upstairs steam radiators spurting water

Oldhomegal

I have been having clanging and water gurgling and spurting from several of my steam radiator valves on my second floor. Usually the start of of the season is nice and quiet and as the season progresses... I have a 1 pipe system. I have replaced some vents to make sure the both open and close, no help. I suspect that the radiators have lost their proper angle. I am looking for solutions on how to raise the angle to allow better drainage for condensed water. Several of them are really locked tight and don't have give. If they do have give I'm trying to figure out how to brace it. My radiators are built in's so really hard to reach the pipes etc ( see photo)


My first floor radiators of the same age work well and I can hear a nice hsst -- quick open and close of the vent, no rattling or water logging. Help! My local heating folks really haven't been much help.

Jamie Hall

Could be pitch of the radiatos. Could also be pitch of the pipe or pipes feeding the radiators.

Oldhomegal

Any thought on a way to brace the end of radiator from underneath?

Jamie Hall

Oldhomegal said:

Any thought on a way to brace the end of radiator from underneath?

Shims under the feet?

Oldhomegal

I’ve got Convectors radiators that are built in to the wall, no feet to shim unfortunately 

Mad Dog_2

Many times, the boiler's "spaghetti 🍝 pot"
(Where the steam starts from) get out of whack PH wise and gets very oily and dirty, muddy!  Radiators don't generally "lose" their pitch once they are set up, unless they bore  down in to the wood floors or someone does some pipe work.  Yiu can repitch and check all u want. Can't hurt,  it I'd look in the the "spaghetti 😋 water.' Then your ready for a steam pro to boil it out for u and clean it up. Mad Dog 

Oldhomegal

I’ll take a look at the ph.  I’m just trying to figure a few more things, why is my second floor radiators affected and none of the first floor, and the there is a much louder gurgling and banging when the system is cooler (when I turn down to 63) than when the system warms up.

bburd

More condensate is produced on startup with a cold system than a warm one, which will worsen any wet steam or drainage related problems the system has.

Mad Dog_2

Can u post pictures 📷 of Boiler and all near boiler piping?   Also. What pressure are we operating at?  Mad Dog 🐕 

Oldhomegal

A big improvement!! Had the heating company in, adjusted the pitch in 3 to 4 of my rads. I had 2 vents that were locked to the open position so loosing a lot of steam there.  And changed a 3rd. I set the thermostat a smidge higher. All of a sudden stream was finally reaching my 3 rd floor radiator unmasking a huge water logged radiator up there.  My heating guy doesn’t carry oh strips so couldn’t measure that.  Also did put some additives in the water that protect against rusting.  Also I didn’t know that I was supposed to drain the water when the boiler was in, I’ve always done it when the boiler was off, so maybe that cleared things out better too.  It’s been incredibly more peaceful now and the heat feels more even between the 1st and second floor!  I’m pretty sure there’s more to tween and honestly I have no faith in my heating company and I can’t find anyone in Chicago that truly understands the nuance of steam systems. I’ve tried several companies.  Thanks so much for the input so far!

Oldhomegal

Oldhomegal

Ok, so I realized that I don’t know what pressure my system is operating!  I just know the settings above.  I know I’m supposed to have my pressure at about .5 psi.  How today I know what my pressure is?  I don’t have any other gauges on my boiler..

ethicalpaul

bburd said:

More condensate is produced on startup with a cold system than a warm one, which will worsen any wet steam or drainage related problems the system has.

The boiler produces its rating, it doesn’t know or care how cold the pipes are. The condensation is almost totally steady regardless 

ChrisJ

ethicalpaul said:

bburd said:

More condensate is produced on startup with a cold system than a warm one, which will worsen any wet steam or drainage related problems the system has.

The boiler produces its rating, it doesn’t know or care how cold the pipes are. The condensation is almost totally steady regardless 

I suspect the confusion comes from when the system first starts all the condensate is formed early on in the system, but there's no reason properly sized and pitched steam mains should ever have an issue carrying the condensate.

Ultimately, at the end the same exact amount of condensate is produced by the system hot or cold.

bburd

The system may produce the same amount of condensate when cold, but it will certainly be differently distributed. It's quite common for steam systems with pipe pitch problems to hammer and gurgle on a cold start, and quiet down as they warm up.

pecmsg

Post pictures of the boiler piping from a distance so we can make it out. 

ethicalpaul

bburd said:

The system may produce the same amount of condensate when cold, but it will certainly be differently distributed. It's quite common for steam systems with pipe pitch problems to hammer and gurgle on a cold start, and quiet down as they warm up.

That's because on startup the water sitting in the low spots is cold, so it causes hammer. As it warms up, it won't collapse the steam, and the hammer goes away.

The level of condensate in any steam pipe is very small. There is no condition in a residential steam system where the pipes will be overwhelmed by condensation at various times in the heating cycle, I assert.

I have a sight glass on my return and it's very obvious once you actually see how little water is returning. Granted, my system is small, but larger systems have larger pipes.