great..but SE Michigan
    There is problemsolver in detroit area. He is about an hour away...said he would consult and we could talk price. That would be ok but sure would like to get some one closer.
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
    Actually, if it's the gasket, any good plumber should be able to replace that as long as someone stays with him/her to make sure they don't touch anything else on the boiler. (I always stay with anybody I call for any type of services anyway, LOL, you learn a lot of the tricks of the trades that way)
    I would order the gasket so that you have it on hand when service is scheduled.
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 16,231
    For something like this I would go with someone who knows their stuff without a doubt.

    It's too much money and too much work to play around with.
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 16,231
    edited March 2015
    Ok, maybe I missed some of the conversation. I've been doing that a lot lately. And confusing different threads.

    If it's just the gasket or a basic repair by all means use someone closer. But if you're getting a new boiler go with someone you know is good.

    :)
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • General
    General Member Posts: 120
    That makes sense....but what would that do to the warranty? And what f I call a plumber and it turns out to be the heat exchanger? So....do I get a plumber or find a pro?
  • General
    General Member Posts: 120
    Another question....would too much pressure cause the gasket to fail? If so, I might want to get the knucklehead back over here.
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 16,231
    General said:

    Another question....would too much pressure cause the gasket to fail? If so, I might want to get the knucklehead back over here.

    Sure,
    But I doubt anything under 50 to 100 PSI or so would. Unless the gasket was in really bad shape to begin with.
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
    General
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
    Replacing a gasket for the coil isn't going to affect the warranty. The coil and gasket are not considered a part of the boiler block/heat exchanger. It is always good to have a relationship with a Steam Pro that you can trust. The question is do you want to try to find one now or when you can take your time. We already know Steam resources, for whatever reason, seem to be scarce in Michigan. There is a good, very good possibility, that it is that gasket and good plumbers are much easier to come by.
    Could too much pressure cause a gasket to fail? It probably could but you have no way of proving it. Gaskets sometimes fail like any other part. I have a plate that covers the opening for a coil on my boiler with a gasket to seal it. That gasket failed several years ago and I replaced it and keep a spare just in case.
    In any case, I wouldn't reward a Knucklehead with any repeat business unless I was desperate and planned to stay with him the entire time.
    General
  • General
    General Member Posts: 120
    Good point Fred.....I have a plumber that I will call in the morning. I guess I had better start researching for a steam pro more fervently just in case. The knowledge on the wall is invaluable (as i'm sure you have been told). What started out last Fall with the knucklehead replacing the low water cut which somehow led me to searching online and finding heating help.com because something just didn't seem right and has now helped me to find a leak that I would have never, and I mean never ever thought I could find. When I told my husband I was going to overfill the boiler today he couldn't believe it. When it started leaking, I got his attention...then he and my brother took over. Thanks Fred and Chris for all of the time you spent on this. I'll keep you posted....
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
    edited March 2015
    You're more than welcome and we do want an update.
  • General
    General Member Posts: 120
    Definitely!
  • vaporvac
    vaporvac Member Posts: 1,520
    There used to be a pro named @Ban that I think was from Detroit, but I don't know exactly where. If you post a pm, he'll receive an email. Or maybe search through his posts. Colleen
    Two-pipe Trane vaporvacuum system; 1466 edr
    Twinned, staged Slantfin TR50s piped into 4" header with Riello G400 burners; 240K lead, 200K lag Btus. Controlled by Taco Relay and Honeywell RTH6580WF
  • nicholas bonham-carter
    nicholas bonham-carter Member Posts: 8,578
    First be sure that the sections are leaking, and then talk to the local distributor. It would help if you were able to have the original installer make the warranty request.--NBC
  • General
    General Member Posts: 120
    @vaporvac ...I actually talked to ban on the phone. He is a homeowner and also has a few buildings with steam that he manages by himself. He doesnt know of a good steam pro.
    @nicholas bonham-carter ...that would mean I would have the same knucklehead that jacked up the pressure, thinks copper is ok, dumps in chemicals and on and on.....should I really have him back?
  • General
    General Member Posts: 120
    @Fred .....Have a guy coming on Friday that answered all the questions correctly thanks to all who told me what to ask. Hopefully I don't have to show him the door...will let you know.
  • j a_2
    j a_2 Member Posts: 1,801
    Me. I don't suggest running any boiler with a leak Especially if its a unknown leak....Accomplish a hydrostatic check or have one done....Also if you are so inclined add a dye like food coloring to the boiler and reflood it. Get a good strong flashlight and wait and watch
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
    The HO already knows the boiler was installed by a knucklehead installer and that the near boiler piping is all wrong. At the moment they are trying to take care of a leak, that appears to be a leaking gasket around the HW coil. The HO and I are both hopeful that that is the case and once that is resolved, they can take care of the near boiler piping, when priorities allow.
    They are losing less than a half pint of water over a 24 hour period and, at this time of the year, suggesting a HO do without heat probably isn't an option. They just need to be vigilent about checking the boiler until this Friday when they have a tech out to verify the problem and hopefully resolve it.
    General
  • General
    General Member Posts: 120
    It is actually around 50 and should be for the week..68 in house and boiler hasnt been on all day. That is like summer to us!
  • General
    General Member Posts: 120
    edited March 2015
    We have the appointment tomorrow with the "pro" (at least I hope he's a pro). This morning, I heard the low water kick on so went running into the basement to see how low the water actually got in order to trigger the LWCO. The water in the sight glass had barely went down before it called for water. It definitely was not down to the point where it should have kicked in. How do I check it or at least sound knowledgeable about it when the guy gets there tomorrow.....
    The LWCO with auto feed is only a few months old.
  • BobC
    BobC Member Posts: 5,495
    Is there a lot of bouncing going on when making steam? Post a picture showing where that LWCO is located on the boiler in relation to the sight glass.

    Bob
    Smith G8-3 with EZ Gas @ 90,000 BTU, Single pipe steam
    Vaporstat with a 12oz cut-out and 4oz cut-in
    3PSI gauge
  • General
    General Member Posts: 120
    There is very little movement when the steam is on. There are some pics on page 1 of this thread that you can see where the sight glass and LWCO are. If the pics are not good enough, let me know and I can post some others when I get home tonight.
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
    It is possible the LWCO probe needs to be taken out and cleaned. Also, make sure the probe that goes into the boiler block doesn't have teflon tape on the threads. The probe has to ground well against the block. I'd simply ask the guy (once you determine he has good steam knowledge) to clean the probe and check the LWCO as it seems to trip on low water when it shouldn't. Are you sure it tripped on Low water?
    General
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 16,231
    edited March 2015
    How low does the level get while steaming?
    It's possible your water isn't getting back fast enough, the LWCO trips, adds water and before you know it she's overfilled.

    I've also seen wet steam cause a similar problem because a lot of your water ends out in the system where it doesn't belong and then slowly comes back after the boiler shuts down.

    I guess what I'm saying is, are you 100% sure the level didn't actually end up low while the boiler was running and just returned by the time you got down there?
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
    General
  • General
    General Member Posts: 120
    @Fred , I will make sure that he checks the LWCO and probe. I am not sure that low water tripped it but it's not that far from the kitchen upstairs (when I heard it come on) to the basement where the boiler is but having said that...I guess I can't be 100% sure of where the water level was when it started to fill. What would be the harm if I started letting water out slowly to see when it actually trips?
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 16,231
    General said:

    @Fred , I will make sure that he checks the LWCO and probe. I am not sure that low water tripped it but it's not that far from the kitchen upstairs (when I heard it come on) to the basement where the boiler is but having said that...I guess I can't be 100% sure of where the water level was when it started to fill. What would be the harm if I started letting water out slowly to see when it actually trips?

    None, just make sure you boil the fresh water as soon as possible.
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
    What would be the harm if I started letting water out slowly to see when it actually trips?
    That sounds like a plan.

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