Seven years, tops.

Gordy

Ha dishwashers. Had a GE profile dishwasher, SS inside, and out, auto soap dispenser. That was garbage if you don't buy the right soap the dispenser cakes up. Recoverable, but a process.

The best part it stuck on dry cycle melted everything inside racks, and all. Had to shut it off at the breaker. Out of warranty less than 2 years old. Although a strongly worded phone call got me a brand new one after the service tech looked at it, and decided it was not repairable. Never seen that happen he said. Recall came soon after. The replacement was trouble free except for the soap dispenser to date. Second unit is 8 years old.

GE profile fridge fried mother board out of warranty. Ice maker dispenser always jammed. Profile double oven had to replace convection element. Profile electric glass cook top never had a problem.

Solid_Fuel_Man

Was looking up Fisher&Paykel and there sure are a lot of horrible reviews on Amazon. Most said elements burn out annually in Electric dryer, and that pump and "mother board" fry every couple of years.

I will never get anything with an electronic control if I can help it. Electro-mechanical timers and stone cold reliable. Wet/moist environments with lots of vibration like a washer is murder on electronics. Let alone susceptibility to power surges.

I make my living in the electrical feild....

Taylor

ChrisJ

Solid_Fuel_Man said:

Was looking up Fisher&Paykel and there sure are a lot of horrible reviews on Amazon. Most said elements burn out annually in Electric dryer, and that pump and "mother board" fry every couple of years.



I will never get anything with an electronic control if I can help it. Electro-mechanical timers and stone cold reliable. Wet/moist environments with lots of vibration like a washer is murder on electronics. Let alone susceptibility to power surges.



I make my living in the electrical feild....



Taylor

I've found reviews to be almost useless.
Most people review stuff when they're unhappy and fact is when you produce a few million of a product you're going to have a lot of failures no matter how reliable it is. 2% of 5 million is still 100,000.

Back in 1998 we bought a Toshiba DVD player for around $480, was considered the best one out at the time. I ended up with a girlfriend who worked for Toshiba's tech support. She saw it and said "oh that's going to die, they die all of the time, so many people call complaining"

That DVD player was around long after her, I ended up giving it to a coworker when it was around 13 years old.

She wasn't the sharpest tool in the shed.


Personally, I prefer solid state controls over mechanical, though my monitor tops are still using an 80+ year old mechanical thermostat, but that thing's a work of art, not what you'd get now. That, and I am using a PTC solid state start relay in place of the original mechanical one as I trust it more.

Zman

As far as reviews go, consumer reports does a fairly good job. I also have a good friend in the repair business, an invaluable resource...

ChrisJ

Zman said:

As far as reviews go, consumer reports does a fairly good job. I also have a good friend in the repair business, an invaluable resource...

I've been highly suspicious of Consumer Reports as well.

There's several reasons, but for example, why is it they give Behr paint the top review every year and yet not a single professional painter will touch the stuff, and those that have claim it's garbage compared to Benjamin Moore or Sherwin Williams, both of which year after year get fairly poor reviews?

I've seen this with quite a few things that completely baffled me.

Gordy

Depends how something is reviewed in a lot of cases.

I myself use reviews, but you have to wonder about the person writing them most times.

ChrisJ

Gordy said:

Depends how something is reviewed in a lot of cases.



I myself use reviews, but you have to wonder about the person writing them most times.

Go read reviews on hard drives, 99.999% of them are bad for every single brand and model hard drive. Completely useless.

I try to use reviews, but more and more I realize they are worth very little.

Solid_Fuel_Man

I agree with consumer reports being suspect. Several extended family will only buy big ticket items if CR gives it good reviews. That's why I read people's "personal" reviews on sites. That said there are a lot of idiots and you can generally tell by a report or how it's written.

@ChrisJ I stand by my statement about consumer grade Electro-mechanical controls though. In industrial environments which I work in, the electronics are more robust. It's all about application.

My company services all the traffic lights in our county. Needless to say we are VERY BUSY after some type of power surge. Weven install top notch surge protection, but things can only take so much. The few sites we still have Electro-mechanical, well they are still working. But are very limited, this is silver-contact relays 300% rated etc.

Taylor

ChrisJ

Solid_Fuel_Man said:

I agree with consumer reports being suspect. Several extended family will only buy big ticket items if CR gives it good reviews. That's why I read people's "personal" reviews on sites. That said there are a lot of idiots and you can generally tell by a report or how it's written.



@ChrisJ I stand by my statement about consumer grade Electro-mechanical controls though. In industrial environments which I work in, the electronics are more robust. It's all about application.



My company services all the traffic lights in our county. Needless to say we are VERY BUSY after some type of power surge. Weven install top notch surge protection, but things can only take so much. The few sites we still have Electro-mechanical, well they are still working. But are very limited, this is silver-contact relays 300% rated etc.



Taylor

Here's the inside of the basic 2 knob Monitor Top control.
This controls temperature, defrost and overload. Top left are the contacts, showing their age on this specific control, bottom left is the solder pot overload (spins and forces contacts open when solder melts) and top right is the bellows which are connected to a capillary tube.

There are many many of these still working after 80+ years.

Why they went to the solder pot overload I have no idea. Earlier models used a bi-metal style overload.

MilanD

I have a clothes dryer installed in my backyard that looks like it's from the same year as the year the house was built, 1912. Ropes are gone but, with new ones I'm pretty sure it will still work the same as the day it was installed. I think someone did paint it in the 1980s. Wasn't me.

But, we are now using our ~ 20 year old gas-fired dryer with a mechanical dial heat controller/timer with 3 settings: cold timed tumble, permanent press, and cotton. Also, I honestly don't know what brand it is. I do know it has no buzzer to tell you it's done... darn thing... I can never tell if the clothes are dry - buzzer would have been nice. But, it too came with the house when we moved in, so - no complaints. (Now, because it came with the house, it was either the most expensive or least expensive dryer ever, but I haven't decided yet which it is.) All this said, from an end-user side, the simpler the appliance, the better: less to break, and less to fix. It's yet to do either.

Washer is another story - we replaced the one matching our still working dryer with a LG front loader direct drive motor unit (whatever that is), oh, in 2010, maybe (can't remember - have it written on the thing with a sharpie and am not at home). We purchased it rather than a regular ol' washer when the state was subsidizing the replacement of old thirsty washers, and the old one's water pump happen to croak just about at that time. Ok.

Now, this washer does really well, on minimal water, which is quite amazing. On the flip side, he will often bounce around the basement when spinning on bulky loads. After much thought, I think the problem is that he (yes, it's a 'he' - as in High Efficiency) is depressed, doesn't like we have him in the basement (it's cool and dark in there), that he would be happier upstairs and is trying to tell us so. He doesn't have vocalizing capabilities that I'm aware of, but with this behavior, you can sense something is bothering him... I'm, on the other hand, quite afraid that after so many years in the basement he'd jump out of the window if given a chance on upper floors. So, he'll be staying in the basement. Just imagine, such a smart machine relegated to life of cleaning and living in the basement.... you wouldn't be happy either.

Maybe, that's also the reason why we need 'dumb' machines. A.I. will get us all... and it starts with circuit boards on washers, mark my words.

PinkTavo

We just hit the 20 year mark with our Maytag Washer and Dryer (Electric). I have not had to do anything to them. Our last set of Maytags (that we left in our previous home since a friend bought the place) is now over 30 years old and has only had the belt replaced once. I have been told that these are the "old" style of Maytag that used the same mechanics for many years...and that this changed when they were bought out by Whirlpool.

BobC

@MilanD My outdoor dryer does have a recurring failure, about every 6 or 7 years the rope dies because of UV exposure.

I also have a 1971 GE electric apartment dryer that I used to use only for dress shirts and slacks when I was in management. I replaced the belt about 15 years back and the bearing sounds a bit iffy but I seldom use it these days.

The outdoor dryer is more my speed.

Bob

ChrisJ

When we bought the house in 2011 it had a set of I think, 1980s Whirlpool washer and electric dryer. They still worked, and our neighbor is still using the dryer.

But, the washer honestly sounded like the sinking ship in the movie Dead Calm. Exactly, like it.

We now have a set of "HE" Maytag machines, washer is a toploader, both have glass doors and count down how long is left etc.

MilanD

@BobC - good point on uv degrading of lines! Haven't thought of that!

BobC

UV is tough on rope, nylon is better in that regard but because it stretches so much it does not make a good clothesline.

I noticed my line is getting ratty the other day so it's time to replace it. Nothing more depressing than seeing a line of just washed clothes ending up i the dirt.

Bob

Gordy

Stainless cable Bob done for ever.

PinkTavo

Years ago my folks moved into a place with a backyard clothes line. It ran basically between the garage and the house. When we moved in, in wintertime, we hooked our dog up to the lines (which were stranded metal) with a metal chain and he could run back and forth. Did this for a couple of months until I noticed that the electrical line to the garage was run from the house to the 1st post, then along the clothes lines to the 2nd post and then garage. Lucky for us...no fried dog! Dad had a proper power supply fitted in the summer.

NY_Rob

7 years tops?
My neighbor's 2-yo Frigidaire oven just blew out it's igniter.
Luckily it's a $20 (Amazon) easy to replace/self service part... but 2 years?

On our last fridge.. we replace the ice maker every 3yrs or so.

Garbage!

ChrisJ

And here my fridge turns 84 years old soon.


Although, there is an important part here people are forgetting.

@Gordy How much did you pay for that 5 cubic foot refrigerator the other day?

A 7 cubic foot monitor top was the equivalent to around $3500 today and that's with near zero bells and whistles. Two racks slide out, it has a foot pedal and a 15 watt cabinet light. That's it. No frostfree B.S., no icemaker, no water dispenser.

$3500 for a super reliable small manual defrost refrigerator that will outlast you and your grand kids. Think it would sell today sitting next to a $130-150 one that is about the same size?

KC_Jones

PinkTavo said:

When we moved in, in wintertime, we hooked our dog up to the lines (which were stranded metal) with a metal chain and he could run back and forth.

My uncle was a very hyper kid, my grandmother used to do this with him to burn off energy and not run away which he was known to do.

Gordy

KC_Jones said:

PinkTavo said:

When we moved in, in wintertime, we hooked our dog up to the lines (which were stranded metal) with a metal chain and he could run back and forth.

My uncle was a very hyper kid, my grandmother used to do this with him to burn off energy and not run away which he was known to do.

Lol try that one today as harmless as it is. I'm quite sure someone would call DCFS. As a matter of fact I'd like to see what they could even actually do about it.

DanHolohan

Repair cafes. What do you think?

http://registerguard.com/rg/news/local/35130540-75/eugene-ponders-free-repair-cafes-to-enable-fixing-household-goods.html.csp

Gordy

ChrisJ said:

And here my fridge turns 84 years old soon.


Although, there is an important part here people are forgetting.

@Gordy How much did you pay for that 5 cubic foot refrigerator the other day?

A 7 cubic foot monitor top was the equivalent to around $3500 today and that's with near zero bells and whistles. Two racks slide out, it has a foot pedal and a 15 watt cabinet light. That's it. No frostfree B.S., no icemaker, no water dispenser.

$3500 for a super reliable small manual defrost refrigerator that will outlast you and your grand kids. Think it would sell today sitting next to a $130-150 one that is about the same size?

I just paid 210 bucks for a 3.3 bar fridge. Auto defrost that's it. We will see how long it lasts.

Just think if everything we bought lasted that long.........oh, and I'm sure your monitor top did not last this long by doing absolutely nothing to it right?

ChrisJ

Gordy said:

KC_Jones said:

PinkTavo said:

When we moved in, in wintertime, we hooked our dog up to the lines (which were stranded metal) with a metal chain and he could run back and forth.

My uncle was a very hyper kid, my grandmother used to do this with him to burn off energy and not run away which he was known to do.

Lol try that one today as harmless as it is. I'm quite sure someone would call DCFS. As a matter of fact I'd like to see what they could even actually do about it.

Say what you want about parents and kids these days.

But at least they aren't eating asphalt.

Poor Fred, that's going to take a while to fade away.

KC_Jones

@DanHolohan here is another one along similar lines, but for people that want to build and don't have shop space. I saw this in DC a couple years ago and it's quite impressive.

http://www.techshop.ws/

ChrisJ

Gordy said:

ChrisJ said:

And here my fridge turns 84 years old soon.


Although, there is an important part here people are forgetting.

@Gordy How much did you pay for that 5 cubic foot refrigerator the other day?

A 7 cubic foot monitor top was the equivalent to around $3500 today and that's with near zero bells and whistles. Two racks slide out, it has a foot pedal and a 15 watt cabinet light. That's it. No frostfree B.S., no icemaker, no water dispenser.

$3500 for a super reliable small manual defrost refrigerator that will outlast you and your grand kids. Think it would sell today sitting next to a $130-150 one that is about the same size?

I just paid 210 bucks for a 3.3 bar fridge. Auto defrost that's it. We will see how long it lasts.

Just think if everything we bought lasted that long.........oh, and I'm sure your monitor top did not last this long by doing absolutely nothing to it right?

My specific ones sat for a while, though no one knows how long exactly.

However, there are many, I believe I recall someone saying a few hundred that have never been put out of use since they were bought.

For example there was that lady a while back that traded hers into First Energy under that stupid rebate program. Hers had been in normal use for well over 80 years.

By the mid 1930s General Electric had perfected hermetically sealed refrigeration systems and even units made into the 1950s seem to last forever. The late 1950s is when things started going downhill.

Gordy

KC_Jones said:

@DanHolohan here is another one along similar lines, but for people that want to build and don't have shop space. I saw this in DC a couple years ago and it's quite impressive.

http://www.techshop.ws/

That's a heck of an idea. The only thing I see is liability issues. Insurance for something like that has to be a bit over the top.

Tim McElwain

How about the old gas refrigerators from WWII vintage and before. Several friends of mine have them still working at their summer cabins. Two of them I picked up for them when I was on the road as a serviceman for the gas company. Every so often you clean the 5,000 BTU burner and about every five years turn them upside down for a couple of hours and they are good for five more. That recirculates the ammonia refrigerant. The later Whirlpool versions with ice makers did not last as long. Then again I have a relative that still has one in his basement "man cave" to keep the beer cold.

ChrisJ

Tim McElwain said:

How about the old gas refrigerators from WWII vintage and before. Several friends of mine have them still working at their summer cabins. Two of them I picked up for them when I was on the road as a serviceman for the gas company. Every so often you clean the 5,000 BTU burner and about every five years turn them upside down for a couple of hours and they are good for five more. That recirculates the ammonia refrigerant. The later Whirlpool versions with ice makers did not last as long. Then again I have a relative that still has one in his basement "man cave" to keep the beer cold.

Our forum has a few guys that have Servel absorption type refrigerators. As far as I know, they're not as reliable as even modern refrigerators but it's not really something I know much about.

Most of the guys on the forum have pre-WWII machines like mine.

ttekushan_3

@Tim McElwain I have a Servel in the basement for beverages and power outage insurance. It's really quite wonderful since it never really shuts off, but modulates the flame like the old match-light gas ovens did. There's very little temperature variation and some claim that milk lasts a little longer in them for this reason.
Mine is a "new" one, still having its original 1946 OPA (Office of Price Administration) sticker inside!
The thing I think is important is setting it up with a combustion analyzer. The burner max output and alignment with the fire tube is critical. It can go surprisingly high in CO if really screwed up. Adjust for 0 ppm and you're all set. I only did it once and it's still fine many years later.

Servel vs Monitor Top? Both are benchmarks for longevity and reliability, IMO. They both can fail of course and I know a Servel can clog with a small amount of corrosion products and sometimes rolling the whole thing upside down for awhile can solve it. But not always. Has to be drained and recharged. I hear there's like 2 people in the USA who know the black art of gas refrigeration recharge. But they usually work fine.

Our family dishwasher is 1968 vintage Kitchen Aid. It's required service once. It's a loud, 11 gallon, fast, powerful, heat sanitizing, single spray arm "hurricane in a box." I adore that machine. But it's original retail price converted to current currency was around $2,000!

As for our Maytag washer and dryer, the washer is going to need a compete transmission rebuild here soon. Not bad for 1979. And I will do it.

When it's down for repairs I'll just have to use the Easy dual tub model R. With the spinner instead of a wringer. 1923. Works great. Even the original water pump!

Most new appliances are merely an abstraction to me. Brand new equipment is just one data point at the tail end of an era of mature products. Obviously we're not talking about computers since development is advancing. But automatic washers, refrigerators, vacuum cleaners, etc. were well developed a long time ago. I don't feel deprived by using the vintage ones.

If anything, the short life expectancy is proof that we're really dealing with mature technologies in washing appliances. The manufacturers know that they have to build then that way, since no technical advancement will compel the user to replace an operational or serviceable appliance. Only short life can force a new sale now.

BTW get your new top load Speed Queens while you can. They're built like they used to be. But regulations will ban them from the consumer retail market very soon here.

Solid_Fuel_Man

Tell me more about the speed queen @ttekushan

Would you take one (new) over a two belt Maytag LATxxxxx model? Mine is really starting to show signs of age around the drum, and I do fear rust/leak which I don't want to tackle. Porcelain enameled steel and me welding on it may be the nail in the coffin for my maytag. Don't want to be caught buying junk in an emergency as Dan spelled out in his story.

Taylor

Sal Santamaura

ttekushan said:

...get your new top load Speed Queens while you can. They're built like they used to be. But regulations will ban them from the consumer retail market very soon here.

Where's "here?" The entire US or a particular state/municipality? And when is "soon?"

We've got a nearly 24-year-old Whirlpool matched set that I've kept going with minimal maintenance/repairs. However, the dryer is trying my diagnostic skills. When a load is around 2/3 dry, and the burner starts cycling (vs. continuous on at the beginning), the gas valve 'chatters' at each flame shutoff. I first replaced the coils with no improvement. Thinking the gas valve itself was sticky, I replaced that too. No such luck. Anyone with ideas, please chime in.

As in Dan's house, my wife makes the ultimate laundry room decision. If the dryer can't be kept going and needs replacement, she'll insist on a matched new washer too. I'd pretty much concluded a top-loading Speed Queen was the best choice. If they'll soon become unobtainable, it might make sense to act now and give up on the Whirlpool shotgunning ("troubleshooting" ) Thanks in advance.