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Spacepak loses 24 volts after brief power glitch, returns if 240 volt breaker cycled off/on

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  • 109A_5
    109A_5 Member Posts: 4,346

    I wonder if that is a date code, 16th week of 1989.

    image.png image.png
    National - U.S. Gas Boiler 45+ Years Old
    Steam 300 SQ. FT. - EDR 347
    One Pipe System
  • Jamie Hall
    Jamie Hall Member Posts: 27,701

    A glitch with that thing could cause all sorts of hard to track down problems!

    Br. Jamie, osb
    Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 20,864

    The suspected "Utility Problem" IMHO is the first problem to follow up on IMHO.

    Troubleshooting IMHO is not only the process of looking for the problem which sometimes results in tunnel vision but just as much about eliminating any possible problems.

    How long would it take to walk around and ask the neighbors if they are having power glitches?

    If they are not then fine cross that off the list. The OP said the service drop to the house has already been changed so if the neighbors have no issue cross the utility off the list. The cost is basically "0" to do this.

  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 12,679
    https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1902327#Comment_1902327

    As far as solving the problem on the Pulse furnace where the problem manifested itself, I believe the next generation of ignition controls had the WatchGuard device built into the control. So the problem was solved with the “Band-Aid patch” inside the control, and you did not see it. Since this patch worked so well (customers stoped complaining) we may as well use it. Why bother trying to fix it in the first place when we can just patch it.

    Edward Young Retired

    After you make that expensive repair and you still have the same problem, What will you check next?

  • Jamie Hall
    Jamie Hall Member Posts: 27,701
    https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1902348#Comment_1902348

    Mostly insatiable curiousity, @EdTheHeaterMan !

    Br. Jamie, osb
    Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England
  • Jon_23
    Jon_23 Member Posts: 29
    https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1902347#Comment_1902347

    As I have stated previously:

    " I have bothered the power company plenty. Short of buying a very expensive Fluke line monitor, it is going to be hard to catch anything to get them to look harder. I am one of 3 customers on my transformers and my neighbors also notice some 'glitches' during storms but it doesn't seem to cause any problems to their equipment. "

  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 20,864

    It's pretty simple

    Ask your neighbors to note the date and time when you have a glitch. See if it coincides with your issues.

    if you don't want to then don't.

  • Jon_23
    Jon_23 Member Posts: 29

    I have asked them and 'yes' they occasionally notice 'glitches' during storms but none of them have any problems with their equipment shutting off, so they just think it's part of living where we live. I have also put in another request with my power company to leave a power quality monitor on my line again. We have a lot of late afternoon storms this time of year so probably the best chance for them to document it.

  • Jamie Hall
    Jamie Hall Member Posts: 27,701
    https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1902401#Comment_1902401

    "none of them have any problems with their equipment shutting off".

    That tells me, right away, that your equipment, for some reason, is unusually sensitive — or outright faulty. Particularly in situations like this, it is essential that you check your own setup first, and rule out any possible problems with that.

    Br. Jamie, osb
    Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England
  • pecmsg
    pecmsg Member Posts: 7,450

    Trouble codes

    Trouble codes

    Trouble codes

  • 109A_5
    109A_5 Member Posts: 4,346
    https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1902406#Comment_1902406

    Waiting for storm

    Waiting for storm

    Waiting for storm

    National - U.S. Gas Boiler 45+ Years Old
    Steam 300 SQ. FT. - EDR 347
    One Pipe System
    Intplm.
  • 109A_5
    109A_5 Member Posts: 4,346

    Unless the neighbors have the exact same equipment they may never experience the same inconvenience with their equipment.

    I could better explain what I see with that control board (assuming it is the control board locking out and not the WetSwitch) however you all would probably fall asleep in your Beer.

    National - U.S. Gas Boiler 45+ Years Old
    Steam 300 SQ. FT. - EDR 347
    One Pipe System
  • Intplm.
    Intplm. Member Posts: 3,134

    Line loss glitch…maybe a transformer needs to be installed on a pole near you??

    Storms with wind and rain? Do branches hit the wires, causing the brownout glitch issue? It's something to look into and should not be ignored.

  • Jamie Hall
    Jamie Hall Member Posts: 27,701

    I give up.

    Br. Jamie, osb
    Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England
  • 109A_5
    109A_5 Member Posts: 4,346

    This is AI so it may not be 100% accurate, but I found it interesting. The exclusion of "brief fluctuations under five minutes" is maybe why they are not overly aggressive finding the power quality issue.

    image.png
    National - U.S. Gas Boiler 45+ Years Old
    Steam 300 SQ. FT. - EDR 347
    One Pipe System
  • 109A_5
    109A_5 Member Posts: 4,346
    edited August 21

    (I'm not a Lawyer) So I guess this could be read as; If you have equipment that is too sensitive to specific infrequent fluctuations or Voltage anomalies that negatively influences or agitates your equipment you are on your own to resolve the issue. (cough, cough) Double-conversion (online) UPS with good battery maintenance (cough, cough). Expensive, but works well if well maintained.

    Nice…

    image.png

    It appears the embedded electronics / software folks need to do a better job. Asking the question; "Do I really need to be locked out if the fault goes away in milliseconds and the fault is very infrequent…".

    To me, in this case it sounds like a timer to invoke an 'as needed' A/C system reset for the Win.

    Unless you prove it is the WetSwitch and go with another moisture detecting device or you prove it is the control board and find another control board that is a later revision that addresses the power quality issue.

    I do not believe your present control board is actually defective, just an unfortunate gap in design oversight.

    National - U.S. Gas Boiler 45+ Years Old
    Steam 300 SQ. FT. - EDR 347
    One Pipe System
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 20,864

    Back in the day on commercial oil & gas burners we used a lot of Fireye combustion control programmers in our area. They worked better than Honeywell at that time and Fireye used to be located in Cambridge, Ma.

    Those older controls you mounted a sub base and wired the sub base and then mounted the control on the sub base. They were all tubes, mechanical timers and relays back then. 1970s

    1980 they came out with and electronic version of the control. It fit the same subbase. The old control was a model 5022. The new electronic version was D-5022

    Occasionally you would notice a burner short cycle on low water. With the 5022 the burner would shut down -post purge-pre purge and it would get some condensate back in the time it took to purge and light off again.

    Took us a while to figure out if you had to replace that old control with the nw electronic D-5022. when it shut down on low water if the contacts in the LWCO chattered instead of the burner recycling it would go into lockout-flame failure.

    Of course Fireye said this was not possible but that's what happened on many jobs so we would have to find a way around that issue. nothing was mentioned in their troubleshooting chart about that it took us a few jobs and quite a few hours to figure that out.

    Intplm.

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