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I need some help choosing reliable boiler replacement

Harold
Harold Member Posts: 249
edited February 2021 in Radiant Heating
This is an ongoing saga of why I just can not keep boilers working. And what I should select as a new boiler. Results so far for a boiler around 2005.

1 - Boiler installed - house works.
2 - First boiler eats itself. New boiler core replaced under warranty.
3 - Second boiler core fails. Core has to be replaced because it leaks.
4 - Surprise - now core leaks again. A replacement is installed.
5 - Fed up with the process - new boiler. Significant money added to accumulated costs for things that should just work.
8 - New boiler. Different boiler vendor. Works nicely.
9 - Two days ago - yet another lack of operational boiler. Core leaks. This is a SS core. It should, in my mind, last rather longer.

This is getting very old.

The whole thing is just crazy. This should not be a relatively short term function followed by failure.

I need a boiler with:
10:1 control
Reliable lifetime
Control of attached devices - DHW and system flow
Understandable documentation - not a problem for installers, but it could be better documented for civilian understanding.


Can some of the experienced people here provide some recommendations for a new boiler replacement. There are so many alternatives. And many poor choices available for reliability and durability. I just can't digest all the possible alternatives for a functional boiler.

We are having the lowest temperatures for the year (around the 20's). It is getting really chilly. I can deal with it, but my wife is not well. Heat matters.

Please provide real evaluations for the brand names. I have to pick the new boiler really soon. I just can't do it by myself.

Comments

  • kcopp
    kcopp Member Posts: 3,997
    Wow.
    Tell us more about your system.... What fuel type? City or well water? Is there any Non O2 barrier tubing in your system?
    geno907
  • Robert_25
    Robert_25 Member Posts: 410
    Something else is wrong.  Poor water quality, leaks and lots of makeup water, etc.
    geno907
  • pecmsg
    pecmsg Member Posts: 2,955
    edited February 2021
    Where is this located
    High or low temperature emitters
    What's the heat loss calculations and boiler output
    How much make up water is introduced, monthly


  • Jamie Hall
    Jamie Hall Member Posts: 19,154
    @kcopp and @Robert_25 nailed it. Something else is causing your boiler failures -- most likely either poor water quality, leaks causing excess water use, oxygen getting into the system -- and no treatment. You'l need to do a much more thorough investigation as to the cause if you don't want to keep treating the symptom (the boiler failures are a symptom of another problem)
    Br. Jamie, osb
    Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England
    bucksnortgeno907
  • Ironman
    Ironman Member Posts: 6,893
    You need to get a COMPETENT HYDRONIC pro out there, not just someone who replaces things.

    As others have stated: your problem lies beyond the boiler.

    Try the contractor locator above.
    Bob Boan
    You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.
    bucksnort
  • Harold
    Harold Member Posts: 249
    Boiler is Propane. Well water with sentinel. PEX under floors, Copper piping in boiler room.

    Water addition very low.

    System was working fine. I heard some gurgling and added water. Pressure gauge at zero next day. Major gurgling and loss of water. Water dripping from drain of boiler.

    The person doing the work is competent. I have used him from day one of putting in the heating system. I trust his work. He is looking for a replacement. Finding a boiler is being difficult - everything back ordered.

    When replaced I will flush everything and refill with protection. I will flush with cleaner and protectant. I may not have gotten everything flushed. The configuration is a bit complicated for flushing.

    However, what I need right now is selecting a new boiler.

    The contractor found a Bosch and a Triangle. I have selected the Bosch. Both of us will together drain, refill, treat. We will make sure here is not a missed area of water.

    Thanks for you participation.

  • DZoro
    DZoro Member Posts: 1,048
    All the guys above hit on many key items. Each one of those items mentioned are very important part of longevity of a boiler system.
    There are different types of pex tubing, which do you have?
    Your water must be tested, in order for a guaranteed longevity of your system. Remember this is a system and not just a boiler. Each part and contents of the system must work together, or failures will result.
    If your not checking all the items then your guessing. Guessing is very expensive in the boiler world.
    Either boiler will serve you fine if they get along with the rest of the system. Water, pex, copper, oxygen control, non ferrous, items, pumps (sizes), air eliminators, Iron elimination, pressure leak checked system, on and on. All need to be checked for conformity within your system.
    Once again both are good boilers when installed properly with good components within the system.
    D
  • pecmsg
    pecmsg Member Posts: 2,955
    6 boilers in 16 years................Its not the Boiler!

    In refrigeration we have a saying "Compressors don't die, there Murdered" That's also true for Boilers!
    CanuckerDZoroSuperTech
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 12,153
    If you don't know why the other boilers failed then the replacement is doomed to fail.

    Bosch with an aluminum HX may not be the best choice
    kcoppDZorobucksnortSuperTech
  • kcopp
    kcopp Member Posts: 3,997

    If you don't know why the other boilers failed then the replacement is doomed to fail.

    Bosch with an aluminum HX may not be the best choice

    I totally concur...
    bucksnort
  • Harold
    Harold Member Posts: 249
    I came here for help in selecting a replacement boiler. I had two days to choose. I got no useful information here to select a boiler. Now I get 2 comments after getting no actual assistance. We found (the contractor and I) a very limited boiler availability. The boiler I got is the Bosch HX.

    Thanks.
  • pecmsg
    pecmsg Member Posts: 2,955
    I’m sorry but I see several comments and there all basically the same. “Find out why there failing”

    What did the installing contractor do to find the cause of the failure?
  • Jamie Hall
    Jamie Hall Member Posts: 19,154
    Harold said:

    I came here for help in selecting a replacement boiler. I had two days to choose. I got no useful information here to select a boiler. Now I get 2 comments after getting no actual assistance. We found (the contractor and I) a very limited boiler availability. The boiler I got is the Bosch HX.

    Thanks.

    Two days? Two moths might have been a more seemly time frame, unless it was a straight out emergency. Further, you did get carefully thought out and considered information. Which, however, you have chosen to ignore.
    Br. Jamie, osb
    Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England
    bucksnortCanucker
  • bucksnort
    bucksnort Member Posts: 160
    Harold said:

    Boiler is Propane.

    .

    The person doing the work is competent. I have used him from day one of putting in the heating system. I trust his work. He is looking for a replacement. Finding a boiler is being difficult - everything back ordered.



    Sorry, but i disagree. What you have is a parts changer that is more than happy to replace failed equipment well before it needs to be. I would order a spare right now so in 2 years you won't have to worry about any back orders of equipment.
  • Harold
    Harold Member Posts: 249
    I chose to ask one simple question - best boiler. Nothing else. Just that. Dealing with other things - not requested. Responses useless in choosing a boiler. Great information about stuff not working - but not the question.

    My problem only had a limited timeline. Boilers have been scarce. House was without heat. My wife is quite sick and the house must be heated in any case. Snowed in today (looks like over 12" on a couple of steep uncleared roads). Fortunately we got the new boiler in yesterday. A side note - the contractor reference. Worked with me while designing the house and installed pretty much every appropriate system from our house. I can only say he is highly skilled and an excellent responsive contractor. I felt there was some sort of demeaning of the contractor on this thread. Any failures are my responsibility.

    I would suggest when answering someone's question here it should absolutely include answering the REQUESTED QUESTION. Then you could include and share experiences that may be useful.

    Jamie - I respect the information people were presenting. But they completely failed to provide the requested information. I have not chosen to ignore the people posting here. I have respected the people on this site for many years. But I just (and only) needed the information on selecting the best boiler.

    I rather find the behaviour of ignoring the answer to the requested information and going somewhere else a disservice to users (like me).
    bucksnortBillyOSuperTech
  • Jamie Hall
    Jamie Hall Member Posts: 19,154
    I appreciate -- and understand -- your annoyance, @Harold . Had I known -- which was unclear -- that you were facing a genuine emergency no heat situation, I would have answered very differently. The question "what can I do today to get some heat into this place yesterday" is very very different from "what is a reliable boiler replacement", as I'm sure you would agree.

    I think that the folks who provided the answers to which you object so vigorously were, in fact, doing a good job of answering the question which you posed. It just wasn't the question which you wanted answers to.
    Br. Jamie, osb
    Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England
    bucksnortCanucker
  • pecmsg
    pecmsg Member Posts: 2,955
    edited February 2021
    The installing contractor is the most important name to consider. 
    Think of a car delivered to your driveway in pieces. Would you still choose a Ford, Chevy Chrysler or the mechanic that has to assemble it!
  • DZoro
    DZoro Member Posts: 1,048
    Sorry, just trying to help, personally I'd install the Triangle Tube. Good Co. 15 years ago, then there parts were priced out of this world, Now they seem to be going back in the right direction. Main reason of my complaint with them was part pricing, but they seem to have corrected that issue. Overall it's a very solid boiler.
    D
  • Harold
    Harold Member Posts: 249
    I should not have started with my little story. My fault for that. Confused people. I should have made a simple - what boiler.

    MaxMercy
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 12,153
    @Harold

    You have to understand there is no "best boiler" none of them are perfect but should be chosen as best for the intended use.

    Also, you mentioned the # of boilers that have been installed ....and failed. This set up a red flag for any professional installer and it should for yours as well.

    Anyone installing a boiler after the previous boilers have had a large # of failures who isn't concerned as to why they failed is setting the customer up for .....................failure and isn't doing his job.


    So, now maybe you understand where all the questions are coming from. We are trying to get the whole story so as to make the correct recommendation
    DZoro
  • SuperTech
    SuperTech Member Posts: 1,792
    I know that you already have a new boiler installed and due to the urgency of the situation the time wasn't taken to determine the cause of the very premature failures of the previous boilers.  

    If reliability is the most important factor in determining your choice of boiler then I would recommend a cast iron boiler over a mod con.  Cast iron boilers are much less susceptible to some of the issues that plague mod cons and typically last 30 years or more when installed and maintained properly. Peerless and Weil Mclain make good cast iron boilers.  Energy Kinetics makes fantastic high efficiency non condensing and modulating condensing boilers. 

    I really think that the combined knowledge of the members of this site could help prevent you from experiencing these repeated boiler failures. What was the make and model of the the previous boilers? It would also be helpful if you could post a few pictures of your boiler and piping, perhaps something with the installation is leading to the failures that your contractor has missed.