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why can't I weld copper?

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jumper
jumper Member Posts: 2,530

Heat up a pin hole and apply some brazing metal?

Comments

  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 17,325

    Do you want to braze copper, or weld copper?

    Both can be done. But I'm not understanding your question?

    You can absolutely braze over a pinhole using 15% silphos.

    Single pipe 392sqft system with an EG-40 rated for 325sqft and it's silent and balanced at all times.

    SuperTech
  • ratio
    ratio Member Posts: 4,220

    I've used 15% silphos to repair burst convector coils many times. Gotta chew the fins away to get in to the split sometimes. Also repaired a pinhole in a steam main, but it took some 55% to wet the steel before I could fill with the 15%.

  • MaxMercy
    MaxMercy Member Posts: 600
    edited March 10

    If you scuff just around the pin hole, and you add a tiny bit of flux right at the hole, you can usually blob some solder and stop the leak. This of course is a temporary solution but will buy you time, but to answer your question, you need the right brazing rod. I still wouldn't trust it - one pin hole often means there's another close by.

  • GroundUp
    GroundUp Member Posts: 2,510

    That'll be up to you to figure out. Most plumbing/HVAC guys can braze up a pinhole pretty easily, and any decent TIG welder can weld copper.

  • Larry Weingarten
    Larry Weingarten Member Posts: 4,077
    edited March 10

    Hi, I'd go with the 15% silphos. Use mapp gas. I repaired many freeze damaged copper solar collectors using this approach. More or less heat affects how the filler metal flows, so you have a lot of control. I do like to clean the copper thoroughly first.

    Yours, Larry

    Mad Dog_2SuperTech
  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 16,564

    what are you trying to accomplish?

  • jumper
    jumper Member Posts: 2,530

    When I'm trying to fall asleep I remember stuff from decades ago. Like when installing new underground water service. Sometimes somehow new copper pipe got dinged in the trench. When nobody was around of course. Patching; brazing; and welding was prohibited.

    Mad Dog_2
  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 16,564

    sems like a flare union would be the obvious choice.

  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 17,325

    As far as I recall brazing is allowed for buried pipe soft soldering isn't.

    A flare works but a pack joint or similar coupler would probably be the first choice most would make.

    Single pipe 392sqft system with an EG-40 rated for 325sqft and it's silent and balanced at all times.

  • hot_rod
    hot_rod Member Posts: 27,372

    what type copper, how old, what’s in the tube, pressure?

    Bob "hot rod" Rohr
    trainer for Caleffi NA
    Living the hydronic dream
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 20,111

    As far as brazing copper it's done all the time especially in refrigeration you can just about fix anything if you can get to the leak. Coils are tough to repair first you have to cut the fins off and the tubing is usually very thin so too much heat and it will disappear in a hurry.

    As far as using it on water it will work but I don't know if brazing rod is lead free.

    Does solder have to be sanitation approved?

    And as @GroundUp up mentioned you can tig copper.

    Mad Dog_2
  • hot_rod
    hot_rod Member Posts: 27,372

    This Blockade is a great product for patching or loose joints. A lot less $$ compared to silver bearing rods.

    Low melt point, caps nicely.

    Nothing about NSF however if it is potable water.

    Screenshot 2026-03-10 at 7.59.02 PM.png
    Bob "hot rod" Rohr
    trainer for Caleffi NA
    Living the hydronic dream
  • 4GenPlumber
    4GenPlumber Member Posts: 132

    If your question is, "why is it prohibited" and not, "is it possible"? The answer is a contamination concern. On a water main, underground, a pin hole is what the backflow people call aspiration. Aspiration on a pipe can cause the venturi affect and with flow changes, turn a pinhole into a suction port (very basic description) and draw ground water into domestic main causing contamination. For a long time soldering underground at all was prohibited (not so anymore I believe) and brazing was supposed to be inspected (dont think so anymore either). With flare unions and water service locking compression fittings, its literally never necessary. I have had to braze repairs on soft copper that supplied gas lamps, but thats fuel code, not plumbing, dont think its at all addressed in the mechanical code.

  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 17,325
    edited 11:14AM

    I mentioned a pack joint earlier, there's also other variations of it, all of which seem very beefy and durable.

    Here's a video showing a few of them and how they work. I don't remember why I picked a pack joint over the others, but it's the only one I've used and I trusted it enough to even use it in my basement.

    https://youtu.be/o434Q41khg0?si=3xR6ukKwAzWL7Y6A

    Single pipe 392sqft system with an EG-40 rated for 325sqft and it's silent and balanced at all times.

  • pecmsg
    pecmsg Member Posts: 7,032

    https://youtu.be/IBxEpB4ZqRs

  • pecmsg
    pecmsg Member Posts: 7,032
  • hot_rod
    hot_rod Member Posts: 27,372

    I think you would need an actual venturi for any flow to be pulled into a pipe or tube under pressure?

    The venturi creates a low pressure zone, this is how a carburetor works, the soap nozzle on your pressure washer, or your aquarium vacuum.

    Backflow or backsiphonage would be need to create a negative pressure to pull water in. Which could be possible with a broken main or large fire hydrant draw up stream.

    Screenshot 2026-03-11 at 8.49.36 AM.png Screenshot 2026-03-11 at 8.50.21 AM.png
    Bob "hot rod" Rohr
    trainer for Caleffi NA
    Living the hydronic dream
  • jumper
    jumper Member Posts: 2,530

    I think solder underground is correctly prohibited. But I bet SuperGirl can find countless examples with her xray vision. I've come across them numerous times. I also think that there's gazillions of leaking solder connections underground since I've come across those too.

  • pecmsg
    pecmsg Member Posts: 7,032

    silly question

    Did you get all the water out!

  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 16,564

    that might be the main reason not to solder underground