2 pipe steam radiator electric valve

Steamheatnyccoop · August 22

Hi -

I am renovating a nyc coop apartment. I would like to add an electronic valve to turn the radiator on/off as it is always too hot in the winter.

A local plumber refused to do it saying it will make noises and says he can only install a danfoss valve which is not electric.

Please recommend what type of valve to use. I was thinking of running a 24v normally open steam solenoid valve which when energized will close the valve and shut off the heat.

Thanks.

109A_5 · August 23

Probably something like this.

https://www.supplyhouse.com/Honeywell-Home-V8043J1037-3-4-NPT-Connection-Zone-Valve-normally-open-no-manual-opener-for-Steam-applications-24v

Steamhead · August 23

The Danfoss thermostatic valve will do what you want, with a lot less complication.

Steamheatnyccoop · August 23

Can you please provide a link for the danfoss thermostatic valve? Why is there less complication? Why is the plumber warning that adding an electric valve will cause noises?

Jamie Hall · August 23

Less complication is simple — no wiring or anything like that to worry about it, and they're meant for the job.

If this is really two pipe, it will be fine. Now if it were one pipe, no. And your plumber would be absolutely right.

109A_5 · August 23

Some Danfoss links.

https://www.danfoss.com/en-us/products/dhs/radiator-and-room-thermostats/radiator-thermostats/radiator-valves/ra2000-valves/

https://www.danfoss.com/en-us/products/dhs/radiator-and-room-thermostats/radiator-thermostats/radiator-sensors/

Also with 24 VAC valve operators some folks may complain about the humming or any noise they make.

And since the valve you specified is normally open you would have to use the AC (cooling) functionality of a thermostat to control it. Or add a relay.

Steamheatnyccoop · August 23

How does the danfoss valve work if not electric? Is it either open or closed, or are there middle settings?

PC7060 · August 23

Thermostatic Radiator Valve. Opens and closed based on room temp

109A_5 · August 23

Here is the operations video what won't play from the Danfoss page.

https://youtu.be/97nBHArbAp8

mattmia2 · August 23

the thermostatic element modulates how far open the valve is based on room temp. you can get control heads that move the sensing element or setting dial or both away from the radiator.

PC7060 · August 23

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1863038#Comment_1863038

solenoid snap off / on and hum as previously mentioned. Fine in equipment cabinets but would be annoying in living space.
The plumbers sounds pretty knowledgeable; his recommends was right on. I respect his refusing to install the powered solenoid, he avoided a bunch of call backs.

Steamheatnyccoop · August 23

Arent there other types of electric valves? Not solenoid - no snap on/off? Perhaps one that opens and closes slowly?

What causes the humming? Energizing the valve? Are there valves that only get energized for a few moments to turn the valve open/closed rather than stay energized to keep the valve open or closed?

EBEBRATT-Ed · August 23

They make valves for commercial use that operate slowley but the price will choke a horse.

Use the Danfoss valve

ratio · August 23

A ball valve with an actuator will give you two position, floating, or modulating, depending on the actuator; along with fail-safe (spring open) operation.

I can't imagine it competing with the Danfoss WRT cost.

mattmia2 · August 23

The right algorithm to modulate it electronically will be hard to because it will have to compensate for the mass of the cast iron, it will have to know that it won't sense the effects of what it does now for several to tens of minutes so it needs to have some sort of response curve programmed or to learn it.

pecmsg · August 23

before you mess with anything with the steam system you better check with the co-op board first. You might own the co-op but you don’t own the steam heating system

Jamie Hall · August 23

Look. I do realise that in this modern age if it isn't electric and doesn't have at least one computer chip in it it's old-fashioned. However. The Danfoss valve is simple, silent, and utterly reliable and has been working for getting on for 80 years now. What's not to like?

109A_5 · August 23

The electrical power grid in the United States is 60 Hz AC (60 Hertz or 60 Cycles per Second, Alternating Current). Any electrical mechanical device powered by AC power has the potential to hum or buzz at 60 Hz. Some folks, the slightest odd noise drives them nuts, others don't care.

Taco makes zone valves for Hot water systems with a wax motor and they claim they are silent, sadly (as far as I know) they don't make a valve that is suitable for your application.

There are other ways to tame excessively hot radiators, but regulation (if possible) is probably the best.

You may want to review the Danfoss thermostatic valve solution with your plumber.

mattmia2 · August 23

There are a number of other manufacturers of heat motor type valves, there might even be a heat motor type actuator for Danfoss valves. The problem will be finding one that is rated for seam. The Taco zone sentry valves are pretty quiet too although i don't know if they are rated for steam.

The Steam Whisperer · August 24

I have found that installing Danfoss valves on two pipe steam often will start banging in the radiator it is on. This is probably because the restriction of the Danfoss valve lowers the pressure in the radiator. Then all the steam in the return lines, due to bad traps, really likes to head to that radiator because the pressure in radiator is lower than anything else around…bang, clunk, bang.

Jamie Hall · August 24

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1863118#Comment_1863118

Not really the fault of the valve. If you have steam in the return lines on a two pipe system, you have other problems — and shooting the messenger isn't going to help.

mattmia2 · August 24

although in a coop you have little recourse to get the problems affecting your apartment that are in other apartments fixed.

2 pipe steam radiator electric valve

Comments

Categories