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Just connect all the pipes. Stop thinking about it.

JohnNY
JohnNY Member Posts: 2,742

Contact John "JohnNY" Cataneo, Master Plumber
in New York
in New Jersey
for Consulting Work
or take his class.
Solid_Fuel_Mandelcrossv

Comments

  • KC_Jones
    KC_Jones Member Posts: 4,820
    These two seem appropriate.





    2014 Weil Mclain EG-40
    EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Boiler Control
    Boiler pictures updated 2/21/15
    JohnNYCanuckerSolid_Fuel_Mandelcrossv
  • ratio
    ratio Member Posts: 2,921
    I don't see what the big deal is. It's just redundant feeds. I mean, they probably didn't need the upsell, but maybe they wanted to spend a little more for peace of mind.
    Alan (California Radiant) ForbesSolid_Fuel_Man
  • Jamie Hall
    Jamie Hall Member Posts: 17,049
    oy...
    Br. Jamie, osb
    Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England
  • STEVEusaPA
    STEVEusaPA Member Posts: 5,304
    I scared.
    steve
  • pecmsg
    pecmsg Member Posts: 2,321
    JohnNY said:
    We need the video of your expression when you 1st saw that!
    mattmia2Solid_Fuel_Man
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 10,268
    Obviously with the original boiler those two flanged unions were nippled into the top of the old boiler so the installer saw nothing wrong with what he did.
  • SlamDunk
    SlamDunk Member Posts: 1,105
    How well did it work?
  • Docfletcher
    Docfletcher Member Posts: 481
    That is a beautiful white color. Too bad they didn't paint the rest to match.
  • Intplm.
    Intplm. Member Posts: 1,336
    Oh NOOO!
  • KC_Jones
    KC_Jones Member Posts: 4,820
    Wait, there is an outlet on the other side of that boiler, so it appears they didn't connect all the pipes.

    That connection would have solved everything. ;)
    2014 Weil Mclain EG-40
    EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Boiler Control
    Boiler pictures updated 2/21/15
  • offdutytech
    offdutytech Member Posts: 36
    At least the boiler room is clean🤷‍♂️
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 10,268
    Just shows the difference between the oldbiolers and more modern boilers.

    With the old boiler connected to the existing flanges and with the old boiler having a large steam chest and more water content it worked with the balance pipe connected between the two tees.

    Even though the old boiler was never piped "right" it worked

    With the newer boiler it never had a chance
    ttekushan_3
  • nicholas bonham-carter
    nicholas bonham-carter Member Posts: 8,509
    Ed, your right, if you look at the original pipes, you may see that it was an iffy piping layout, even before the new installation made it super-iffy. The trunkslammer installer may have thought really “high pressure goes to low pressure”, and I’ve done it this way for years!
    JohnNY, what was the reaction to your diagnosis from the home owners?—NBC
  • JUGHNE
    JUGHNE Member Posts: 8,941
    This is another install that should not be working.
    The same thing but only better.

    They did use 4" out of both side outlets. (500,000+ btuh boiler)
    No skim tapping, never was skimmed that I am aware of.
    However, that tank acts as a huge p-trap, collecting sludge and oil.
    I have flushed it out once....very bad.

    The "equalizer" comes out of the side of the top header....so there is no "drip" of the header.
    That 2" goes into the top of the condensate accumulator tank for steam pressure.
    The HL connects into the end of that tank, (not visible) just below the water line.

    So with enough vertical rise of boiler risers you tend to recreate the large steam chest effect that would have been there originally.

    The 4" above the flanges is original to the 1911 church, as are the 2 3" steam mains connected.

    This works on 8-12 ounces of pressure, heats quickly and is as quiet as, well, a church mouse....pun intended.




    Alan (California Radiant) ForbesPC7060Solid_Fuel_Man
  • That is a beautiful white color. Too bad they didn't paint the rest to match.

    I think they wanted to show off their soldering skills.
    Often wrong, never in doubt.
    bucksnort
  • rick in Alaska
    rick in Alaska Member Posts: 1,242
    Speaking of soldering skills: It looks to me like the 90 on the right might have been soldered on, then slid most of the way off, and appears to be it is ready to come loose. Not sure about the tee on the right.
    Rick
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 10,268
    @JUGHNE

    Your right about lousy piping sometimes working.

    My theory is lets say someone installs an oversized boiler and then undersizes the risers and header and maybe configures the header wrong.......but it works!

    Why does it work?

    The system can only condense just so much steam. The risers and screwed up header don't ever have to handle the full load the boiler is rated at because it is oversized in comparison to what the system can condense. So the steam moves slower and it survives

    JMHO
  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 3,957
    What is with the metal plates under the asbestosey looking insulation?
  • Jamie Hall
    Jamie Hall Member Posts: 17,049
    Nice example of something I think I've said before. Steam heat is almost incredibly forgiving. It can be made to work superbly well following a few pretty simple concepts (at least I think they're simple...) but even if as magnificently fouled up as this one, it will likely work. Maybe not well. Maybe noisy. But it will work.
    Br. Jamie, osb
    Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England
  • JUGHNE
    JUGHNE Member Posts: 8,941
    IDK for sure about the square plates. They allow enough room to remove the flange bolts....maybe why.

    I believe the top flange and insulation is original to the install.
  • PC7060
    PC7060 Member Posts: 471
    JUGHNE said:
    IDK for sure about the square plates. They allow enough room to remove the flange bolts....maybe why. I believe the top flange and insulation is original to the install.
    I agree, look like insulation terminating plates. I’m sure if you could find the original drawing it would be detailed there!
  • JUGHNE
    JUGHNE Member Posts: 8,941
    I don't mean to hijack the thread....but you asked.
    No print but 1912 expenditures are available.
    Plumbing and heating $1600.81, mostly heating as there were no RR inside.
    (They came in the late 40's)
    (Coal fired boiler, with shovels, two 100' 3" steam mains with about 15 CI rads)

    Pre wiring for electrical (power came about 8 years later) and gas lighting was $420,81, BTY, Cathedral assessment was $1000.00 .
    PC7060
  • The Steam Whisperer
    The Steam Whisperer Member Posts: 757
    JUGHNE said:

    This is another install that should not be working.
    The same thing but only better.

    They did use 4" out of both side outlets. (500,000+ btuh boiler)
    No skim tapping, never was skimmed that I am aware of.
    However, that tank acts as a huge p-trap, collecting sludge and oil.
    I have flushed it out once....very bad.

    The "equalizer" comes out of the side of the top header....so there is no "drip" of the header.
    That 2" goes into the top of the condensate accumulator tank for steam pressure.
    The HL connects into the end of that tank, (not visible) just below the water line.

    So with enough vertical rise of boiler risers you tend to recreate the large steam chest effect that would have been there originally.

    The 4" above the flanges is original to the 1911 church, as are the 2 3" steam mains connected.

    This works on 8-12 ounces of pressure, heats quickly and is as quiet as, well, a church mouse....pun intended.




    If your run the numbers 2x4inch inch outlets on only a 500,000 btu boiler gives nice low velocity steam, so the water can drop back right in the risers.
    To learn more about this professional, click here to visit their ad in Find A Contractor.
    JUGHNE