Need Radiator Valve that closes completely!

Jon_23

I have a 2 pipe steam vapor system from the 1930's. I have a problem with thermal expansion 'ticking' in the master bedroom. This is from a steam pipe that supplies the bedroom just above the master bedroom. (there were some modifications done to this wall in the 1980's and I suspect the pipes were moved and there may be some copper in there now).

If I open the valve to this upstairs radiator, the ticking is rapid and goes away as soon as the radiator is hot. If I close the valve (as completely as possible), the ticking is much slower, but continues. Even with the valve closed, the supply pipe and the valve get hot and the first section of this upstairs radiator gets a little warm so I suspect the valve leaks some, even when closed. The valve mechanism turns easily.

Are there specific brands or types of steam radiator valves that will close completely so I can get rid of this ticking? (the room above has another radiator and is too hot with both of them on anyway). I have read some reviews of new valves online that complain that they are not air (or steam) tight! Thank you.

Jamie Hall

The only way to ensure a steam and airtight shutoff is also the easiest way — believe it or not.

Undo the union holding the valve to the radiator.

Unscrew the valve from the riser. It may resist being unscrewed — use a crescent wrench which fits on the valve, but use a pipe wrench as a backup on the riser. Put the valve somewhere safe so that if it's ever wanted again you or someone else can find it. You can put it back on the radiator but tipped to one side.

Thread a cap onto the riser (use tape and dope).

Done.

Jon_23

I was thinking about capping the riser but this is little too permanent for me. I would rather have a valve that I could really shut and let the next owner worry about it if he/she needs two rads in the upstairs bedroom.

ethicalpaul

At least some new valves do close completely…is the existing one close enough in dimension to be able to be replaced?

Metalguy

I don't know about completely closing off a steam radiator. I have read countless times in numerous publications that one should NEVER completely close off a steam radiator, as the pressure could build up in the pipe that feeds that radiator excessively and could cause a pipe or valve to burst.

I've also read that if you are getting banging/hammering/extreme hissing from a steam radiator, than it probably isn't "Tilted" or "Shimmed" enough and isn't letting cold air out fast enough.

You could probably try a different/larger vent size, or shim the valve/feed side of the radiator and see if that helps (That worked in my home), if not, try shimming the opposite end of the radiator, than if that doesn't help, you could always try removing that radiator, taking it outside and blowing it out with air or water, which would also be a great time to wash/clean it and maybe sprat paint it, if nesc., because it's much easier to spray paint big old cast iron rads than it is to paint them with a brush.

Good luck

Mad Dog_2

I have used Hoffman Steam radiator shut off valves with the best success. The right angle radiator valves I installed 23 years ago on my antique Vapor system still close 100% as they did the day they went in (Top of the food chain $$$ but well worth it. As far as the ticking, thats expanding pipe below the floors and in the walls that are rubbing up against the joists..Mad Dog

Jon_23

Thanks for the comments. I'll look for a Hoffman valve! It is safe to completely shut off a steam valve on a 2 pipe system. Thanks again. Jon

Mad Dog_2

Of course. Thats what they are there for. Mad Dog

Jon_23

Yes, I was responding to Metalguy. There is often some confusion with one pipe systems as a closed but leaky valve can let a little steam in but not let water out. Never an issue with 2 pipe systems. Thanks.

pecmsg

I don't know about completely closing off a steam radiator. I have read countless times in numerous publications that one should NEVER completely close off a steam radiator, as the pressure could build up in the pipe that feeds that radiator excessively and could cause a pipe or valve to burst.

I'd like to see that!

CoachBoilermaker

Why hasn't anyone mentioned turning the valve upside down trick?

Jon_23

The turn the 'valve' (air vent) upside down is a 1 pipe 'trick.' I'm talking about a 2 pipe system. Jon

Jon_23

A litttle follow up. Prior to replacing the valve, I took it apart and did some research. It looks to be a Legend T-437 or S-437 (just by shape and design). It does have a hole in the stem that makes it 'leak' a small amount when closed. I really don't think I need this on a functioning 2-pipe vapor system. The radiator is in a warm room with no risk of freezing. The steam trap on the radiator is in good shape.

I put a drop of solder into the stem and all my noise problems are gone.

I can't see how this is going to 'blow up' or cause problems. Any thoughts? Thanks.

Grallert

A lot of things would have to go very very wrong for anything to blowup. Good idea with the drop of solder.

Intplm.

Commercially we used ball valves for rebuilding low, medium and high pressure steam traps. They gave a positive shut off. If you can keep the current angle valve and move the radiator, you can add a ball valve and nipple. The ball valve would follow the angle valve and install directly into the radiator.

mattmia2

is this a metering valve for the vapor system?

Jon_23

This valve is the input valve (control valve) located high on one side of a single radiator in 2 pipe steam system for a large house (6 bedrooms, over 20 radiators total). The fix works (just trying to prevent all flow to this single radiator because of expansion noises caused by inaccesable supply piping to this single radiator.) Not trying to do anything fancy. I guess I was surprised that they used such a valve design in this 2 pipe system. I guess it was to prevent waterlogging and possible freezing damage? I'll open the valve fully a few times per season, but keep in closed at night when I'm trying to sleep! Thanks all!