Augusta Stone Church
This post is a continuation from an earlier post this year:
I was contacted by Scott (@karsthuntr) about evaluating the steam system in this church. It’s the oldest Presbyterian church in Virginia, founded in 1740.
The steam system was installed during a renovation in 1920. The current Burnham was installed about 8 years ago and it was a chop and drop by another contractor. It’s probably the third boiler since the system was added, the original being coal.
There are numerous issues and mistakes that have been made over the years. It’s a simple one pipe system.
Issue # 1. The boiler is severely oversized. The rating is for 2021 square feet, but the connected radiation is 882 square feet. Compounding that is the fact that it was split into two zones with the smaller one having less than 200 square feet. Some radiators have been removed and two large indirect rads have been disabled.
It appears that the system was split into two zones when the boiler that was previous to the this one was done. It was an attempt to heat the smaller office areas without heating the large auditorium. Again, less than 200 square feet of radiation.
Issue #2. The near boiler piping is wrong.
As can be seen, the equalizer is tapped out of the middle of the header and only one riser (3”) is utilized coming from the boiler. The header is also trapping water at a low spot on the left due to the misplaced equalizer.
This last pic shows where the small zone was once tapped into the 6” main where it’s now capped.
Issue #3. The dry return piping.
Notice how the 2” return pipe in the opening has been recently replaced with three 1-1/4” flexible lines.
I’ve never seen anything like this done and I told the church that the lines had to be at the proper height with the proper pitch and no traps or sagging. They tried to straighten them, but I think that I’m gonna recommend doing it over with iron pipe. There’s also another return from the small zone behind the boiler. It’s still iron.
Issue #4. The condensate pump.
The boiler is currently not running because the pump is bad and not putting water back in the boiler. Someone recently replaced the motor, but the pump is bad.
The copper line on the left is the vent and the one one the right is the fill line connected to a VXT controlled by the LWCO. I’ve never seen that done before with a condensate pump.
This pump holds under 10 gallons and I’m questioning whether it’s needed. Please give me some input guys.
If it’s needed to hold excess condensate, it will get set back up as a feed pump. I believe it was added when the previous boiler was done and the system split into two zones.
Issue #5. Traps and venting.
I believe the two return traps were also added when the system was split into two zones and therefore I see no need for them if the system is returned to one zone.
Issue #6. Firing rate
The rating tag calls for a 5.6 gph nozzle, but the burner has 3.0 gph nozzle. That’s within the burner’s range, but I doubt if Burnham would approve.
Professional advice and recommendations are welcome, please.
You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.
Comments
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one pipe and zoning usually don't get along with each other.
calling that a "header" is very generous
i bet the condensate pump does not need to exist
2 boilers would probably work better and cost about the same as making the 2 zones work although how much less than 200 ft^2 is important here since the smallest steam boilers are around 250 ft^2
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I agree. Here's where we did something similar many years ago:
Baltimore, MD, USA
Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
Oil & Gas Burner Service
Consulting1 -
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I don’t care how many square feet of EDR are in the building… it is a church, and it needs a church-sized boiler. And zone valves are most important. It is a church, for God’s sake. Get it? God’s sake.
But on a serious note, if you are confident about the actual EDR of the building and you can fit two very small boilers in there, that is probably the best way to do it properly. Just make sure there are no hidden rooms with hidden radiators. Remember, it is a church, after all.
Perhaps you can sell the old boiler on a site like Heating Help, Craigslist, or eBay. It is not going to cover the cost of the replacement job, but it could help a little.
A moving company, freight company, or rigging company may cost more than the boiler itself in order to make the sale practical. Still, there is probably someone out there who needs a boiler that size.
Edward Young Retired
After you make that expensive repair and you still have the same problem, What will you check next?
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Imagine 120 years BEFORE the civil war.
Are you replacing the boiler or trying to make that one work? I am guessing the returns in the crawl space rotted out and they used hoses?
The biggest headache is to decide what to do about zoning or not zoning. Until that question is solved you can't really decide anything else.
I would suspect like all churches they don't want to keep the church that warm when unoccupied.
Most steam systems with a boiler feed tank put the MU water into the feed tank and not the boiler. i guess that is what they were trying for but that little tank is hardly a feed tank.
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They’ve been using electric heaters in the secretary and pastor’s offices for a while and are happy doing that. There’s really nothing else on the small zone that would be used when there’s no church service. So, tying the two zones together makes sense.
A dual zone mini split could be added for those offices to replace the electric heaters.
Bob Boan
You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.0 -
Not a pro — so no comment except… mercy.
Br. Jamie, osb
Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England0 -
That is an avenger level repair. Turn on the bat light and we will be on our way to help
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I heard from Beckett today and they said that the boiler could be down fired to 3.25 gph @ 140 psi = 3.85 gph, 539,000 btus. That’s still twice the size needed (265,000).
I’m looking at removing this beast and installing a Megasteam MST892 which would be a precise match to the radiation and maybe less in cost than fixing this nightmare.
Bob Boan
You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.4 -
is that boiler that is there now the manufacturer and series that kind of has a habit of developing premature holes in the hx above the water line?
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Please do not yell;
I am speaking here as a homeowner with a coal fired boiler heating system and paraphrasing what Brother Jamie has said "Mercy Me, YUCK!!!!!!!!!!"
As you are in an area where Anthracite rice coal can be obtained easily, your heating system can be upgraded with a dual fuel EFM DF520 coal stoker set up for steam heating with some work and reconnect/replace the missing radiators to replace that abomination in my opinion as a lay person.
The EFM DF520 coal stoker boiler has a 3 inch tapping in the steam chest and two 2 inch returns for hydronic heating.
Again I am speaking as a homeowner having grown up with one pipe steam heat; a 3 inch double header coming off the riser in the steam chest makes a great deal more sense with that mess as the 3 inch drop header transitioning to a 4 inch header pipe then rising to meet the existing piping would make much more sense and allow the entire church to be heated eliminating all that excess piping and making a cleaner installation.
You apparently have at least 24 inches in open space above the existing boiler for a double drop header with a drain back to the boiler Hartford loop so it would be an ideal installation to create very dry steam.
The EFM DF520 can be equipped with a dual fuel heating system where I believe natural gas can be the dual fuel used rather than oil.
I am making the popcorn with olive oil and will pass it around here as I wait and see what happens next.
It may be well worth the phone call to EFM in Emmaus, Pa and ask about adding a second riser to the DF520 boiler to increase the steam output more quickly to a double drop header to replace that mess.
Please do not yell.
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@leonz , one would need to check local regulations to see if coal-fired boilers have been outlawed due to air pollution. I know in Baltimore they are prohibited, and have been since the late 1960s.
Baltimore, MD, USA
Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
Oil & Gas Burner Service
Consulting1 -
Dear Mr. Boan, the Anthracite coal stoker boilers and furnaces burn cleanly with no smoke and create very high heat per pound of Rice Anthracite Coal. I wish we had access to more friable Sub Bituminous coal from Wyoming or Montana as these coals provide clean heat with very little ash.
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one of my high school teachers said that before natural gas came to the city i grew up in in 1950 the snow would turn gray within 24 hours of it snowing from the coal.
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@leonz
Im glad that burning coal works for you, but am I to understand that you’re suggesting that as a mechanical contractor I should attempt to sell this as a viable solution to the church? Do you really think that they would want to have to have a coal bin installed, find a coal supplier, have someone be there at least twice a day to shovel coal, and put up with the mess that it would create?Bob Boan
You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.3 -
With an auger fed coal stoker there is no labor other than changing ash baskets.
I mentioned the coal stoker boiler as an option as a hedge against higher fuel costs as it has an auger feed system feeding a burn pot/tuyere. You would have read about it in the file I uploaded.
I mentioned it because it also has a dual fuel option where you simply open the door covering the nozzle and electrodes inside the burner tube to use the gas or oil burner.
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