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A question for the professional heat installers

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invermont
invermont Member Posts: 73
edited January 2018 in THE MAIN WALL
I live in area where there are only two HVAC companies within 20 miles. There are a couple small time guys, but they don’t advertise. I believe my system is failing and just want someone to come give a consult and an estimate if need be. Called both companies, left message at one and talked to someone at the other and left address,name and number. No call backs in 3 days. I know people are busy this time of year, but what does it take to get someon e to come? Or at least call and say no. Do I have to beg? Should I call again or does that bother you guys. I don’t think my boiler will make it till spring. I just don’t know what to do if I can’t find someone. Keeps me awake at night causing a lot of stress.

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  • lchmb
    lchmb Member Posts: 2,997
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    Have you checked with your delivery company? Maybe they can offer suggestions on someone. I will say with the weather we've had if your not an emergency your on the back burner with smaller companies..they need to get the heat back on for people first...
    invermont
  • invermont
    invermont Member Posts: 73
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    I know my company has techs, but not sure how well they are trained. I fixed my boiler after he couldn’t figure it out and I barely know anything about heating systems. I will give them a call, maybe they know someone.
  • JUGHNE
    JUGHNE Member Posts: 11,062
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    Where are you located and why do you think your boiler will fail soon?

    Sometimes the small time guy who doesn't advertise doesn't have to, they have plenty of work that they want.
    .......Or they don't know they should.
  • Larry Weingarten
    Larry Weingarten Member Posts: 3,302
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    Hi, Hope I'm not being too obvious, but have you tried clicking on the button at the top of the page called find a contractor? ;)

    Yours, Larry
  • JohnNY
    JohnNY Member Posts: 3,230
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    What kind of system have you got ?
    Contact John "JohnNY" Cataneo, NYC Master Plumber, Lic 1784
    Consulting & Troubleshooting
    Heating in NYC or NJ.
    Classes
  • Robert_25
    Robert_25 Member Posts: 527
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    Where in VT?
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
    edited January 2018
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    Maybe some pics of the system, a discription, and the ability to provide more information as asked for will certainly lend you a couch for analysis here. If anything to educate yourself enough to weed out the unworthy.
    Rich_49
  • invermont
    invermont Member Posts: 73
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    JUGHNE said:

    Where are you located and why do you think your boiler will fail
    Manchester area in Vermont. Going over what I have to replace will be more than half what I paid for it. GB142.

  • invermont
    invermont Member Posts: 73
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    Larry Weingarten said:

    Hi, Hope I'm not being too obvious, but have you tried clicking on the button at the top of the page called find a contractor? ;)

    Yours, Larry

    I have, no one comes up
  • invermont
    invermont Member Posts: 73
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    Robert said:

    Where in VT?

    Manchester area
  • invermont
    invermont Member Posts: 73
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    Gordy said:

    Maybe some pics of the system, a discription, and the ability to provide more information as asked for will certainly lend you a couch for analysis here. If anything to educate yourself enough to weed out the unworthy.

    Here you go Gordy. I have been maintaining it myself fir a long while. Possible leak in boiler, fan is corroded from inhaling exhaust. How do you like the indirect tank tucked in the corner? Can’t replace the safety valve because it is so tight to the wall. Drips when water heats up because there is no expansion tank on the water line.
    L Thiesen
  • Jamie Hall
    Jamie Hall Member Posts: 23,317
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    I'm not a professional installer, not am I in Vermont any more. However, Vermont is where I learned the trade, decades ago. It was then, and still is, a difficult place to find really qualified people. They are out there, but the really good ones are really busy and tend to have long time client relationships. They are small -- often one man shops, or a family -- and honestly they don't need to advertise.

    Your best bet may be your oil delivery company, assuming that you have an ongoing relationship with them.
    Br. Jamie, osb
    Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England
  • Robert_25
    Robert_25 Member Posts: 527
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    I agree that the fuel company would be a good place to start. Your local.supply house may be another good resource.
  • kcopp
    kcopp Member Posts: 4,432
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    Rutland is just to the north.
    30 miles.
    I would look there.
    I can get names as I have family there still.
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
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    What type of emitters?
  • invermont
    invermont Member Posts: 73
    edited January 2018
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    Gordy said:

    What type of emitters?

    I don’t know the technical terminology. Emitter? I know how to ckean it. Ohm out bad sensors. The water end is what I don’t know. I’m not even sure how to fill it back up if I have to drain it. I also think it’s to big. 3100 square feet. 117 feet of copper fin. GB142. 60
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
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    Radiant heat
    Cast iron radiators
    Baseboard
  • invermont
    invermont Member Posts: 73
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    kcopp said:

    Rutland is just to the north.
    30 miles.
    I would look there.
    I can get names as I have family there still.

    That would be great Kcopp
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
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    Well that’s a nice match. 168 k output to 60k of radiation.....

    Does the house heat as desired?

    What are the water temps supplied to the radiation?
    Zman
  • Ironman
    Ironman Member Posts: 7,376
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    Gordy said:

    Well that’s a nice match. 168 k output to 60k of radiation.....

    Does the house heat as desired?

    What are the water temps supplied to the radiation?

    And it's split into 5 zones!

    No wonder the boiler has issues: it's short cycled itself to death.

    Bob Boan
    You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.
  • Jells
    Jells Member Posts: 566
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    Invermont you have my sympathies, I frequently joke that around here you can define a good contractor as someone who returns your call. And this is cold season from hell. One of the better ones just told me if my pipes aren't actually freezing they can't even put me on the schedule!
    invermont
  • Rich_49
    Rich_49 Member Posts: 2,766
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    Call Buderus . They are in Londonderry , NH . They may have the name of someone to nurse it through till spring . You may have to contact someone in NH , Mass or NY .

    In the spring I would look to replace with something of the Stainless Steel species and get rid of the Aluminum .

    Perform a room by room heat loss calc in the meantime to get the ball rolling .

    A nice HTP UFT boiler comes to mind . You could possibly need a unit up to 120k but I would suspect a 100 or 80 would more than likely be sufficient for your size house even if it is of poor construction ( air sealing , R value) .
    You didn't get what you didn't pay for and it will never be what you thought it would .
    Langans Plumbing & Heating LLC
    732-751-1560
    Serving most of New Jersey, Eastern Pa .
    Consultation, Design & Installation anywhere
    Rich McGrath 732-581-3833
  • invermont
    invermont Member Posts: 73
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    > @Gordy said:
    > Radiant heat
    > Cast iron radiators
    > Baseboard

    Copper fin baseboard
  • psb75
    psb75 Member Posts: 834
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    Still "cleaning up" after the long extended cold spell. We haven't had one like that in a while. People have gotten lazy and let their systems and infrastructure go slack. If there are weak spots in your actual hardware and your management/maintenance thereof--the cold will find you out!
    I have a pretty large customer base in a small area. One man show. Hard to keep up. Everything from limping systems to whole house freeze-ups. New installs in middle of "the season."
    Crazy.
    Manchester is a "ski area." No hydronics guys? Then Rutland is your best bet.
  • invermont
    invermont Member Posts: 73
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    > @Gordy said:
    > Radiant heat
    > Cast iron radiators
    > Baseboard

    Copper fin baseboard
  • Brewbeer
    Brewbeer Member Posts: 616
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    117 feet of fin tube baseboard radiators, they probably don't emit more than 60K or 70K BTUs. Unless you add more radiators/baseboards, you don't need a boiler larger than what the radiation can put out.
    Hydronics inspired homeowner with self-designed high efficiency low temperature baseboard system and professionally installed mod-con boiler with indirect DHW. My system design thread: http://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/154385
    System Photo: https://us.v-cdn.net/5021738/uploads/FileUpload/79/451e1f19a1e5b345e0951fbe1ff6ca.jpg
    Canuckerinvermont
  • invermont
    invermont Member Posts: 73
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    Gordy said:

    Well that’s a nice match. 168 k output to 60k of radiation.....

    Does the house heat as desired?

    What are the water temps supplied to the radiation?

    In real cold I believe it is 180. The house heats well. Insulated pretty good. Good windows. Most if the attic space is in the r60 range
  • invermont
    invermont Member Posts: 73
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    Just found another leak . Revision vent. Going to have to order one.
  • mikeg2015
    mikeg2015 Member Posts: 1,194
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    At 180f it’s no more efficient than a cast iron boiler that’s cheaper and lasts 2x longer with fewer parts. Water temps need to be under 150f supply to start to gain Effeciency. Small zones are less of an issue too with a CI boiler since they have some water capacity to work with. Only moving part is the flue damper and you can bypass that in open position if needed I’m an emergency.

    That thing is massively oversized. Probably why your wearing out so many parts.

    Time to look at downsizing and replacing it next season. If heat loss is 60k you want a 70-90k input boiler depending on water temps. But your h at loss is probably even smaller.
    invermont
  • kcopp
    kcopp Member Posts: 4,432
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    invermont said:

    kcopp said:

    Rutland is just to the north.
    30 miles.
    I would look there.
    I can get names as I have family there still.

    That would be great Kcopp
    Just sent you a PM.
  • invermont
    invermont Member Posts: 73
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    mikeg2015 said:

    At 180f it’s no more efficient than a cast iron boiler that’s cheaper and lasts 2x longer with fewer parts. Water temps need to be under 150f supply to start to gain Effeciency. Small zones are less of an issue too with a CI boiler since they have some water capacity to work with. Only moving part is the flue damper and you can bypass that in open position if needed I’m an emergency.



    That thing is massively oversized. Probably why your wearing out so many parts.



    Time to look at downsizing and replacing it next season. If heat loss is 60k you want a 70-90k input boiler depending on water temps. But your h at loss is probably even smaller.

    Can something like that be direct vented?
  • lchmb
    lchmb Member Posts: 2,997
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    maybe I should renew my Vt license..
    invermont
  • Jamie Hall
    Jamie Hall Member Posts: 23,317
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    lchmb said:

    maybe I should renew my Vt license..

    I still have mine -- haven't used it in years. But I was up recently to visit some and talking with some of the folks, and they tell me it ain't like it used to be. Particularly in the ski areas and around Burlington/Middlebury/Bennington. Not the same people at all...
    Br. Jamie, osb
    Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England
  • mikeg2015
    mikeg2015 Member Posts: 1,194
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    Yes. There are direct vent cast iron boilers. However a mod con sized right may still work just fine too. At worst, it might need a buffer tank. But some have larger turn down ratios now.

    But you need a good pro to get the pumping right and size it correctly.
    invermont
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
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    If the envelope heats well with 170awt I would do a room by room heat loss, and emitter survey.

    You may be able to drop the awt into condensing temps to gain full benefit of a mod/ con on those days less than design.

    invermontRich_49
  • lchmb
    lchmb Member Posts: 2,997
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    Plenty of different options on the market..but in your case I would be looking for service/parts available. So you really need to find the right local person/company and work with them. You can of course bring the info here and we can work with you to get the best bang for your buck... good luck...
    invermont

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