What tubing would you use?

Bluechair55

If you had to install an oil boiler system with baseboards, what kind of tubing would you use? Keeping in mind Watts onix radiant has already failed me and there may or may not be a water issue that contributed to clogging of that pipe. (I don't think so, but I throw that out there just in case.) Also, said tubing will be in the basement, which is generally shadowed but can get sun in spots.

I'm looking for the best, most reliable stuff. I don't want to go through this again.

kcopp

I use PexA for my baseboard runs. Uponor almost exclusively.

Bluechair55

Thanks, kcopp. Any downsides to it?

Bluechair55

Man. Every tubing I look at has lawsuits, recalls, known problems, etc. Is anything just safe and reliable?

kcopp

Not that I know of....

Zman

kcopp said:

I use PexA for my baseboard runs. Uponor almost exclusively.

Bluechair55 said:

Man. Every tubing I look at has lawsuits, recalls, known problems, etc. Is anything just safe and reliable?

Just buy pex-a and pex-a fittings...

Bluechair55

Thanks, zman. Why are the pex a fittings important? Because of the material they're made out of?

Tinman

I use Uponor's MultiCor pex-al-pex for any high temperature application or the Watts equivalent.

Ironman

Pex-al-pex is what we normally use for something like that. It keeps it shape, has minimal thermal expansion and full size internal diameter. The ability to make permanent bends reduces the number of fittings required. The downside is that special fittings are required which can be had in compression or press. The press fittings require the tool or pressing tongs that fit a ProPress.

Type A pex is our second choice. It's an expandlable pex with a 200 year life expectancy. You can use standard crimp fittings on it, but they restrict flow. The better option is to use the expansion fittings which don't hinder flow, but that also requires the specialized tool. Uponor and Rehau both offer type O2 barrier pex and Rehau has the best expansion fittings, but they, and the tool, are more expensive.

In either case, you'll need to insulate either one where they're exposed to direct sunlight.

Don't use any Chinese pipe: you'll be ripping that out too.

Make sure you get O2 barrier if you choose type A pex. The aluminum layer in pex-al-pex is the O2 barrier.

Tinman

One other thing to consider is your local codes. In my area, if it isn't stamped ASTM F1281 it can't be used in high temp apps. The ASTM F1281 is the standard for pex-al-pex pipe.

Steve Ebels_3

I wouldn't use regular Pex (A, B or C) for baseboard runs. It expands when it goes from cold to hot and then contracts when it cools back off.
Maybe short runs, like under 10-15 feet but over than you are really going to have to pay attention to the high expansion ratio and make allowances when installed or you'll have noise problems along with possible chafing of the tube as time goes by.

P/A/P is what we use. Viega pretty much specifically around here as there doesn't seem to be a good Uponor distributor.
You will need special tools to install it but we've found it's the best product for your intended use.

Copper not an option?

Bluechair55

Thanks everyone! I don't think copper is an option, but I need to double check on that. I can't remember why not.

Solid_Fuel_Man

Best....copper.....most labor/money.....copper.

Jamie Hall

I do a fair amount of plumbing on the places I care for -- and I use copper except in two situations: where I have to snake something through a chase and where I am much too close too very old highly combustible wood. Then I would use the pex-Al-pex.

Bob Gagnon plumbing and heating

I won't use anything but copper, it never fails...

Thanks, Bob Gagnon

ChrisJ

See how many lawsuits you can find on copper.

newagedawn

use the old school,...copper

ChrisJ

newagedawn said:

use the old school,...copper

Wouldn't old school be threaded steel?

hot_rod

I like the Viega FostaPex tube. You get a full pex tube with and additional aluminum and PE wrap. It works nicely, holds it's shape, quiet, and has a great track record.

The main thing with any PE tube is the ID is smaller than copper CTS, so watch flow rates and pressure drop.

bob eck

Check out Viega Fostapex. 1/2" - 3/4" - 1" pex with an aluminum barrier for the oxygen barrier.
Great product.

jumper

Best is accessible manifolds and uninterrupted runs to each terminal through conduits. Soft copper with flared connections. Copper will outlast the building.If it doesn't, it's easy to replace.

This method may actually cost less on account of fewer connections and smaller tubes.

Jim Hedden

Careful! Pex would not be good. Limited to 180 deg. F. Pex-al-Pex limited to 200 deg. F. Most oil fired boilers (no return tube distributor) and Honeywell aquastat I have found to run 20 to 40 degrees F. higher than the limit set! That has blistered Viega FostaPex that we had used in the past. Boilers with sensors such as the 2107 Buderus Logamatic control, or Viessmann, or tekmar controls (tekmar is a boiler enabler and uses the Honeywell "judge by the thumb" aquastat as a high limit only) can control the boiler water temperature much much better and not allow the boiler to reach those high temperatures. I look at the copper piping around the boiler and if I see it appearing "gold" in color, I know it is too hot for any Pex materials.
This is convective baseboard we are talking about that needs a higher water temperature (generally) and the metal piping was king for this.
If water temperature cannot be controlled, then copper piping should be looked into.