Old Steam System worth Keeping? Best options to replace?

jguinta

I just bought a home in Boston, MA built in 1925 which has an oil based steam heating system. It has several leaks at the radiators that have caused damage to the floors. It appears that most of the major part belong to the original system. The burner head is less than 20 years old. We have Nat. Gas at the curb as an option. What are the recommended options for this system? Repair, Replace, Etc. Would a new system be more efficient for such an old house?

Thank you for your comments.

ScottSecor

Nothing really unusual in your photos, kind of typical for my area (NJ). Previous owners did not have the funds or think it was important to maintain there heating system.

My suggestion is to replace the boiler with a properly sized gas fired steam boiler. Do away with a tankless coil and have a gas fired water heater installed. Replace the radiator shutoff valves that show signs of leakage (perhaps all of them). I would suggest doing this work immediately.

Once you move in and when you have the funds, replace all of the radiator vents, the main vents and insulate the steam mains.

In the end you'll have a comfortable home with reasonable utility bills.

pecmsg

The rads have to come out (SHOULD) to redo the floors so consider replacing that boiler NOW.
Winter is weeks away; you can drain the water pipes to buy time if you're not going to live there during construction.

Hot_water_fan

Do you want AC now or in the future? It’s the best time to add ductwork. That options up many heating options - furnace and/or heat pump powered by gas, oil, electricity, etc 

Jamie Hall

The easiest, cheapest and simplest approach is @ScottSecor 's. Replace the boiler with a nice new properly sized gas fired one, remove the radiators and refinish the floors, and reinstall the radiators with new inlet valves. You could probably repair the old valves as well -- they are very simple to bring up to like new condition unless they have really been hammered, and that saves the trouble of removing the old valves and their connections to the radiators.

Problem is, installing the new boiler takes a competent steam person, and the only one in your area I'm really happy with is Ryan at @New England SteamWorks -- but I daresay he's just a bit busy. No harm to contacting him, though. If you are west of Boston, you might also try @Charlie from wmass in Springfield, but I know he's about as busy as he can be, too, and doesn't work -- to my knowledge anyway -- in Boston itself.

If the boiler actually runs, though, you can do the radiators part of the job now without doing the boiler at the same time.

I can't completely agree with @Hot_water_fan on this one. There is indeed something to be said for a heat pump and air conditioning -- but installing adequate ductwork in an old Boston area building is going to be a horrible job and quite disruptive -- and permanently so, unless you like the industrial look...

Steamhead

Jamie Hall said:

The easiest, cheapest and simplest approach is @ScottSecor 's. Replace the boiler with a nice new properly sized gas fired one, remove the radiators and refinish the floors, and reinstall the radiators with new inlet valves. You could probably repair the old valves as well -- they are very simple to bring up to like new condition unless they have really been hammered, and that saves the trouble of removing the old valves and their connections to the radiators.

Problem is, installing the new boiler takes a competent steam person, and the only one in your area I'm really happy with is Ryan at @New England SteamWorks -- but I daresay he's just a bit busy. No harm to contacting him, though. If you are west of Boston, you might also try @Charlie from wmass in Springfield, but I know he's about as busy as he can be, too, and doesn't work -- to my knowledge anyway -- in Boston itself.

If the boiler actually runs, though, you can do the radiators part of the job now without doing the boiler at the same time.

I can't completely agree with @Hot_water_fan on this one. There is indeed something to be said for a heat pump and air conditioning -- but installing adequate ductwork in an old Boston area building is going to be a horrible job and quite disruptive -- and permanently so, unless you like the industrial look...

This.

ChicagoCooperator

Are the valves actually leaking? I ask because sometimes people try to modulate 1-pipe steam with the valves which doesn't work and causes leaks at the valves. It could also be pressure set too high too.

Dave in QCA

I have restored or rehabbed a number of old or historic houses in the last 40 years and consulted on many others. I know of many houses where the person starting the rehab removed ALL of the radiators and steam or hot water piping. Modernizing was the rationale. Not one single one of those houses has a successful, comfortable environment as a result of a new forced air system. Of those in which the rehabber still lives in the house, they all regret their decision.

All through central heating history, cast iron radiant heat, whether steam or hot water, was the premium type of heating. Movement away from cast iron was almost entirely based on economy of installation, not performance or efficiency.

@Jamie Hall and @Steamhead Have given you the best and most complete recommendations and I totally agree with them, no point on restating it.

Mad Dog_2

I concur....Mad Dog 🐕 

jguinta

Thank you all! great points. My bet is that maintenance was not a word for the previous owner. I will be renovating the house, so I have flexibility...can even drain the house and shut it down for a bit. The next occupant will be my daughter, a 30 year old lawyer without much interest in what is going on in the basement. So easy of use would be great. A split AC/heat pump system was recommended as a supplement. The boiler sits dead center in the basement, so moving the location of a new boiler would be great, (allowing the utilization of the space) but not easy if the steam stays... I will also be upgrading the Electric Service, blowing up the kitchen and a lavatory, and perhaps opening up a few walls on the first floor. Yes, refinishing the floors, etc. So now would be the time to get it all done right.

The House is in Roslindale/West Roxbury, so I will be recruiting Steam experts in the Dedham/Roslindale/Boston area.

I appreciate your advice and comments!

BobC

I have a hundred year old house off Wollaston beach that was built with steam. One of the things I like about steam besides it's comfort is how reliable it is. I've lived in this house for 42 years and only had one service call (had yearly cleanouts when I was on oil) and that was because I had the flu. the controller on the oil gun had failed.

These systems just work, replace an air vent from time to time and add a bit of water every few weeks (in really cold weather). Now that it's gas fired the system just needs the flame sensor cleaned and a combustion check every couple of years. If i had a new modcon boiler It would cost me a several hundred dollars rs every year to take it all apart and clean it out and repairs cost two arms and a leg.

You can't neat the reliability of steam heat and have to go a long way to equal it's comfort level.

Bob

jguinta

Can you provide some recommendations on the replacement boiler? 1500sqft 2 story house, 1925 age. I would like to convert to GAS from Oil. Thanks!

Jamie Hall

Assuming that you can find a real steam guy, and please choose wisely on that!, he or she will measure the radiators which you have installed. Steam boilers are sized based on that measurement, not the size of the house or whatever.

He or she will also very likely have a preferred make of boiler; there are a number, and since the installer is at least as important as the installed equipment, there is something to be said for going with what he or she likes.

You mentioned wanting to move the boiler. This may not be all that difficult with a new install, but one would have to look at the whole situation to say.

WMno57

IMO the best way to restore a house, car, or tractor is cosmetics last. Paint, refinishing floors, etc is the last step.
In your case I would hook up all the radiators, have a steam tech get the current boiler going, and see what you got. You may find some radiators need to be replaced due to cracks, or rust through. You may wish to swap out some radiators for larger or smaller. You may wish to swap out some radiators for aesthetics.
Once you get the whole system working, then next summer you can send the radiators out for refinishing, and get the floors done.
Wood floors can only be sanded so many times before the sander goes through the tongue and groove. But even if your floors don't have any machine sandings left in them, they could be lightly hand sanded and stained. Area rugs could cover the center of the room. I think the character and patina of old wood floors (even with a few stains) is awesome.
Here is a video of some mechanical work that was done after paint. My neighbor Taryl in Podunk, Indiana working on a 1950 Willys Jeep CJ-3A. Would have been better to paint last.

https://youtu.be/eh9WdcL9188

jguinta

I will look into moving the boiler during the replace and switch to gas process. That would be a great outcome if it can be done. The floors appear to be on the original coat of sealer (I did say that maintenance was not in the owner's vocabulary)...thus not worried about refinishing when the time is right.

jguinta

Other than New England Steamworks, are there any other Residential Steam Tech recommendations in the Roslindale, West Roxbury, Dedham MA area? I'm sure that there is plenty of work around here.

Jamie Hall

jguinta said:

I will look into moving the boiler during the replace and switch to gas process. That would be a great outcome if it can be done. The floors appear to be on the original coat of sealer (I did say that maintenance was not in the owner's vocabulary)...thus not worried about refinishing when the time is right.

Take a good close look at that "sealer" on the floors. There's a good chance if the work was before World War II that it may be shellac. If it is, it's very easy to refinish -- but not if you get someone in there who doesn't know how.

SteamingatMohawk

Should I be surprised the Pressuretrol doesn't have a pigtail/steam trap? See the cut from a manual.

neilc

what's a manual ?

EBEBRATT-Ed

@jguinta

Check with the gas utility. Many cities in that area want no more fossil fuels. Even if you have gas at the curb they may not allow it.

BobC

@neilc A manual is included to you have someplace to put your coffee cup, most today think of it as the male version of a doily.

Bob

jguinta

Q - Once I get the steam system addressed. If I am going to explore a Heat Pump/Cooling System as a supplement, would a Unico system be in the mix as this is a very old house? Thanks to all above.