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Bosch Greenstar 151 Condensing Boiler not maintaining set temperature

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135

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  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
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    Sawzall surgery
  • wogpa67
    wogpa67 Member Posts: 238
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    Wonder what speed they have those 15-58's on also?
  • Ironman
    Ironman Member Posts: 7,376
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    Hatterasguy said:

    GW said:

    Yes what a bazaar way to pipe a heating system.



    There seems to be a shut off valve, sort of behind the black circ. Look carefully at the shaft of the valve, you will notice flat edges. Are the flats of the shaft horizontal or vertical, or somewhere in between?

    That's the installer's secret valve to get the system to work. He secretly closes that valve and no fluid can bypass the system loops via the Spirotherm. He hoped you wouldn't notice because it's pretty well hidden.

    If you were to fully close that valve, the system might perform perfectly (but lacking any capability to remove air).

    I might give it a try!
    I just saw the "secret valve" with its handle removed. Why would someone do that? Like you said, flow would be right if the valve were closed, but no air removal.

    Bob Boan
    You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
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    Really can it get any simpler to botch.
  • Ironman
    Ironman Member Posts: 7,376
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    Hatterasguy said:

    Ironman said:



    I just saw the "secret valve" with its handle removed. Why would someone do that? Like you said, flow would be right if the valve were closed, but no air removal.

    She's right nearby. I should go over there and just close that valve and see what happens............... !!

    I could check the programming parameters as well, but that's probably not the issue.
    It seems she wants someone local who could fix this mess.

    @ant930,
    Hatterusguy has offered to help you out. Contact him if you want someone on site.
    Bob Boan
    You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
    edited February 2015
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    I would be willing to bet the valve is closed with the handle removed for obvious reasons.
  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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    Hi everyone... just got back.. where is Hatterusguy located?...
  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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    wish I knew what you see as far as the valve goes.... actually... is it just under the black circulator?
  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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    Hatterusguy... what is your number?... if you can't post it on her my email is adlara13@aol.com
  • Ironman
    Ironman Member Posts: 7,376
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    @ant930,

    If you can see the threaded stem in the center of the valve, if the flat sides of the stem are at top and bottom (12 O'clock and 6 O'clock), then the valve is shut; if the flats are at 6 & 9 O'clock, the valve is open. It needs to be shut.
    Bob Boan
    You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.
  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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    brb.... going to check
  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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    I believe that the flat are at 12 and 6 tok a pic... let me see how it came out
  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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    Will this be able to be fixed? without a load of money? Don't need it to be "pretty" as someone mentioned earlier.... lol.... it kinda is prettier... although wrong...compared to the dirty oil burner that was there...
  • Ironman
    Ironman Member Posts: 7,376
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    The valve is closed, as it needs to be to cause flow through the loop.

    You won't know how much it will cost until the problem is found.

    Again, it's the installer's responsibility to make this boiler heat your home properly.

    IDK how it is in NY, but here in VA, if a contractor fails to perform a contract properly, the HO can hire someone else to make it right and the original contractor is responsible for all costs to correct it.

    I hate to see it go the route of litigation if it can be avoided, but I would be telling the contractor that if he didn't stop blame-shifting and get it heating correctly immediately, that you're gonna take action against him.

    Check with consumer affairs and the contractor board in your city/state to see what can be done.
    Bob Boan
    You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.
  • wogpa67
    wogpa67 Member Posts: 238
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    Page 30 of your Install manual shows how Bosch wants the boiler piped. Show that to the installer and have them pipe it as such.
  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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    Thanks Bob... I will do that ... I think we have similar consumer protection laws here in New York too... Will check online before driving to Consumer Affairs on Monday...would you say that getting it to heat correctly means redoing all the pipes... or can we get this thing to do as its supposed to with less work even if as everyone agrees... that piping looks like crap?...lol
  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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    Hmmm Wogpa67... happen to have the manual right here...got it..
  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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    of course not being the professional as you all are....not understanding much but have gained quite a lot ok knowledge on here from everyone... thank you!
  • GW
    GW Member Posts: 4,693
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    Both the piping and the controls need to do their jobs. If Both do their job, the heat will work as it did before. Disecting the Better Practices can be discussed for another 100 posts. Based on the pics amd info discussed it seems to be a control and or setup issue, If those two pumps are indeed moving water. These are many nuances that every heating pro knows, yet the non pro doesn't. If the installer did this poorly with the pipes, the control wiring is presumably worse. Maybe the installer can get a smarter person over there to get things connected
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    gary@wilsonph.com
  • Paul48
    Paul48 Member Posts: 4,469
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    I'm afraid getting the original installer to straighten things out would be a waste of time. You need to get a refusal ( in writing) from him, to make it right. Then you can seek compensation, for hiring someone else.
  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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    I feel the same way Paul... if they couldn't get it right the first time it would be a waste of time... ... only thing is... how to get a written refusal... i am thinking of making a list of all that I found out today that is wrong... just printed out 18 pages of our conversations.... then will present them with the knowledge from everyone on here and ask what they are going to do about it...not sure other than being direct how to proceed
  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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    here we go again... More SNOW!!! so done!!!
  • Paul48
    Paul48 Member Posts: 4,469
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    Don't show your hand yet! Can you email them, with a request to fix it? Or get an email from them (mis) identifying the problems with the system.Tell them you need to know in order to proceed with getting it fixed.
  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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    I do believe I can do that ...... and when they email back saying its my insulation and windows and baseboards ... and on and on...thats my refusal....is that correct?... I hate this kinda crap... but usually prevail.... just so time consuming...
  • Paul48
    Paul48 Member Posts: 4,469
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    There ya go.....If you went at them, with "guns-a-blazin", it would make it harder. And I agree about this winter...I'm soooo done with it!
  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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    Have to say I have met a lot of very nice people on here... kinda restores ones faith that people are caring and helpful....Where are you located Paul? ....
  • Paul48
    Paul48 Member Posts: 4,469
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    I'm across LI Sound in CT. There are a lot of good folks on this site.
  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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    There sure are!!I don't even chat on Facebook like I did on here and unlike Facebook ... I learned a lot
  • Paul48
    Paul48 Member Posts: 4,469
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    I don't do the Facebook thing. I didn't do the drama in High School, I'm sure not gonna do it at my age.
  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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    I have a page....Guess I am a voyeur.... just look at pics of far away relatives and their kids.... people are so stuck on social media that they no longer know how to socialize in person.... so sad...... anyway... thanks for your help.. advice... chatting... go enjoy the rest of weekend... goes tooo fast..
  • Ironman
    Ironman Member Posts: 7,376
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    @ant930 ,
    I just sent you and email with the applications manual and the particular page that relates to your install.

    Was the "system sensor" installed on the piping beside the closely spaced Tees? If not, the boiler will not supply the correct water temp even if the ODR curve is set correctly.
    Bob Boan
    You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.
  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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    the FW200 is on the unit itself..
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
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    Restoring faith in any industry is a never ending battle with knuckle heads like that doing work. But it's the same in all facets of construction. It makes it hard for a consumer to know they are choosing the right contractor for all types of work. Especially when that work is the mechanicals in a home.
    Canucker
  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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    so true.... I was married to a tradesman who retired 2 years ago... he got tired of lazy do-nothings that stood around texting or consumed by their phones... had to "fix" many other peoples mistakes..... thats why when it comes to things of that nature... I don't trust anyone but him.... lol... he doesn't do HVAC though
  • R Mannino
    R Mannino Member Posts: 440
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    The system sensor that Ironman is talking about is pretty important. It's the sensor located just to the left of the boiler, just above the center black tee. It's location is critical. Sorry about the photo quality (phone camera).
  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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    thank you!! Pic was fine!
  • ant930
    ant930 Member Posts: 111
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    Good Morning Everyone....I think we have dissected all of the things wrong and that need to be fixed which I have copied all and made a list... should I get several estimates from authorized installers and should I mention the things you all pointed out... or see if they even mention them at which point... maybe they are not going to do a much better job than what I have?... Thank you...
  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
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    Good morning,

    See if they mention any piping issues. See if they notice the things mentioned. Look for reactions as to what they see. If they dont, Weed out the Riff Raff. Dont show your hand. You now know where to go to make a choice..

  • Gordy
    Gordy Member Posts: 9,546
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    Careful though.......or you will become addicted to hydronics.
    Canucker

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