American Standard vs Lennox - Help Me Decide

JustinS

Hi everyone

I'm currently evaluating upgrading to variable capacity heat pump to address cooling issues on my 2nd floor (back of house gets 7 degF warmer than front). The 2nd floor has been zoned to address this but due to the single stage AC unit in place, it's fairly loud with lots of cold air in certain rooms.

So far, I have received proposals for the following

American Standard Platinum 20 / TAM9

The American Standard seems to have superior zoning in that it supports fully-modulating dampers, air handler and compressor unit from 25-100% (0.1% increments). With the fully modulating air handler, it seems to me that the system is more likely to be able to run consistently at a lower capacity and air flow while maintaining setpoint.

On the other hand, it is more expensive and I'm not crazy about the XL1050 thermostat UI. While I could accept the UI, I am more concerned about the poor reviews (1.5 stars average on AS website for 10 total reviews) that I find online, mainly focused on the unit needing to replaced after a short time (sometimes repeatedly). Many of these reviews are relatively recent (6 months).

So while the capabilities of the system may be superior, if the thermostat isn't reliable, well, that doesn't matter much.

Lennox EL18XPV / CBA38MV

The Lennox has simple open/close dampers and while its air handler / condenser can modulate from 35-100 (1.0% increments), the S30 thermostat doesn't actively modulate the air handler like American Standard. Instead, a desired air flow is specified for circulation, cooling and heating by zone. This may be OK and probably is, as it seems like American Standard / Trane are one of the few vendors with full modulation.

As one might expect, it is also less expensive. In addition, I feel that the S30 is much more user friendly in its UI as well as its openness to home automation. Its reviews aren't amazing but they seem better (3.3 stars average on Lennox website for hundreds of reviews) than American Standard.

Any thoughts? Suggestions, recommendations?

Many thanks in advance

-Justin

HVACNUT

Be more concerned with proper duct sizing air air sealing.
The AS is modulating so will be more forgiving on airflow. I just completed a Carrier Infinity job where you go through the UI settings and it will calculate CFM, air loss, sub cooling, etc. Pretty cool stuff.
But I don't know if I'm sold (as a homeowner) on the technology and overall repair/maintenance costs. Personally, I'd be inclined to go with a simple high efficiency 2 stage.
Carrier spec'd shielded control wiring. I don't know what AS says but it's something to think about when doing a change out. The systems I set up were new construction. 

Jamie Hall

Two thoughts. First, on-line reviews are biased very heavily to people who have had problems. They are useful sometimes to tell you what problems may have happened, but are quire useless in telling you the actual quality of the product. Further, particularly with complex systems, they often reflect either installer or user generated problems, not problems with the units themselves.

Second, and far more important, is the skill and quality of the installer. A poor installation can turn the best unit in the world into pure junk. So I'd pick on the basis of the installer, with a bias towards a simpler system.

pecmsg

Concentrate more on the installing contractors name than the names on the box’s. 

You’re not buying a refrigerator or toaster oven that you plug in your getting several box’s that has to be assembled properly in all weather conditions. 

JustinS

Jamie Hall said:

Two thoughts. First, on-line reviews are biased very heavily to people who have had problems. They are useful sometimes to tell you what problems may have happened, but are quire useless in telling you the actual quality of the product. Further, particularly with complex systems, they often reflect either installer or user generated problems, not problems with the units themselves.

Second, and far more important, is the skill and quality of the installer. A poor installation can turn the best unit in the world into pure junk. So I'd pick on the basis of the installer, with a bias towards a simpler system.

That is a good point, although it seems to me that a thermostat is more of a packaged unit more like an appliance than the whole system itself. While it is more configurable than, say, a toaster oven or whatever, if it needs to be replaced because it stops working - I'd say that is more on the quality side than application issue. In any case, I hear what you're saying.

pecmsg said:

Concentrate more on the installing contractors name than the names on the box’s. 

You’re not buying a refrigerator or toaster oven that you plug in your getting several box’s that has to be assembled properly in all weather conditions. 

Both of the contractors seem to be well rated so I'm not sure how much of a deciding factor that will be.

jumper

Forty years ago BIG advantage for Lennox was that manufacturer/distributor/jobber was one. So Lennox contractor was well supported and could install & repair correctly.

Mad Dog_2

I had a two zone Lennox AC ducted central air system installed in 2003.  The one zone is still cranking away.  The 2nd unit started not performing, breaking down, mystery leak after 7 yrs.  What I regret is that I was tied to using only Lennox dealers.  Mad Dog 🐕 

pecmsg

JustinS said:

Two thoughts. First, on-line reviews are biased very heavily to people who have had problems. They are useful sometimes to tell you what problems may have happened, but are quire useless in telling you the actual quality of the product. Further, particularly with complex systems, they often reflect either installer or user generated problems, not problems with the units themselves. Second, and far more important, is the skill and quality of the installer. A poor installation can turn the best unit in the world into pure junk. So I'd pick on the basis of the installer, with a bias towards a simpler system.

That is a good point, although it seems to me that a thermostat is more of a packaged unit more like an appliance than the whole system itself. While it is more configurable than, say, a toaster oven or whatever, if it needs to be replaced because it stops working - I'd say that is more on the quality side than application issue. In any case, I hear what you're saying.

Concentrate more on the installing contractors name than the names on the box’s. 

You’re not buying a refrigerator or toaster oven that you plug in your getting several box’s that has to be assembled properly in all weather conditions. 

Both of the contractors seem to be well rated so I'm not sure how much of a deciding factor that will be.

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