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Navien Vent Blamed for CO Poisoning Deaths
On May 2nd a family of four was found dead in their home after a wellness check by the police. CO poisoning was suspected. This is near Sunbury Ohio, about 20 miles south of me. Today details of the investigation were reported by local news channels. Sadly, the signs of illness were there days prior to May 2nd but no one recognized them as exposure to high levels of carbon monoxide and there was no CO detector in the home.
The exhaust vent on the Navien heater came apart, leaking CO into the home. It had been installed recently by the homeowner who owned and operated a construction company.
Just days after this happened, a similar incident with a Navien vent happened in a neighboring county. Fortunately the family got medical help and survived.
https://www.10tv.com/article/water-heater-blame-carbon-monoxide-deaths-genoa-township-family-investigation-finds-2019-may
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Comments
You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.
"Reducing our country's energy consumption, one system at a time"
Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
Oil & Gas Burner Service
Baltimore, MD (USA) and consulting anywhere.
https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/all-steamed-up-inc
Minnich Hydronic Consulting & Design
Can't blame Navien if the equipment was not installed properly
Wilson Services, Inc
Northampton, MA
www.wilsonph.com
[email protected]
> Very sad.
> Can't blame Navien if the equipment was not installed properly
>
> Absolutely. The coincidence of two similar vent failures days apart and both by Navien was given more focus on the news than the fact that it was a self installation.
Any word if the construction guy might have installed the Navien in the neighboring county also? His wife's friends sister or something?
Seems a little isolated (2 in the same general area). And assuming no other incidents of that kind or recalls, then...
I'm not much for coincidences.
D
They are mandatory in Mass but are not wired to shut down the boiler or furnace. They can be battery. 1 located near the boiler and 1 on every other habitable level
A terrible and absolutely avoidable tragedy. This is why I have such an issue with the big box stores and online stores selling to people who have no licences. Hell, my local Home Depot sells CSST to anyone who wants to buy it. Talk about liability! and here we have no local inspector for the city, and one state inspector who inspects 7 COUNTIES. There is no way he alone can effectively police this stuff.
You could tie it into the low water cutoff or relay circuit on older equipment and new boilers can have a dedicated switch. Some like knight boilers have an extra set for verifying an outdoor louver has opened before it will fire
There are enough rules on the books, enforce what's there!
I can't believe how many houses I go to where the CO detectors are removed.
I wish the actual technical details of these cases were made public. There is a lot to be learned...
Albert Einstein
My mod-con uses PVC for air intake and for exhaust. I had several inspectors. The exhaust pipe and the intake pipe both hat purple primer on it, but the installation crew forgot to apply the cement after priming the pipe, so a year or so later, the exhaust pipe leaked so much condensate that it flooded the electronics control board. It took quite a while to figure out where the water was coming from. The inspector did not realize there was no glue used to connect the PVC pipe.
The CSST gas pipe was neither bonded nor grounded. It was in plain sight. The inspector checked nothing. He did get out of his car and looked at it.
Another inspector did not inspect where the condensate went. The contractor said there were only two ways to do it, and one inspector allowed only one way, and the other inspector allowed only the other way. So the contractor just ran it through the wall and dumped the condensate on the ground. That is not code around here. The contractor said he would wait for the inspector to fail it and ask the inspector how he wanted it done, and would then do it that way. The inspector never looked at where that pipe went.
I do not have much confidence in inspectors around here.
> They could design one with a set of normally open and closed contacts and if it reaches a set level it could close or open them.
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> You could tie it into the low water cutoff or relay circuit on older equipment and new boilers can have a dedicated switch. Some like knight boilers have an extra set for verifying an outdoor louver has opened before it will fire
>
> and in this Walmart society whos going to pay for it?
>
> There are enough rules on the books, enforce what's there!
While true, they aren't interested in enforcing. They just make more and more laws so people feel good.
If there is too much CO in the exhaust something is wrong with the boiler and it should be addressed. Too much CO is a sign of improper combustion, the boiler needs attention. Interlock the boiler with a error code.
I have found too many boilers with holes in the exhaust, especially boilers with aluminum H/E and exhaust drains. Thank goodness that the HO's have kept the covers on the boiler and those boilers killed themselves, via reinjection of it's own exhaust. But there is going to come a day that a HO will leave the cover off ( because the boiler runs better ), and the results are not going to be good.
I'm surprised the mfr's have not changed from the aluminum H/E.
They're well aware of the issues that there boilers are having. Seem to shrug their shoulders and say here is a new HE, we now put a coating on it.
PS make sure the HO has it cleaned regularly but don't use a brush or anything on it for 5 years...…
Well wow, then what after 5 years you don't care, go ahead and use a brush on the H/E.
It's a tragedy waiting to happen.
Police & Fire Equipment Lead Mechanic, NW WI
Lover of Old Homes & Gravity Hot Water Systems
"Reducing our country's energy consumption, one system at a time"
Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
Oil & Gas Burner Service
Baltimore, MD (USA) and consulting anywhere.
https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/all-steamed-up-inc
The homeowner doesn't wanna pay a competent contractor the $$ he gets for doing it right and performing a combustion analysis so he finds a distributor or big box store who will sell direct to him. Or, he finds the cheapest contractor he can who refuses to get proper training and won't purchase a combustion analyzer because "it's too expensive". The manufacture won't mandate that the distributor only sell to licensed contractors who have been certified on the equipment because neither wants to lose a sale, and so they sell it to any warm body that walks through the door. Then, just to make sure that they've covered the DIY market, the manufacturer sells it to the big box store, also.
It's greed and the ignorance that goes with it that caused these tragedies.
You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.