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Old HP system failed: new refrigerant choice? new equipment reliability?

WDGIBBS_M_E
WDGIBBS_M_E Member Posts: 36
in THE MAIN WALL

Retired (non-HVAC) Mech Engineer. Good understanding of HVAC system configurations and cycles, including vapor injection compressors for "cold climate" HPs. Spent two years trying to arrange for A2W hydronic system replacement but cost is still a barrier and I'm reconsidering a ducted replacement. Quotes still very high & at age 76 I'm not going to get payback….. Electricity rates going up fast…. Natural gas not available. Western Virginia mixed climate.

I'm hearing 454B is in short/expensive supply; R32 more readily available. Can't get R290 yet; bummer! Also hearing new equipment reliability is poor. Who is making the "good stuff" and which refrigerant should I choose?? (Note: most reasonable proposal so far is Bosch 20 SEER.)

Comments

  • pecmsg
    pecmsg Member Posts: 6,204

    R-290 is strictly refrigeration not comfort cooling.

  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 13,126

    What is wrong with the old one? The refrigerant choice probably has little to do with the system efficiency or reliability if it is engineered to that refrigerant. Not sure about leaks. I suppose you could pressure test everything but the condenser for a few weeks, it is likely the leaks are there from the factory.

  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 18,010

    This is the wrong time to buy. It seems reliability and the new equipment and new refrigerants are not very compatible right now. If I was going to make a choice I might buy Goodman. Last I knew they were R-32 and do not use the ill fated microchannel coils. In the past they (Goodman) had a reputation of being cheap crap. Now everything is expensive crap

    SuperTech
  • ratio
    ratio Member Posts: 4,029

    I got the last 2 ton 410 system at the local supply house to replace Mom's condenser.

    It was literally less than the cost of two juggies of 454B. 🤯

  • WDGIBBS_M_E
    WDGIBBS_M_E Member Posts: 36

    R290 is common in residential monobloc HP in Europe and Asia, for years now. Not yet approved here.

    22 yr-old retrofit system is Carrier R22 single speed (electric resistance boost for 3-ton unit) with variable speed fan in AHU (in attic). AHU fan motor/module died. I'm trying to get all ducts and equipment (and aluminum wiring) out of the attic for sealing/insulation improvement but not enough headroom in the basement for normal duct work; town inspector won't approve. Alternative to hydronics may be AHU in the basement and ducted to/thru the attic (1960s ranch). Manual J design heating load is 50k; cooling 29k.

  • pecmsg
    pecmsg Member Posts: 6,204

    basement……. ducted mini split.

  • GGross
    GGross Member Posts: 1,536

    Only Issue I am having with the new refrigerant is sourcing 20lb cylinders of R-454b. We have been selling both R-454b and R-32 equipment without issue, we also still have a very large stock of 410a equipment though, which has seriously helped us with the A2l tank shortage. Between the 2 new refrigerants there won't be any noticeable differences to the end user, assuming you are comparing like for like equipment, and the differences to the installer are pretty much non-existent beyond the shortage of 20lb tanks of R454b. I recently installed some 410a equipment for myself but really I only went that route because it helps move some of that stock off our shelves before the end of the year when we aren't allowed to install it anymore.

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