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Leaking end section brand new boiler.

Anyone ever see this?

Brand new 64-08 peerless. End section during pressure test.

Comments

  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 14,863
    Pics?
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
  • SeanBeans
    SeanBeans Member Posts: 483
    The other side looks like the manufacturer kinda of sealed the same spot with some weld?
  • luketheplumber
    luketheplumber Member Posts: 134
    I would go and return the boiler
    I just earned my GED and am looking for a apprenticeship with one of these steam gurus on this site!
    aircooled81
  • JUGHNE
    JUGHNE Member Posts: 9,000
    And I suppose it is already in the basement? :s
  • Dave0176
    Dave0176 Member Posts: 1,172
    Appears to be a porous casting. Gotta return it.
    DL Mechanical LLC Heating, Cooling and Plumbing 732-266-5386
    NJ Master HVACR Lic# 4630
    Specializing in Steam Heating, Serving the residents of New Jersey
    https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/dl-mechanical-llc

    https://m.facebook.com/DL-Mechanical-LLC-315309995326627/?ref=content_filter

    I cannot force people to spend money, I can only suggest how to spend it wisely.......
    1Matthias
  • Double D
    Double D Member Posts: 411
    Great, I have a 64-08 being delivered next Thursday. I hope mines not a leaker.
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,518
    Yep, probably some imperfection in the casting process. May have other thin/weak spots that will leak later.
  • SeanBeans
    SeanBeans Member Posts: 483
    Yes @JUGHNE of course!

    At least it’s not the middle of winter..

    @Fred I really hope not!
  • gerry gill
    gerry gill Member Posts: 3,010
    Yes, i had a crack in a peerless end section earlier this year..but it was the first bad boiler i ever had so i just kind of shrugged it off as one of those 'bound to happen someday' things.
    gwgillplumbingandheating.com
    Serving Cleveland's eastern suburbs from Cleveland Heights down to Cuyahoga Falls.

  • I've always dreaded this! All the work to install it, -and then all for nothing!!!

    What a nightmare!

    Keep us posted please.
    New England SteamWorks
    Service, Installation, & Restoration of Steam Heating Systems
    newenglandsteamworks.com
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,518
    I'd be concerned about that other end. If that little nub pops off or chips off during expansion and contraction, it will very possibly leak as well. It doesn't look like a weld repair, it looks like a flaw in the mold.
  • Ironman
    Ironman Member Posts: 6,600
    I would certainly hope that Peerless steps up to the plate and properly compensates you/ your company for this.
    Bob Boan
    You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.
    delta T
  • SeanBeans
    SeanBeans Member Posts: 483
    @gerry gill was the crack in the same spot as this one?
  • aircooled81
    aircooled81 Member Posts: 197
    Thats about 1 or 2 days to swap out that end? you using a gantry or just pure muscle?
    what a bummer, I'm sure peerless will take care of you, if supply house isnt helping I bet they step up on their product.
  • SeanBeans
    SeanBeans Member Posts: 483
    The boiler came in 2 halves with 4 sections each and we used a stair master to get em down. A lot easier than getting the old beast out. Pure muscle for this one, hoping they give us just the end section and not the whole halve...
  • Dave0176
    Dave0176 Member Posts: 1,172
    If it were me @SeanBeans I’d want a complete new set of castings even if you gotta do more work to get it out.
    DL Mechanical LLC Heating, Cooling and Plumbing 732-266-5386
    NJ Master HVACR Lic# 4630
    Specializing in Steam Heating, Serving the residents of New Jersey
    https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/dl-mechanical-llc

    https://m.facebook.com/DL-Mechanical-LLC-315309995326627/?ref=content_filter

    I cannot force people to spend money, I can only suggest how to spend it wisely.......
    Ironman
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,518
    Dave0176 said:

    If it were me @SeanBeans I’d want a complete new set of castings even if you gotta do more work to get it out.

    Me too
  • Paul Pollets
    Paul Pollets Member Posts: 3,431
    I'd be sending a bill to Peerless for having to remove the defective boiler and re-installing another. To settle for new sections is not enough. Manufacturers need to understand that contractors have costs for replacing defective equipment right out of the box.
  • ScottSecor
    ScottSecor Member Posts: 395
    Peerless is a stand up company, I suspect they'll do the right thing.
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 11,985
    > @ScottSecor said:
    > Peerless is a stand up company, I suspect they'll do the right thing.

    The right thing would've been to test the block before they sold it to someone who hauled it down into a basement and assembled it no?

    That's an awful lot of wasted time.
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • SeanBeans
    SeanBeans Member Posts: 483
    Just to clarify, I work for a company and this is not on my own.
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,518
    SeanBeans said:

    Just to clarify, I work for a company and this is not on my own.

    All the more reason for your company to do right by your customer and insist on a complete new block. I'm just sayin, that's what I'd want from a contractor I hired.
  • Dave0176
    Dave0176 Member Posts: 1,172
    edited September 2018
    ChrisJ said:

    > @ScottSecor said:

    > Peerless is a stand up company, I suspect they'll do the right thing.



    The right thing would've been to test the block before they sold it to someone who hauled it down into a basement and assembled it no?



    That's an awful lot of wasted time.

    Chris this is a split block, they are not factory tested, it’s up to the installer to hydro test the boiler after assembly as Sean has done.
    DL Mechanical LLC Heating, Cooling and Plumbing 732-266-5386
    NJ Master HVACR Lic# 4630
    Specializing in Steam Heating, Serving the residents of New Jersey
    https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/dl-mechanical-llc

    https://m.facebook.com/DL-Mechanical-LLC-315309995326627/?ref=content_filter

    I cannot force people to spend money, I can only suggest how to spend it wisely.......
  • Sorry, Peerless is not so stand up. We had a large 9 or 10 section 64 series that when we got it together, the boiler looked like a potato chip....The section connections were machined incorrectly. Split block and installed new half and then pressure tested....other side was leaking. Had to split block again and install the other new half.
    Called Peerless was told to send bill to local rep...... nothing. Multiple calls to rep never returned and never any compensation.

    I later received two surveys from Peerless and reported the situation. Both times I was told they were going to look into ....nothing.


    We've had all of the of EC/ SC boilers and the one LC we installed start leaking at the cover plate gaskets after only 2 to 3 winters of use. Gaskets were rock hard already. The problem has been reported 3 times now.... again nothing.

    Needless to say we have not installed any more EC/Sc or LC boilers. WE still install the 63/64 since I believe they are a much better boiler than the competition.... but the factory backing is just as bad as most of the competition.

    The exception we have experienced is Slant Fin. When we had problems they paid all the additional expense, including travel and hotel expenses since the work was out of town. No negociating or insisting on some discount. I sorely wish they had good support here in Chicago, but unfortunately not.
    To learn more about this professional, click here to visit their ad in Find A Contractor.
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 11,985
    edited September 2018
    > @Dave0176 said:
    > > @ScottSecor said:
    >
    > > Peerless is a stand up company, I suspect they'll do the right thing.
    >
    >
    >
    > The right thing would've been to test the block before they sold it to someone who hauled it down into a basement and assembled it no?
    >
    >
    >
    > That's an awful lot of wasted time.
    >
    > Chris this is a split block, they are not factory tested, it’s up to the installer to hydro test the boiler after assembly as Sean has done.


    Hi Dave,
    They cannot test individual sections before they leave the factory?
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • Dave0176
    Dave0176 Member Posts: 1,172
    ChrisJ said:

    > @Dave0176 said:

    > > @ScottSecor said:

    >

    > > Peerless is a stand up company, I suspect they'll do the right thing.

    >

    >

    >

    > The right thing would've been to test the block before they sold it to someone who hauled it down into a basement and assembled it no?

    >

    >

    >

    > That's an awful lot of wasted time.

    >

    > Chris this is a split block, they are not factory tested, it’s up to the installer to hydro test the boiler after assembly as Sean has done.





    Hi Dave,

    They cannot test individual sections before they leave the factory?

    Hey Chris, unfortunately all the manufacturers only test a packaged assembled boiler block.
    DL Mechanical LLC Heating, Cooling and Plumbing 732-266-5386
    NJ Master HVACR Lic# 4630
    Specializing in Steam Heating, Serving the residents of New Jersey
    https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/dl-mechanical-llc

    https://m.facebook.com/DL-Mechanical-LLC-315309995326627/?ref=content_filter

    I cannot force people to spend money, I can only suggest how to spend it wisely.......
    ChrisJ
  • 1. They are all awful about bad blocks. All they want to do is give you a replacement, which doesn't help in the least.
    2. I did notice the last two Weil 80's we assembled had each individual section labeled as "Tested". I remember wondering: how did they do that? But maybe some do it and have a way.

    I just know if I ever did a job and found I had a bad block and wasn't compensated for labor, -that would be the last one!
    New England SteamWorks
    Service, Installation, & Restoration of Steam Heating Systems
    newenglandsteamworks.com
    IronmanDouble D
  • SeanBeans
    SeanBeans Member Posts: 483
    By the way, what do you guys use to support the middle of the boiler when putting the sections together on a peerless?
  • A bunch of 2x 12in lumber nailed together, IIRC. It's
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  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 11,985
    You could easily test block sections with a simple fixture designed to seal up against where the connections are. It doesn't need to be threaded.

    Using compressed air would show any pinhole leaks incredibly fast and without any mess.

    Any factory could easily fabricate such a setup if they wanted to.
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
    SeanBeans
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 10,371
    This is always a problem. Most all the boiler manufacturers don't step up. It's always the contractors problem.

    You have 2 pieces of leverage. Remove the whole thing and dump it on the wholesalers loading dock and refuse to pay for it. tell them they will lose all your business if they don't step up.

    I have been through this time after time in 46 years.

    The only way you usually get anything is to pay hardball as hard as you can. Can this destroy relationships with the supplier.....yes. The biggest a..hole contractors in this business always scream and yell but in the end they get what they want in the end.

    Not the way I want to do business but in the end that's the choice. be nice, be firm....get nothing. Be a jackass ...get a new boiler.

    BTW as soon as something like this happens you have already lost money on this one...................the life of a contractor
    IronmanNew England SteamWorksZman
  • gerry gill
    gerry gill Member Posts: 3,010
    edited September 2018
    SeanBeans said:

    @gerry gill was the crack in the same spot as this one?

    by their tie rod
    gwgillplumbingandheating.com
    Serving Cleveland's eastern suburbs from Cleveland Heights down to Cuyahoga Falls.

  • gerry gill
    gerry gill Member Posts: 3,010
    SeanBeans said:

    By the way, what do you guys use to support the middle of the boiler when putting the sections together on a peerless?

    In the manual they will describe a site built wood box to construct. We are fortunate to employ someone who was once a carpenter. He built one dead nuts to size, and strong enough to stand a house on. We have used the same one ever since.
    gwgillplumbingandheating.com
    Serving Cleveland's eastern suburbs from Cleveland Heights down to Cuyahoga Falls.

  • Zman
    Zman Member Posts: 7,009

    This is always a problem. Most all the boiler manufacturers don't step up. It's always the contractors problem.

    You have 2 pieces of leverage. Remove the whole thing and dump it on the wholesalers loading dock and refuse to pay for it. tell them they will lose all your business if they don't step up.

    I have been through this time after time in 46 years.

    The only way you usually get anything is to pay hardball as hard as you can. Can this destroy relationships with the supplier.....yes. The biggest a..hole contractors in this business always scream and yell but in the end they get what they want in the end.

    Not the way I want to do business but in the end that's the choice. be nice, be firm....get nothing. Be a jackass ...get a new boiler.

    BTW as soon as something like this happens you have already lost money on this one...................the life of a contractor

    You usually don't need to be an A hole every time. It is important that they know you are willing and capable of going there. I would suggest telling them that you intend to take this boiler back to the distributor for a full refund and buy a new one from the competition. If that does not get their attention, do it!
    "If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough"
    Albert Einstein
    Canucker
  • SeanBeans
    SeanBeans Member Posts: 483
    I made a sheet metal box and filled it with 3 inch pvc the first peerless we put together a month or so ago.. that was a 64-12 :neutral:

    The box took a beating but helped a whole lot.. this time I just taped 9 pieces of 3 inch pvc together and it worked like a charm with the help of the gantry
  • Ironman
    Ironman Member Posts: 6,600
    So, what happened with the block? How was it resolved?
    Bob Boan
    You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.
  • The Steam Whisperer
    The Steam Whisperer Member Posts: 760
    I looked up the Peerless warranty and it does not cover labor
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