How to estimate EDR of planned steam pipe runs
Will be installing the new SteamMax from Burnham. I'll be replacing the 80 year old steam pipes, many of which were obvious bandaids and addons. New pipes will be routed better, but i don't have the exact lengths and fittings planned out at this point and I **NEED** to order the boiler in the next 2 weeks in order to make schedule.
My question -- likely the first of many: How to correctly estimate EDR for the intended piping runs? I have a good idea of run lengths.
The layout is fairly simple. Boiler sits in the basement at the rear of house. Primary steam trunk runs to the front of the house along the basement ceiling. Secondary steam trunk runs to the rear, through the garage (behind the house), feeding radiators in the living spaces above the garage. Single wet return carries condensate below the water line and back to the steamer.
I'm including a very rough diagram showing the layout. Thanks in advance.
PS: Understand that many would advise away from steam if replacing a whole house system. I respect your opinion but I'm set on installing steam.
Comments
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The supply pipes should be insulated ....
There was an error rendering this rich post.
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Yes, the supply pipes should be insulated. And, if they are, there really is no need to include the EDR of the pipes in figuring the load to be powered by the boiler. Unless it's really strange, that's included in the "pickup" factor.
However.... if you are set on including it, there's no harm, and it's really really easy. Remember that EDR, while it sounds fancy, is just the equivalent square feet of radiation. So -- take the circumference of the pipe, convert to feet and multiply by the length of the pipe -- and that's all there is to it.Br. Jamie, osb
Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England0 -
@stormbytes
To get the EDR you measure all your radiators Height, #of sections and number of tubes or collums.
There is some information on this site and you can go on line and find the "Burnham Heating Helper" Google it.
Piping doesn't matter yet only the radiation load needed to size the boiler
congrats on keeping steam1 -
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I completely blanked on that for some reason. Only need to factor in uninsulated pipe. Thank you for pointing that out.Jamie Hall said:Yes, the supply pipes should be insulated. And, if they are, there really is no need to include the EDR of the pipes in figuring the load to be powered by the boiler.
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Could your radiators be connected for a 2 pipe system?
Are they connected across the top?0 -
The 1-pipe works just fine. Why would I want to add piping?JUGHNE said:Could your radiators be connected for a 2 pipe system?
Are they connected across the top?0 -
You can throttle 2 pipe steam valves with the handle or orifices.
No such thing with 1 pipe....either on or off.
No air vents in the rooms, all in the basement.
Run outs to rads can be smaller.
Is it a safe assumption that each room had more than adequate heat from its radiators?0 -
As I understand it, adjustable radiator vents can be used to throttle and/or balance heat distribution.JUGHNE said:You can throttle 2 pipe steam valves with the handle or orifices.
No such thing with 1 pipe....either on or off.
Mostly, yes. Will be adding/replacing some radiators in different areas to optimize heat distribution.JUGHNE said:it a safe assumption that each room had more than adequate heat from its radiators?
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What's the difference between EDR and Square Foot Radiation?EBEBRATT-Ed said:@stormbytes
To get the EDR you measure all your radiators Height, #of sections and number of tubes or collums.
Have it. Can't make any sense of most of itEBEBRATT-Ed said:There is some information on this site and you can go on line and find the "Burnham Heating Helper" Google it.
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EDR is Equivalent Direct Radiation in square feet. EDR is “square feet of radiation”.
For steam the rating is 240 BTU per square foot EDR with one psi steam in the radiator (215°F).
For hot water the rating is 150 BTU per square foot EDR with an average water temperature of 170°F. The traditional design temperature drop was 20°F, so this means 180°F supply water temperature at the boiler.—
Bburd1 -
@stormbytes
EDR & square foot of radiation is the same thing.
Again, you measure up the EDR of all your rads. You need to locate them and have the EDR for all rads before making a piping layout or sizing the pipe.
You don't add anything for heating the pipes yet. You add up the square feet of steam for all rads and total that up. Lets say you have an EDR of 390.
You then pick a boiler that has a rating of 390 sq. feet or slightly more. The boiler mfg has also already added a piping and pick up factor of 1.33 to the EDR rating. You just pick a boiler with the edr rating you need and your done0 -
If you don't already have "The Lost Art of Steam Heating" by Dan Holohan, it would be well worth the money to obtain one.
Everything you had questions about is addressed in that book.
Pipe sizes, EDR, pipe fitting orientation off of the main etc.
Also the advantages of a 2 pipe system (provided your radiators would work for that).
In any case you can always come here for more questions.
Any pictures of steam piping and radiators?1 -
Have it right here. Been making my way through it. Many of the concepts are abstract so it will take some time to fully wrap my head round it all.JUGHNE said:If you don't already have "The Lost Art of Steam Heating" by Dan Holohan, it would be well worth the money to obtain one.
Everything you had questions about is addressed in that book.
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