To those with more knowledge than myself, would you install a new gas or heating oil system ?

realliveplumber

I would go with gas.

Seems like competent, available oil service technicians are in short supply.

I think with gas you at least have a better chance of getting someone who half way knows what they are doing for maintenance and service.

Jamie Hall

I think I've said this before -- but not in this thread. And, full disclosure, though I was a professional engineer in my previous career, I am not one now.

A true professional -- engineer, tradesperson, etc. -- will be aware of what the client desires. He or she will also be aware of, and capable of, evaluating the various options available to meet the clients desires, including the advantages or disadvantages of each. He or she will also be able to provide a reasonable capital cost estimate for each option, and a running and maintenance cost.

He may also point out that he or she does not feel qualified to perform certain options, if that is the case (it may be -- often is) but suggest talking to someone who can if the client desires.

He or she will do this without regard to his or her personal bias -- and I might point out that everyone has at least some slight personal bias.

And last, I would like to say that there are at least a dozen Wallies whom I have watched or interacted with over the years, some professional tradespeople, some not, whom I am quite confident would agree with me and operate that way.

yesimon

The data shows that oil is most popular in Maine, so I would expect that to correlate with price and availability of skilled contractors. However that doesn't necessarily mean that oil is the best choice going forward.




From: https://www.reddit.com/r/dataisbeautiful/comments/18l93e6/how_do_people_in_the_us_heat_their_homes_oc/

Larry Weingarten

Hi @travler , Most of the discussion so far has been about adding heat to the home. With the walls stripped, it's the perfect time to be thinking about how to prevent heat loss from the home. Today I got an email from Building Science Corporation detailing how to build so you reduce the heating/cooling load by 70%. My experience is that you can realistically aim for 80% and it's a lot of work to get there. Here's a link to the Building Science article: https://buildingscience.com/documents/high-r-value-roofs-high-r-value-foundation-assemblies-building-profiles-new-construction?utm_source=Building+Science+Corporation+List&utm_campaign=bf8c854ad5-BSC+Newsletter+Issue+#102_COPY_02&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_194890bc8c-bf8c854ad5-121083998
I'd look at their basic approach, and see how much of it you could apply to your home. Then first job is to air seal. Use a blower door during sealing, so you know what works and how well you're doing. Next is insulation. Use too much! Don't get stuck on what's cost effective now, as it needs to be cost effective 25 or more years from now also, and energy prices don't go down. After all of that shell tightening, you can then size your heating system much smaller as it will have far less work to do.
Money not spent on the heating system can get spent on shell tightening, so ultimately, this doesn't need to be a more expensive way to go.

Yours, Larry

SlamDunk

Go with geothermal and dont worry about deiveries, price fluctuations, or clean combustion.
Just need to seal and insulate very well.

Hot_water_fan

My qualms with insulation retrofits are the cost effectiveness is pretty low if done right and interest rates are high right now, making future savings less valuable. Tread carefully, diminishing returns are real! 

hot_rod

If the framing is 2x4, there is a limit to how much upgrading you can do for r value.

I like to see a thin layer of spray foam, then insulation batts.

The spray foam takes framing infiltration to near zero. In the basement or crawl, pay attention to rim joist and bottom plate sealing. Another good place to spray foam.

Keep in mind you want some air changes and access to fresh air. Manual or forced with a heat recovery device.

Steamhead

old_diy_guy said:

As far as the bias towards hydronics goes, I grew up in a steam heated house in Brooklyn, NY and when my wife and I were married, we bought a steam heated house in Queens, NY. When we moved to Southern New Jersey, we bought a house with forced air heat. I was originally suspicious of it, but I've come to appreciate the advantages. We now have central a/c, an electric air cleaner, air purification (Reme Halo), humidity control, zero temperature change from room to room. My wife appreciates not having "those old fashioned, bulky radiators", and I appreciate not having to go down the basement to check the water level every week. We have not noticed any drafts or noise from the forced air or any other disadvantages. If I live long enough to buy another house, it will not have a boiler.

You got lucky. Pretty much every forced-air house I've been in was horrible. Noise, drying of sinuses, drafts etc.

Also note that a modern steam boiler does not need those weekly blow-downs. We've come a long way.

Some years ago I was in Maine during the summer, and the outside temp had gotten all the way up to 83 degrees. People were complaining that it was SOOOO HOT! Being from Baltimore, where we routinely get into the upper 90s during that period, I had to laugh. You don't really need central A/C that far north.

@travler , I agree the first job is to weatherize the house. Insulation and window upgrades come first. That means whatever heat you install can be smaller, and will use less fuel.

This would be as good a place as any to install steam. Steam systems drain dry when they're off, except for some basement piping and the boiler itself, so the potential for freezing damage is much less. That would be my choice.

Oh, and @WMno57 if knowing what works well makes me biased, then I am, and proud of it.

leonz

With all the interior area opened up an overhead steam system would fit in well and only require the single riser with a double elbow feeding the header pipe with pipe crosses to connect the drop pipes if the steam boiler was placed in the center of the basement and the basement would be warm too.
You could also make use of a domestic hot water coil in the steam boiler eliminating the need for a separate water heater too.

Clammy or Steamhead could tell us if two smaller main vents would be needed with a double elbow riser in the center of the home feeding two header pipes.

If placing the steam boiler in the center of the home is not possible it could be placed at one end and a single riser to an elbow would feed the header pipe which would have pipe joints connected to pipe crosses that would feed drop pipes to the radiators at the exterior walls and the single header pipe would have one or more main vents at the end along with the smaller individual radiator vents.

Paul Pollets

I'd be installing a gas condensing boiler, and most likely a Viessmann Vitodens 200 which can burn propane or NG without changing the gas valve. It comes with wi-fi and an app. I'd use wall panel radiators on a 2 pipe system sized for condensing loads and have thermostatic radiator valves on all radiators.

archibald tuttle

Robert O'Brien said:

MikeL_2 said:

 Many gas boilers, and most gas furnaces can vent combustion gases directly outdoors via plastic piping.
 Most oil appliances require an atmospheric chimney......

The highest efficiency of each can sidewall vent with polypro, the standard of each can't.

you really only can use plastic vents for relatively low water temps. the fact that highest efficiency operation has low temp exhaust is irrelevant to most circumstances that use baseboard because baseboard can't operate-at least most of the time-at those high efficiencies.

some people are treating this as vacation residence although i'm not sure I saw the OP say that although maybe that. Definitely, if this is not full time occupied or not to be full time occupied, I'm with the who needs indoor plumbing crowd recommending a furnace and draining or at least shutting off the water when not in residence (still might keep the home conditioned to some extent for other reasons but in case the heat shuts down, which is just double or triply a problem with hydronic if you aren't around all the time to realize quickly that the heat is off.

I'm a big believer in LP (or nat gas) condensing furnaces because they actually condense and can use inexpensive plastic flu pipe. If you're going to build a chimney anyway and it isn't much extra expense to provide a flu then oil is a thing. I do agree if it is a close call I like LP for clean running.

But if you go hydronic, i'm totally onboard with folks who recommend cast iron (as long as the house is monitored and you aren't going to let the boiler freeze, might be an antifreeze kind of situation). and those still work great with LP power burners. LP is too much in the NE though so you might go oil in that circumstance. I get a good deal on propane by having big tanks and buying a lot at once but i'm talking 1500 gallons or more per delivery.

jesmed1

travler said:

Hello all, first post….thank you for all the info provided here.

We are buying an old home in Maine...house is old and wall are stripped.

As someone else said, the #1 best thing you can do is flash a layer of spray foam on those stripped walls before adding batt insulation and vapor barrier. In Maine's cold climate, the #1 source of heat loss in old houses is air infiltration, and with the bare walls you have the once-in-a-lifetime chance to install a highly effective air barrier by spraying on a thin layer of foam.

#2 best thing is upgrading old double hung windows by professional weatherstripping and storms. Or replacement double-pane windows if you must.

Once you do thorough air sealing and insulating, you just saved 25%-50% on every heating bill for as long as you live there, whatever heating system you choose.