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Seven years, tops.

HeatingHelp
HeatingHelp Administrator Posts: 678
edited December 2016 in THE MAIN WALL
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Seven years, tops.

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kcoppHilly
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  • Robert O'Brien
    Robert O'Brien Member Posts: 3,562
    Seven years is pretty good, a PC Richard sales guy told my mother no more than 5 on a dishwasher. This was just this summer
    To learn more about this professional, click here to visit their ad in Find A Contractor.
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
    Five years on a dishwasher is about right. My son got exactly five years out of their dishwasher. We replaced it this past year after the control board went out and the replacement board was just shy of a new dishwasher. I'm telling you it is engineered/designed failure to keep the replacement cycle generating a revenue stream for these crooks.
    HatterasguyMilanD
  • Paul48
    Paul48 Member Posts: 4,469
    No more bearings. They use nylon rollers. They use thermal imaging on control boards, and put components in that make them run hot. I've had the pleasure of repairing many washers and dryers. My kids can kill one in 6 months without even trying.
  • GW
    GW Member Posts: 4,822
    Good one
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    gary@wilsonph.com
  • GW
    GW Member Posts: 4,822
    Well that's odd I typed out a whole schpeal and it didn't go through
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    gary@wilsonph.com
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
    It's happend to me too Gary.

    Bottom line the longer things are made to last the less product that is manufactured, and sold. This transcends into employment base, and the over all health of the economy.

    Think if everything we bought lasted even 20 years. My old house had some crane faucets 64 years old.
  • Paul48
    Paul48 Member Posts: 4,469
    That's the short-sighted way of looking at it. You fall in line with other manufacturers making garbage. Out of the 10 (hypothetical) manufacturers, you fight tooth and nail for your 10% of the pie. Why not make the very best, and let the other 9 manufacturers fight over 5%?
    Rich_49
  • Solid_Fuel_Man
    Solid_Fuel_Man Member Posts: 2,646
    You know it is interesting. My parents had a maytag washer and electric dryer given to them as wedding gifts. That washer lasted 25 years, it was replaced when I was in college. They bought a front- load Bosch from the big box store and that has been working for 17 years. That just revealed my age.....

    When I got married and was in search of appliances I scored a maytag top load from the mid 80s on craigslist for 80 bucks. It was of the same design, but a bit "updated" from that one they had. Theirs had a failed transmission due to oil leaking from a failed seal.

    When we moved out of our two room apartment and I moved that 80s maytag, I noticed oil around the drum belt. Quick online search yielded 30bucks for all the seals. A couple of hours later it was all spanking clean and as rebuilt as I was willing.

    With upkeep on things along with parts availability, one can keep almost anything working as long as it's not crap to start with.

    @ChrisJ ? Thoughts on old appliances?

    Taylor
    Serving Northern Maine HVAC & Controls. I burn wood, it smells good!
    ChrisJ
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 16,280
    > @Solid_Fuel_Man said:
    > You know it is interesting. My parents had a maytag washer and electric dryer given to them as wedding gifts. That washer lasted 25 years, it was replaced when I was in college. They bought a front- load Bosch from the big box store and that has been working for 17 years. That just revealed my age.....
    >
    > When I got married and was in search of appliances I scored a maytag top load from the mid 80s on craigslist for 80 bucks. It was of the same design, but a bit "updated" from that one they had. Theirs had a failed transmission due to oil leaking from a failed seal.
    >
    > When we moved out of our two room apartment and I moved that 80s maytag, I noticed oil around the drum belt. Quick online search yielded 30bucks for all the seals. A couple of hours later it was all spanking clean and as rebuilt as I was willing.
    >
    > With upkeep on things along with parts availability, one can keep almost anything working as long as it's not crap to start with.
    >
    > @ChrisJ ? Thoughts on old appliances?
    >
    > Taylor

    I don't really have much of an opinion other than on monitor tops. But it certainly seems like the appliances my parents used to have were a lot more durable and longer lasting than what I have now.

    Single pipe 392sqft system with an EG-40 rated for 325sqft and it's silent and balanced at all times.

  • GW
    GW Member Posts: 4,822
    4 years ago we redid our home, poured more money into it than any normal person would. Seems fine, i got what I always wanted, and we aren't planning of moving

    I spend over 10,000 on kitchen and laundry appliances. Kitcheaide in the kitchen, Maytag in the laundry. I was trying to be a loyal customer with the local small town appliance vendor.

    The dishwasher was the first to act up, water dripping onto the floor. After the appliance repair guy came once or twice, and struggled for another year or two, I bought a Bosch, $1000, and the extended warranty from a regional chain store.

    The microwave was next, we bought a smaller cheaper unit.

    The fridge was next, ice maker stopped working, we are surviving with no ice maker

    $5000 stove, 6 burner duel fuel, the ovem door spring mechanism stopped working, fine as long as the operator doesn't let it slam their toes.

    Laundry is fine

    It's a joke out there
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    gary@wilsonph.com
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
    Paul48 said:

    That's the short-sighted way of looking at it. You fall in line with other manufacturers making garbage. Out of the 10 (hypothetical) manufacturers, you fight tooth and nail for your 10% of the pie. Why not make the very best, and let the other 9 manufacturers fight over 5%?

    Not really short sighted. Think about it. Most people are ready for something different anyway in say 5-10 years. Especially with how rapidly some things change with technology.

    It's a different world than 30 years ago. White appliances were it. Then came avacado, and brown.
  • Solid_Fuel_Man
    Solid_Fuel_Man Member Posts: 2,646
    My wife gets all stary-eyed when we go to the big box and they have those LG front loaders in a metallic candy apple red. They have digital controls with LED triangle "play buttons" and about 50 different settings. The dryers now have a water hookup for steam press....

    My thoughts, you will use one setting for the vast majority of all clothes, and the water into the dryer.......need I say more?

    I like quality, and am an apparent rarity in that I will pay for quality and longevity. Not just show, and sparkles.

    Most of the high end stuff shares the same internals as the low end stuff, just with more doo-dads on expensive models.

    Taylor
    Serving Northern Maine HVAC & Controls. I burn wood, it smells good!
    Hatterasguy
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
    edited January 2017
    Oh me too Taylor. However you have to look at the broad consumer base. I had an Electrolux front load washer /dryer. They are pretty amazing machines. The dryer burned elements out every couple years due to the very fine mesh lint filter, and bounce sheets that my wife thought were so great. The washer was trouble free.

    I told my wife I would give her two rocks to use at the river across the street before I would by the set. Guess who won....
    SWEISolid_Fuel_Man
  • Tim McElwain
    Tim McElwain Member Posts: 4,641
    Water heater 22 years old, furnace 66 years old, dryer 19 years old heavy duty), washer 20 years old (also heavy duty). Forget dishwashers they are a waste of money. I wash the dishes or the wonderful Judy (my wife). They do not make stuff like they used to. Sorry! Of course it goes without saying that these things need annual care and love to keep them going just like my marraige (57 years).
    Solid_Fuel_ManHatterasguy
  • Paul48
    Paul48 Member Posts: 4,469
    Gordy said:

    Paul48 said:

    That's the short-sighted way of looking at it. You fall in line with other manufacturers making garbage. Out of the 10 (hypothetical) manufacturers, you fight tooth and nail for your 10% of the pie. Why not make the very best, and let the other 9 manufacturers fight over 5%?

    Not really short sighted. Think about it. Most people are ready for something different anyway in say 5-10 years. Especially with how rapidly some things change with technology.

    It's a different world than 30 years ago. White appliances were it. Then came avacado, and brown.
    Sure....there's no sense in having cars that run over 100000 miles because people want a new car every few years too. So, the manufacturers are actually doing us a favor.
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
    I have a Sub-Zero Frig/freezer and a Wolf six burner range. Both are 25 years old and never had a service call on either. I will pay to have those fixed before I buy the crap made today. I bought a Sansung front load washer and dryer eight years ago. They are still going fine but I bought the top of the line and they seem to be made fairly well. Korean made and probably when Samsung was trying to make a name for its appliances. I also have an American six burner/griddle/double oven range in the basement that is about 20 years old. Again, never any problems. I usually buy commercial products because I think they are a little better quality that the stuff you can buy at the big box stores. One exception is a commercial Fridge and freezer I bought for the basement about 10 years ago. They look great and heavy duty but they have been trouble since day one. They are both sitting in the basement right now and niether of them work. Compressors have been replaced, evaporators replaced, various other parts. I spent as much on parts and service calls as I paid for those units. I need to replace them but when I look at what the big box stores have, I just can't bring myself to do it. The last service tech that worked on my commercial units told me "when it comes to commercial refrigeration, you are getting a heavy duty cabinet, stainless steel interior/exterior but the manufacturers are using the same components as the consumer grade products and they just don't last. I don't know if that's completely true but I know my Sub-zero has two compressors in it, one for the fridge and one for the freezer and they both look like cast iron housings. If they are still made the way this one is, I may have to bite the bullet and buy Sub-zero for the basement Too. Like @Solid_Fuel_Man , I want quality. I am not one who needs every new bell and whistle every five years. Just give me reliability and quality.
  • GW
    GW Member Posts: 4,822
    Nice Fred, I had eyes on the sub zero and wolf but got cold feet at the time to pull the trigger. I wish I had. We all get to decide where and how to spend our dough. Or not spend it all all.

    We get used hockey skates for my kid though
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    gary@wilsonph.com
    Gordy
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
    What I want to know is who likes to cook in Freds house? I'm thinking, or hoping not Fred since we all know he thinks tar tastes like black licorice.
    ChrisJSolid_Fuel_Man
  • BobC
    BobC Member Posts: 5,501
    I bought a front load Frigidaire washer about 12 years ago, I got one with mechanical controls but I know it has a Triac based speed control on the motor.

    I replaced the door switch about 5 years ago and that has been it so far BUT it sounds like a bearing is going so I I'll probably have to replace it soon. Getting at that bearing will be a bear so I suspect it's not worth the effort on a machine of that age.

    In general I prefer simple controls, less to break.

    Bob
    Smith G8-3 with EZ Gas @ 90,000 BTU, Single pipe steam
    Vaporstat with a 12oz cut-out and 4oz cut-in
    3PSI gauge
    Solid_Fuel_Man
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
    Paul48 said:

    Gordy said:

    Paul48 said:

    That's the short-sighted way of looking at it. You fall in line with other manufacturers making garbage. Out of the 10 (hypothetical) manufacturers, you fight tooth and nail for your 10% of the pie. Why not make the very best, and let the other 9 manufacturers fight over 5%?

    Not really short sighted. Think about it. Most people are ready for something different anyway in say 5-10 years. Especially with how rapidly some things change with technology.

    It's a different world than 30 years ago. White appliances were it. Then came avacado, and brown.
    Sure....there's no sense in having cars that run over 100000 miles because people want a new car every few years too. So, the manufacturers are actually doing us a favor.
    Vehicles are major purchases. Most would put 100k plus on a vehicle. For some that's not long after it's paid off. Commuting is huge these days. Not to say after 100k the body is rust in the snow belt.
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
    Gordy said:

    What I want to know is who likes to cook in Freds house? I'm thinking, or hoping not Fred since we all know he thinks tar tastes like black licorice.

    @Gordy, reheats tar to perfection!
    Gordy
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
    I couldn't resist Fred :D
  • hot_rod
    hot_rod Member Posts: 23,255

    My wife gets all stary-eyed when we go to the big box and they have those LG front loaders in a metallic candy apple red. They have digital controls with LED triangle "play buttons" and about 50 different settings. The dryers now have a water hookup for steam press....



    My thoughts, you will use one setting for the vast majority of all clothes, and the water into the dryer.......need I say more?



    I like quality, and am an apparent rarity in that I will pay for quality and longevity. Not just show, and sparkles.



    Most of the high end stuff shares the same internals as the low end stuff, just with more doo-dads on expensive models.



    Taylor

    Take a look at the Fisher Paykel washers and dryers.

    We bought a washer after the store sales person told us every employee at the small appliance shop owned one. They were confident that it will run 20 years

    Top loader, clothes is barely moist after the high speed spin.
    Bob "hot rod" Rohr
    trainer for Caleffi NA
    Living the hydronic dream
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
    That's the key to HE. High speed spin less time in dryer, and less water to do it all. I was amazed by how much less water HE uses through cycles. To me saving water is huge.
  • SWEI
    SWEI Member Posts: 7,356
    Commercial washers have been available with 400 G extraction cycles for several years. Sheets & pillowcases will take about 300 G's before they start to shred.
  • Solid_Fuel_Man
    Solid_Fuel_Man Member Posts: 2,646
    I figured it was nearly 30 gallons of water for a load of laundry. Here in Maine with a private well, the water does not concern me. It's the clothes still wet that costs money and time. I'm curious to what RPM the new top loaders spin. I'd guess my old maytag is around 400-600 range.

    My parents Bosch front load is ridiculously fast spinning as I assume most VFD controlled direct drive units are nowadays. Those clothes are about dry when they come out.

    Taylor
    Serving Northern Maine HVAC & Controls. I burn wood, it smells good!
  • dean_20
    dean_20 Member Posts: 16
    Got to love it.
  • hvacfreak2
    hvacfreak2 Member Posts: 500
    Chlorides is my guess.

    Add 2 Steamaster Tabs per load outta do it.
    hvacfreak

    Mechanical Enthusiast

    Burnham MST 396 , 60 oz gauge , Tigerloop , Firomatic Check Valve , Mcdonnell Miller 67 lwco , Danfoss RA2k TRV's

    Easyio FG20 Controller

    Solid_Fuel_ManSWEIratio
  • KC_Jones
    KC_Jones Member Posts: 5,827
    We recently replaced our washer and dryer, went with a front loader. My water is billed quarterly and we had the washer for one month of the 3 month billing cycle. When I got the bill it had dropped by $20.00. We have been a pretty steady ~$220.00 for a couple years that bill was $200.00. Prices did not change it was savings from that front load washer. To say they use a lot less water is an understatement. I am anxiously awaiting the next bill for a full quarter with it. And the spin cycle sounds like a jet engine spooling up.
    2014 Weil Mclain EG-40
    EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Boiler Control
    Boiler pictures updated 2/21/15
    Boon
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
    They get clothes cleaner with less water also.
  • Paul48
    Paul48 Member Posts: 4,469
    They require some care, or they wind up smelling very bad. Beyond keeping the door gasket clean, you should leave the door open when your done washing. Also, doing a load of "whites" in hot water with a little bleach helps.
    KC_JonesBrewbeer
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
    KC_Jones said:

    We recently replaced our washer and dryer, went with a front loader. My water is billed quarterly and we had the washer for one month of the 3 month billing cycle. When I got the bill it had dropped by $20.00. We have been a pretty steady ~$220.00 for a couple years that bill was $200.00. Prices did not change it was savings from that front load washer. To say they use a lot less water is an understatement. I am anxiously awaiting the next bill for a full quarter with it. And the spin cycle sounds like a jet engine spooling up.

    @KC_Jones if you try to do many small loads, watch you electric bill go up to make up for the water savings. At least with my front loaders, with anything less than a full load, the washer spends an inordinate amount of time rolling back and forth trying to balance the load in order to go into that high speed spin. If it can't, it finally does a slow spin and the clothes are extra wet and then the dryer runs an inordinate amount of time drying them. There are trade offs I guess. I like my Samsung set but no more just washing a single pair of jeans.
  • KC_Jones
    KC_Jones Member Posts: 5,827
    edited January 2017
    @Fred I have 3 kids and I wear shirt and tie to work everyday, small loads don't exist in this house. The electric bill is already high since the wife is a stay at home mom, this house is never "shut down".

    I have watched it run and all the loads I have watched it doesn't spend more than a minute or so with the balancing portion of the cycle. I also have a gas dryer.
    2014 Weil Mclain EG-40
    EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Boiler Control
    Boiler pictures updated 2/21/15
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
    The amount of electricity to balance a load is insignificant.

    My Electrolux washer had a clean cycle every 50 loads. Dump a cup of bleach in the tub hit the sequence for clean tub. Never had a problem with it stinking, or having to leave the door open between loads.

    Kurt mentioned high g extraction shredding sheets. I've had more clothes shredded with top load washers than anything. I don't know what the Electrolux pulled for its extraction G's, but never had a problem tearing up fabrics. I remember when we first got it I sat there watching it go through its cycles to spin out. I thought it was going to take off........

  • Solid_Fuel_Man
    Solid_Fuel_Man Member Posts: 2,646
    At 300G's I'd weigh 55,500 lbs.
    Serving Northern Maine HVAC & Controls. I burn wood, it smells good!
    Gordy
  • KC_Jones
    KC_Jones Member Posts: 5,827
    Ours is in the first floor bathroom. Watching that thing run was better than a newspaper. The one thing that still boggles my mind is how quiet they are. The one we have I seriously think I could put in the living room and the noise level would be fine. The loudest thing is when it fills with water.
    2014 Weil Mclain EG-40
    EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Boiler Control
    Boiler pictures updated 2/21/15
  • Paul48
    Paul48 Member Posts: 4,469
    @Gordy

    I notice you refer to the Electrolux in past-tense. Why is that?
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
    Went with the house I sold. The set was purchased in 05
  • FranklinD
    FranklinD Member Posts: 399
    My mother has a Fisher-Paykel set and she swears by them now. Even withstood 12" of sewage/rainwater backed up during the "great rainstorm of 2012" around here. Of course she had the machines disassembled and gone through, gas valve and electronics replaced in the dryer, but they're still going strong.

    We moved into this house in January 2011 and brought my wife's ancient "Admiral" washer and dryer set...I think they're just rebranded Whirlpools? Anyway, they were already 10 years old and had sat in storage for 3 years while we rented a house that had laundry included.

    The dryer (electric) is still going strong, I replaced the belt once ($7) and the lint trap once ($6). The washer died on Fathers Day 2013, so I got to spend some quality time at my local "Hometown Sears" store.

    Actually, the staff was awesome. This branch is privately and locally owned and they seem to really care about repeat business. Don't buy the warranty, he told me, we can usually repair any issues that'll crop up in the first 3 years for less than $50 anyway. And no issues have cropped up yet. Free delivery, set up, and haul-away of the old unit included.

    We bought the cheapest high-capacity washer they had, a top loader, simply because we have 3 kids and had no money at the time. No electronics on the control panel, just three knobs and a switch. Perfect. It has so far survived 3.5 years of 3-4 full loads per week.

    Then, about 3 months ago, a good friend (his wife, actually) decided that they needed the fancy Samsung dryer that matches their new Samsung washer. So he gave me the "old" dryer - literally 20 months old - for free. It's a real beauty with touch-panel controls, little dancing led lights, plays music when it's finished, I think it even dispenses margaritas while-u-wait. Haven't plugged it in yet.

    Meanwhile his Samsung washer has been recalled and the new dryer spits out "trouble codes" when it feels that its friend, the washer, didn't spin enough moisture out of the clothes.

    Ah, technology.
    Ford Master Technician, "Tinkerer of Terror"
    Police & Fire Equipment Lead Mechanic, NW WI
    Lover of Old Homes & Gravity Hot Water Systems
  • Zman
    Zman Member Posts: 7,611
    I agree that appliances don't last as long as they should. I think if you do your research you should do better than 7 years.
    I have trouble getting more than 7 out of dishwashers and microwaves. My others have gone 10 years and counting.

    The real question is, what would possess a smart couple like Dan and the lovely one to go within 500' of an appliance big box?
    It made for a humorous story but is there not a descent knowledgeable appliance store near by?

    "If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough"
    Albert Einstein