New Heat Pump with Oil Furnace Losing Prime ONLY after outside air temp goes below 32

Ucantcme00

"It looks like there are two lines going in to the furnace casing, but only one being used. Where does the other line come from, or go to?"

Could this be the problem?? Should there be two lines? I remember that the installers mentioned that the new system would be different than the old furnace and would be a two line system but never mentioned it again and I didn't know what it meant, (as they were installing it in December).

HVACNUT

I've probably serviced well over a hundred mobile homes (eastern Long Island) with the Miller/Nordyne downflow furnace. I think I only came across one that had an oil filter outside. And I've come across a few that were piped inside the burner compartment, and it's super tight.
They should be burning Kero so the pump strainer is usually sufficient. 

SuperTech

I've installed a few Garber oil filters and Tiger Loop Ultras in Miller/Nordyne mobile home furnaces. There's just enough room to fit them in there. 

I agree that these furnaces should be burning kerosene, much less problems encountered with dirty nozzles, pump strainers and freezing/gelling oil lines when kerosene is used.

I would avoid connecting the oil line to the bottom of the tank.  Every time I see that done with an outdoor tank the customer has problems with the burner locking out due to a frozen or restricted oil line. 

clammy

As other have stated you need a filter and I wouldn’t suggest a tiger loop also has anyone’s yet pulled and check the pump strainer being you do not have a filter. Has anyone just straight out jumped the furnace r and w for the burner and cycle it a few time soon if it works correctly then it’s a wiring issue. I’m really amazed how as you stated this is a large company w a supposedly decent reputation and they sell equiptment that it would seem they have no idea how it functions s properly . 1 st bad sign Is there unwillingness to run a new oil line it s not brain surgery not that difficult even on a moblie home please just plain lazy . I think I would buzz my plane over there head and call the local rep for this product or find a oil company being usually most Hvac guys are not the most savvy oil techs and it goes the other way also not all oil guys are Hvac tech . But for any company to leave a customer w a issue from a replacement heating system I say I should beyond uncalled for and highly unprofessional in my opinion .
I’m a firm believer in if you don’t know what you’re doing then state so and don’t jerk customers around and suggest some one who has a clue after oneweek of them not getting it right I wouldn’t think they have had more then a fair chance to get it right . Want some action just hop on there social media advertising And complain that will possible get some action . Like who sells a job and a system w what look s like zero skill in addressing the issue seems highly novice . I never buy the it’s only happening here’s . Best real advice Is to contact your local better business authority ,talk directly to the owner and finally threaten w lawyers no one should go through this type of bull . It seem so they are not as professional as the image they paint other wise you’re issue would be zero ,find a new Hvac possibly recommendation by a supply house that sells your equipment. On a end note w outdoor tanks and miller / nordyne moblie home furnaces when I work In the oil end of the business ,they only got kero and those who chose to get #2 had heater tape and anti gel additive added they still had issues w fuel gelling and they would get a service bill every time there lines froze . But after all these posts it comes to the fact that you need some one familiar w oil servicing and a the correct wiring of a duel fuel unit so as the cop of your heat pump drops the oil burner should automatically switch to oil and vise versa usually based on a outdoor thermostat or internally from the heat pump controls ,if it’s that hard they should not sell / install or attempt to service something they clearly are clueless about or get real techs w knowledge and experience .
Peace and good luck clammy

Ucantcme00

@clammy My parents got this new system partially paid for through a grant because they are elderly, my Mom is disabled and after having a very successful business and a good life, are at a bad point and are in a very low income bracket, along with myself due to things out of our control. Because of the grant, we were unable to choose the HVAC company but this company is a large, well known company in our region, including into Pittsburg. As the installers were here, the lead person mentioned to me that he had just transferred from Pittsburgh to Wheeling and he never had oil furnace systems in Pittsburgh. The company also informed us, as they were installing the system, that we would be responsible for running the fuel line to a certain point where they consider it to be entering "their system". We had very little funds and had just paid a huge amount for 250 gallons of fuel to be delivered. My brother-in-law, who works with tanks of a different type looked information up on the internet and managed to put the line in. I had a professional that always worked on our old furnace check his work and he said it was perfect. The HVAC employees also said it looked fine to them.

Since then, I was informed that the HVAC company "does not do fuel line work". But then, less than a month ago, one of their employees who came to the house to try to work on the system again told me that he asked the Owner who told him that they would be able to do the fuel line from the tank. At this point, they wanted a new, continuous fuel line run from the tank to the furnace. When I called the office to make an appointment for a quotation on a new fuel line (I thought it would be better if they put it in, since they knew what they wanted), the Owner got on the line and the story went back to we don't do fuel lines from the furnace to the tank and if we did, we are booked several weeks out anyway and it would be a very large charge.

I am going to start getting more attention as soon as we have the new line run today and they can no longer blame the problem on the line, which only started happening about two weeks ago. The line might be part of the problem. I hope it is all of the problem but I really don't think that it makes sense, unless it is the inside part that is kind of pinched up. I still think there is something going on with the temperature. It is not the air temperature causing something to happen. It is the reading of the air temperature number that is the problem. It is not something getting cold. It happens exactly when the temperature hits that number. Not after it has sat there a while. No matter if it has been cycling a lot before or not cycling much at all before. It is hard to explain without you being here when it happens and none of you know me well enough to trust that I am very intelligent and can quickly understand the way that things like this work in my head.

@EdTheHeaterMan @MaxMercy I have one more question that someone's answer brought back to my memory from the installation back in December. We have always had this probably 18" x 18" return duct in our living room. While the furnace wasn't working, my Mom's health went way down hill and we had to put a piece of furniture in for her. That piece of furniture partially covers the return vent/register. When the company was here installing the new furnace, I asked them more than once if we needed to take the furniture off of the return because we were going to have an oil furnace running again. They responded no, that this system was not going to be using the return in any way and we no longer have to worry about leaving it uncovered. Could that be a problem? Might they have been wrong? They sure didn't seem to know what they were doing as far as the oil furnace.

I am embarrassed that my help discussion is now on a third page. You will never know how much I appreciate you all. I understand how valuable your time is.

Does anyone have a good link for somewhere that I can go to get a step by step instruction for replacing a fuel line from the tank to the furnace? I just want to have it available in case we have a problem along the way. He is coming shortly. He does have a flare tool. I am a little scared to have someone working around the fuel under the house, I always am. Anything would help. I don't want to end up burning up the pump or something.

EdTheHeaterMan

@EdTheHeaterMan @MaxMercy I have one more question that someone's answer brought back to my memory from the installation back in December. We have always had this probably 18" x 18" return duct in our living room. While the furnace wasn't working, my Mom's health went way down hill and we had to put a piece of furniture in for her. That piece of furniture partially covers the return vent/register. When the company was here installing the new furnace, I asked them more than once if we needed to take the furniture off of the return because we were going to have an oil furnace running again. They responded no, that this system was not going to be using the return in any way and we no longer have to worry about leaving it uncovered. Could that be a problem? Might they have been wrong? They sure didn't seem to know what they were doing as far as the oil furnace.

Your old furnace most likely did not use the floor return duct. Those floor returns were used for separate package air conditioners. Those were the large boxes that were outside next to the home that contained the compressor, the outdoor fan, the indoor fan the outdoor coil and the indoor coil all in one box. the return duct in the floor was connected to that (outdoor box) Package Unit.

Your new system has only the outdoor fan, outdoor coil, and compressor connected by 2 small pipes attached to the indoor coil and uses the furnace fan. No duct work goes to the outdoor unit. The furnace fan does no use the floor return. That return duct should be covered up and sealed to keep critters out of the home.

Ucantcme00

I just found out that the original HVAC company actually ran the fuel line from the top of the tank to the house. My brother in law only put the tank there and put the hook up on the top of the tank, the original HVAC company did the rest.

EdTheHeaterMan

Then that person who connected the fuel line to that union fitting is most likely the person who does not know how to properly make a flare fitting that does not leak. Did they make the two flare connection marked problem 1 and problem 2 in the original tank photo?

Ucantcme00

@clammy I did finally get another company to come and look at it. No other companies wanted to get involved with a newly installed system. The Owner of the new company came in one day. He then gave a quote to put in a new fuel line but changed his mind and said he didn't want to get involved. But then, last Monday, his office called and wanted to send a tech to test the system and I let them come out. They were supposed to have a meeting to go over potential issues the next day and call in the afternoon to let me know what they proposed. They never called and I called Friday morning, had to leave a message. They said he was planning on calling me right then but still never got a call back. I am ready to start making some noise!!

Ucantcme00

Found the filter but there is no shut off / Firomatic as I was told there was by the HVAC company.

clammy

Has anyone made sure the fuel line is not bottomed out on the bottom of the tank , put a vacuum gauge on to check pump vacuum ? Also check pump pressure while there at it and of course combustion testing these are totally basic to any oil fired installation most especially in those type of furnaces in mobile homes it’s also basic for any sort of liability cya one would image no ?
As you stated this was done for elderly and disabled person ,no matter how it was paid for I would except a lot better from any company with any sort of respect and decency for there customers .
Peace and good luck clammy

pecmsg

clammy said:

Has anyone made sure the fuel line is not bottomed out on the bottom of the tank , put a vacuum gauge on to check pump vacuum ? Also check pump pressure while there at it and of course combustion testing these are totally basic to any oil fired installation most especially in those type of furnaces in mobile homes it’s also basic for any sort of liability cya one would image no ?
As you stated this was done for elderly and disabled person ,no matter how it was paid for I would except a lot better from any company with any sort of respect and decency for there customers .
Peace and good luck clammy

That should be said for ALL contractors, unfortunately it's the complete opposite in the real world!

EdTheHeaterMan

If the contractor is interested in the best way top find a vacuum leak, all they need is a vacuum gauge and a flare cap. The process is simple. Go to the first flare fitting connection closest to the tank. Disconnect the side near the tank and place a flare cap on that union. install the vacuum gauge on the spare inlet opening of the fuel pump. Operate the fuel pump until you reach about 15" Vacuum on the gauge. Stop the pump and watch the gauge. It should not move at all. If it slowly drops over time, then there is a vacuum leak. Find the leak, repair the leak, repeat the test.

Have you contacted the municipal inspection office to see it the contractor was issued a permit for the job?

Ucantcme00

@EdTheHeaterMan Yes, the original HVAC company installers did put in those flare connections but apparently their boss does not know they did. Their boss is the person who is complaining about the connections and making us put in a new, continuous line which is almost done right now, btw.

I am in the county, outside of the city, we do not have inspections for contractor jobs at all. When I was working at the construction company, we never had to get a permit or have any inspections in this county, only within city limits. I do plan on raising hell starting tomorrow morning. As soon as this fuel line is run. If I would have known that the original HVAC employees actually DID DO so much of the line work, I would have been making a ruckus sooner. They have other, little things that I am not happy with either but as long as it gets running and is safe, I will be happy. I just saw that they put something that looks like aluminum foil over one place inside the cabinet area that is in the hallway. That seems wrong to me. They also put a dented door on in December with a missing handle and said a new one was coming in two weeks, I keep asking and it is always on it's way. I am ready to start attacking now!

Ucantcme00

@EdTheHeaterMan @clammy @MaxMercy @SuperTech @rick in Alaska This is a picture of a partially work in progress as far as the fuel line goes. We are still working on attaching it to the furnace and flaring where needed. This is in the bottom of the cabinet in the hallway, where the fuel line comes into the house from under the trailer. Surprisingly, I am told that it was not difficult at all to run the line under the home, no issues with space or blockages as previously described by others. No shut-off valve was found yet from the original HVAC company.

Why is there foil over the back of this area? Is that okay? It seems like it wouldn't be good over the long run and would be a temporary fix for something.

I hope you all are having a very nice weekend! Please do not waste your time on me today if you are busy with your family or doing something already. You all have been a blessing and have kept me sane. I am listening to and absorbing/using everything that you have taught me so far. It will all come to a head this week and should be interesting. Hopefully, it will just be completed correctly and my parents will have a dependable source of heat and air in their home as it was intended in December. If not, I am quite capable of raising cane or whatever you would call it and I am ready! I am done with the excuses and runarounds! I will let you know what happens and will not leave you hanging. I hope I will not have to beg you for any more answers in the following days, after someone explains the foil in the picture, that is, lol. Please?

Just one more thing, should we install the shut off in the line, or make the HVAC company install it when they come back, since they told me that they had already? If we do put it in the line, where would you suggest as the best place? I am worried that if we put it in the line, they will use it as an excuse to say that it is not a continuous fuel line as they are demanding, which I realize is stupid and dangerous. There is very little room inside the cabinet. The old one was outside our home.

EdTheHeaterMan

The aluminum tape is something we all do to seal up ductwork openings from time to time. That is not something to be upset about. As a matter of fact I'm sort of impressed that they even tried to do something to seal up that opening. Many might have left that opening without sealing the air leaking from the seam on that panel. I wouldn't make a big deal about that.

The fact that they did the fuel line from the tank to that fuel filter. and the fact that they never tested it for leaks after they had a problem, is what I would have a problem with. I would also ask a lawyer to send a letter with respect to being reimbursed for the cost of fixing their mistake / poor workmanship in the defective fuel line. Let's see if the one piece fuel line solves the problem. Also save the fuel line for evidence of the poor workmanship. The fact that the new oil line solves the problem and the old line is held for evidence for testing by an independent entity, will be an incentive for them to pay you for your grief.

The letter should include that if they refuse to pay for the new fuel line cost, that the defective fuel line will be tested by an independent lab or machine shop to prove the fuel line design was faulty and the cost of switch tests will be added to the claim for damages.

The letter should also ask for the company to produce the written contract they have with the government entity for the job, so you can see what is and is not included in the job description.

Does your county have a health department? If not, then the State has one. See if they can help with this. The fact that a company with so many locations can leave the elderly with low income without heat in the middle of the winter is something that your government should look into. Is there a Mayor or Town Council that represents your area? Who do you pay property taxes to? That local branch of government is where I might start to get answers.

And the local media, television, newspaper, radio station. Those people are always looking for some kind of scandal to report on. I would start to make noise and as much as i could about it.. And while it is still cold outside. This is not news in July.

Ucantcme00

@clammy You should see what they did to my parents' home during the installation! They didn't have enough space for the new system where the old one was located so they tore out a bunch of paneling from the wall and trim from a nearby door and just left it all laying inside a room next to the system. Now, we have to find a way to repair the whole wall and trim around the cabinet area. They also ruined the carpet in the hallway and the living area by heavily soiling it with both fuel and dirt. When they removed the old furnace, they put down a narrow piece of plastic to wheel it out on, to supposedly protect the carpet but they took it up and continued to work on the furnace and made several big stains of fuel along the way and also brought tons of dirt and mud into the living area and hallway. It looks terrible but we can't do anything until it is fixed because they might just do it again when they come back. The construction company that I worked for, for thirty years would have never have done something like that to a customer. And, like I said, they put a dented cover or door on it with no handle and said they ordered a new one that would be shipped in, in two weeks but they keep saying it hasn't arrived yet, since December!

EdTheHeaterMan

Take lots of pictures on your phone. Do you have homeowners insurance? Put in a claim with them and let them know the damage was done by the installing company. The insurance company will then reach out to the installing company to get them to put in the claim to their insurance company. That is what insurance companies do. include all the damage, carpet replacement/cleaning, paneling repair, fixing the door. Make it look as good as it is supposed to. like in the brochure. You get the $$$ to fix the carpet and other damage while the insurance companies battle it out with each other.

Is that oil filter from the original installer or from the new man you have fixing the fuel line? Are those flare fittings and copper tubing flares from the original installer or from the new repair man?

See if you can ask the installer of the new oil line to leave the old defective line behind for evidence. He should be able to coil it up so it can be stowed under the home if needed for the future. Try not to bent any kinks in the line so it can be pressure tested by an independent entity.

HVACNUT

Is the evaporator and oil filter in the cabinet directly under the burner?
If so (and try to follow the roller coaster),  does the oil line run from near the bottom of the tank, out the top of the tank, then over and down about 5 ft. before it goes under the home. Then there's a horizontal run of unknown length under the home before it turns upward into the home. The oil line then continues upward above the height of the furnace, then another horizontal run of unknown length before it turns back downward, through the furnace compartment and into the evaporator compartment below the burner. Then a short horizontal run and after the oil filter it turns upward again into the burner compartment where it rises above the fuel pump, does a quick 180° and down into the fuel pump.
Do I have that right or am I trippin'?

EdTheHeaterMan

That makes sense @HVACNUT. The M5 model oil furnace with coil cabinet probably has the fuel pump above the fuel tank. So, anywhere in the fuel line from the tank to the oil filter in the coil cabinet to the flare connection on the pump itself. All are above the fuel level in the tank and are possible leak locations for air to find its way in to the fuel line.
This is what I would have done if I was installing this system. TIGER LOOP De-aerator at indicated location.

Ucantcme00

@HVACNUT The line starts about 3" from the bottom of the tank, then comes out from out of the tank then down close to the ground which is about 4 feet down from the tank about three feet and into the crawl space under the home, then runs about 12 feet on that same level which is close to the ground level, with no dips for anything to accumulate in, the length in the crawl space is longer than the actual distance to the furnace because it runs around a beam and then back to the furnace or it would be a lot less, then up into to furnace which is about two feet up. It attaches to the place next to the filter in my last picture. The last picture is located in the bottom of the system. The picture on this page, with the filter and where the fuel line is connected to from the outside is located in the bottom section of the system which is not insulated and I was told by the second company is why I may be feeling so much more heat in the hallway from the system, but it is under the picture from the first page and the line runs from the picture above to the first page picture.

Ucantcme00

Darn it! I told him not to run the line lower than the tank with no dips on the outside because it might cause any water to freeze! I just got to see it. I am going to call him back if I need to. Is this a bad way to run the fuel line? It comes straight down over the side of the tank from the top and then under and It stays this level and runs under the tank for some reason instead of from the other side, like it was, then through a hole in the brick and through the crawl space at the same level until it goes up into the furnace cabinet area in the picture above, less than two feet above.

Ucantcme00

@EdTheHeaterMan If it is all run at the same level from once it goes down from the tank until it enters the home, is it okay or does it still need to be higher than the fuel on the outside? Even if there are no dips for water to accumulate in?

Ucantcme00

@EdTheHeaterMan I was rereading everything for about the tenth time and I saw that you mentioned that the furnace was probably hitting the low reading overnight and going off. The reason that I know that it has been at exactly33 degrees on my laptop is because for some reason, we have had several days when the temperature outside dropped to that temperature right as the sun was going down and I do some things on my laptop to try to make a little money while I am caring for my Mom so I was using it when it happened and could look right at it.

I also wanted to let you know about why the HVAC company showed me how to turn the system on and off to reset it. It is what I have to do when the temp drops too low overnight and the thermometer gets "confused" according to them, because the indoor air temp becomes more than 2 degrees lower than the setting that we left it on, when my parents went to sleep. They say that the thermometer can never be set for more than two or maybe three degrees higher or lower than the current reading. So when the house is very cold, because the heat pump quit working and the furnace didn't work, the thermometer quits working right and everything quits working, even if the temperature gets high enough for the heat pump to work again and I have to turn everything off and back on again to reset it. Then, I have to work it up by two degrees at a time, which is crazy to me.

EdTheHeaterMan

Ucantcme00 said:

@EdTheHeaterMan If it is all run at the same level from once it goes down from the tank until it enters the home, is it okay or does it still need to be higher than the fuel on the outside? Even if there are no dips for water to accumulate in?

The fuel line can have high and low points as long as it is protected from the freezing weather. If there is a low point outside the fuel line enters the crawlspace, then there is the possibility for accumulation like in this video.https://drive.google.com/file/d/1udPL8PNrhM50vqwqDTIVQcUMx7leUKF1/view?ts=63ec2cfb. As you can see, the water in the fuel line did not stop the burner from running, so having a dip in the line will not be a problem. Having that dip in the line freeze will block the flow of oil, so as long as the dip is in a place that does not freeze (like under the house) then you will not have any problems.

Ask the service man who installed the fuel line to make sure the fuel line is pitched to make any low spot happen under the house. Not outside. And show them the video.

EdTheHeaterMan

It is what I have to do when the temp drops too low overnight and the thermometer gets "confused" according to them,

I'm sorry but the thermostat is not the one that is confused. The installer or service tech is the one that is confused. The thermostat can't decide to only work on a 2° adjustment. That is just crazy. Can you tell me the model number of the thermostat you have? Take a picture of it

Ucantcme00

@EdTheHeaterMan More than one of their employees told me the same thing. It does quit when the temperature is over a couple of degrees different than the setting. Makes no sense to me at all. Stupid when some days, without the furnace it is down to the low 50's in the living room, so I have to work up to 68 or 70, 2 degrees at a time. My parents could never do that.

Honeywell T6 Pro Programmable Thermostat

My contact at the organization just called and said the second HVAC company that came and looked last week sent him a quote that suggested the installation of a dual line system. I swear the original installers told me that they were putting in a dual line system instead of the single line that we had before as they were putting this in. Maybe that is part of the problem for some reason.

EdTheHeaterMan

You don't want a dual line system. You want a tiger loop

Also can you pop that thermostat off the wall and take a better picture of the wire. also a picture of the back of the thermostat where the model number is. The thermostat will just pop off and pop back on with a slight pressure.

yellowdog

i think they are telling him 2° because this system should be wired to a 2 stage heat pump tstat that will fire stage 2(oil burner) when it gets 2° below setpoint for a certain amount of time. that number should be adjustable in the tstat settings, but if it was running correctly it should not be an issue. the op is being filed with so much nonsense from the low bid installer that it is baffling. when we put our first ecoer heat pump into an airco oil furnace and wired it wrong, it would trip the burner control when it went to fire stage 2. imo, i still think he has a wiring issue more than a fuel line issue.

Ucantcme00

@EdTheHeaterMan

EdTheHeaterMan

Thanks for those pictures!

Have you tried to operate the system with the thermostat set to EmHeat? This will operate the oil burner only for heat. The compressor will not operate for heat mode.

Try that and see what happens to the burner operation. The outdoor sensor will not have any effect on the oil burner in this mode.

To get there, press Mode button until EmHeat is on the display to the left of the temperature number

Can you also take a picture of the control that has the reset button? I want to see if there is an additional kit attached to the reset button relay in order the accept the Heat Pump wires. This will help me to determine if the wires are correct.

Ucantcme00

@EdTheHeaterMan Please, do not thank me, Thank You!! I am attaching the reset button that I push, along with another bunch of wires, just in case, lol. I may not be able to answer you real fast for a while now because my Mom just came out and she is in such a state over the whole deal that I can not even mention it in front of her now. By the way, I am not a kid if it sounds that way. My mom is almost 78.

Ucantcme00

@EdTheHeaterMan Yes, to the emergency heat mode. It is the same way. The furnace will run great until the temperature goes down to 33 degrees and then quits. It sounds smooth when it is running. No rough sounds, just smooth running, until that point. Once it goes below that point, it will run through one cycle if I hit the reset button, but only one and then quits again. That cycle only has a little bit of air in the beginning and is smooth sounding until it shuts down, which seems to be a full cycle. I don't think it is shutting down early, or part ways through, it doesn't even sound bad when it does run the one time with the reset button. The problem is that the temperature here has only been below 33 when the HVAC company is closed and their techs can't get here. Then they blamed the fuel line and I had to wait until I could get a new one run before they would come out again. I am waiting to see what is going to happen now.

EdTheHeaterMan

There is a part of the system that I don't know if you have. There may or may not be a Fossil fuel control kit.
On the thermostat there is an installer setup.
On parameter No. 260 External Fossil Fuel Kit the installer needs to tell the thermostat if the kit is there or not.
0 = Thermostat Controls Backup Heat
1 = External Fossil Fuel Kit Controls Backup Heat

Based on that entry, the thermostat will control the operation of the oil burner based on the outdoor temperature. If there is a Fossil fuel kit, I need to see it. If there is no Fossil kit then the answer to parameter 260 should be 0.
Then there are other parameters that need to be set.

This thermostat is the correct thermostat for your needs however someone that has knowledge of this rare type of system needs to set it up. I have a feeling that the right person is not there and someone that is the wrong person may have put a wire or two in the wrong place.

Based on all the information you have provided, I am not sure that the fuel lines were ever the problem. OR that you have 2 problems and the control expert is blaming the oil system and the oil guys are blaming the control system. Unfortunately a person that knows both the fuel system of an oil burner, and the control system is a very rare breed.

I hate to say this but you may need to disconnect the oil burner from the heat pump thermostat with all that outdoor sensor stuff. Have the heat thermostat operate only the oil burner as the only heat source. The air conditioner can be operated as an air conditioner only. If this solves the oil heat problem then you can eliminate the fuel system as the problem. (But still get those low spots corrected).

Here is a diagram I might suggest for you to try. This will remove the outdoor sensor from the equation If I was the contractor on this job and I could not find the problem, I would try this to see if the oil burner operated below 33° without all the other pieces interfering with the problem . If the oil burner works below 33° outdoor temperature when wired this way, then the problem is not with the fuel lines.
I don’t know if you can suggest this to the installer’s mechanic or if you can get someone else to do this.
The wiring changes are the Red, Yellow, and Blue wires on the diagram only.

Then set the thermostat program up like it is AC with oil heat and remove the outdoor sensor wires

rick in Alaska

The reset only goes out with a lack of flame, dirty flame, or a bad control. So, if this is tied in to a temperature issue, did they wire something in to the cad cell wiring? It would make sense in that when the reset button is pushed, it comes back on without having to bleed air.
Wish I could be there to see the whole system. I'm intrigued.
Rick

SuperTech

You shouldn't need a dual fuel kit with a T6 thermostat, I've installed plenty without the dual fuel kit. 

I've never seen anything happen with the thermostat or control wiring that would cause a burner primary control to need to be reset. 

If you were closer to the Hudson Valley I'd fix this for you.  This is becoming a really frustrating thread to follow. 

MaxMercy

EdTheHeaterMan said:

Based on all the information you have provided, I am not sure that the fuel lines were ever the problem. OR that you have 2 problems and the control expert is blaming the oil system and the oil guys are blaming the control system.

This is a really long thread (!), but I she earlier said that after the lockout they did find air in the lines, so maybe there's two issues - or just the one oil line issue..

Ucantcme00

@EdTheHeaterMan @SuperTech @rick in Alaska Are the pictures that I posted showing the way that the fuel line is run down near the ground bad? It does to me. I could not see it from inside the house and got brave enough to go outside and around the bank to look and take pictures. I had already called the original HVAC company to come back, because they said they would come back and try again, once a new, continuous fuel line was run from the tank to the furnace hook up. Will they just look at the way that this line was run and leave? Should I call the guy who put it in back and have him come out real quick and change it? He will, if you tell us to run it differently. The entrance through the brick, where the line enters the home is towards the ground level, which is why is goes down to begin with. The crawl space is not big at all in that area, maybe 18" at most. He did use his flare tool somewhere and a compression fitting at the top of the tank (I think).

Just talked to the person who put the fuel line in. We decided that he is going to change it to run over the top and then diagonally down to the entrance into the home, without any lower points than that entrance and no sagging or drooping areas along the way for anything to accumulate. Is that good?

I will ask the tech who comes out from the original company about the fossil fuel control kit. I will bet you all money that whoever comes out will not even know what one is, unless it is one of the two older techs that have actually been helpful to me.

Like I mentioned, I received a call from the organization that provided the grant and hired the original HVAC company about the second HVAC company that they sent to look at the system last week. All that he let me know is that the second company did was send the organization a proposal (wouldn't say an amount and it is not applicable anymore since I gave up waiting and got someone to run the new line), and that the second company did not make any suggestions other than running the dual system. They mentioned having to run the piping through concrete and in the ground on the proposal according to him. It is barely anything, there is one opening drilled through the brick already, plus a big entrance next to it and no underground or concrete at all. He then said they would pay for part of it, if I could come up with some money. I said NO WAY! This system was already paid for and I don't believe that the issue is solely from the fuel line. I also said no to the dual system. I told him that I already had someone run the line because no one would return my calls and my parents were cold. When the tech from the company that sent the proposal out talked to me the day he was here, he was concerned with the way that the line was run inside the house, where it seems to be somewhat pinched and mentioned a couple of other things. He did not run any pressure or vacuum tests. He just looked over things.

rick in Alaska

Make sure the line that goes in to the compression fitting at the top of the tank does not stop at that compression fitting, and then continue with another piece to the bottom of the tank. The line needs to be one continuous piece going through the compression fitting to the bottom of the tank, which means the compression fitting needs to be drilled out for the line to slide through. Compression fittings are a major source of an air leak.
Rick

Ucantcme00

@SuperTech I noticed you Feb 15th post while I was reading all of them again to see if anything else needs corrected with the new fuel line. The oil furnace runs correctly continuously and smoothly as long as the temp says more than 33 on my laptop. I just have to push reset once, after the temp goes above 33, to get it started and no more as long as the temp remains above 33. Once it hits 33 or after, I can make it cycle one time and it seems to be a full cycle that sounds smooth and then, doesn't come back on again without me pushing reset or the temp coming back up. It doesn't run a ton because the heat pump comes on and takes over but the furnace does run in the thirties (over 33) and it runs well, when it does.