Homeowner Troubleshooting Help

Ethantwist

Hey all,

I’m having issues with my 2 year old Peerless gas boiler. When it fires up and turns on, it starts as normal and then Approx. 5min 30secs later (happened 4 times in a row) the Cycleguard low water cutoff green lit will turn on and the Ecobee thermostat and boiler will shut off. The ecobee will reboot and calibrate for 10-20 min and then this whole thing will happen again. The boiler doesn’t seem to stay on long enough to create heat and the house is getting down to 58 degrees now. Thinking it’s the thermostat acting up I looked on the boiler and the Green wire is on the “C”, the Red wire is on the “R” and the White wire is on the “y”

Thanks for any help or suggestions you may have.

Ethantwist

Wiring in boiler

Ethantwist

The light the moment the boiler and thermostat turns off

Ethantwist

Thermostat wiring

HVACNUT

What's the water level in the boiler?
It seems the LWCO is doing its job, but it should only interrupt the burner circuit, not everything.
Can you post what model Peerless, and more boiler pics?
Sight glass, pressuretrol, and pics from 8 to 10 ft away from different angles.

clammy

Did your system function this way before the ecobee? If not then I would suggest to add a simple taco circ pimp relay wire the boilers t t connection to its end switch and the ecobee to the r w c terminals on the relay .i ve seen these kind of issues w the smart t stats and have found this is the simplest way to give them there own seperate 24 volts supply and makes it much easier to isolate the issue .if you jump out r and w and she operates fine even after the relay toss that expensive smart stat and go back to a standard . I think some times when home owners have to much access to there systems using these stats w remote sensors they start to get crazy just remember it used to work fine and you used to be comfortable until u added that smart Stat and started listen to it and watching your remote sensor temps and then u started getting crazy . Personally I m not a big fan of any of them just about every house that I deal w that has them there’s issues but the younger crowd loves them guess they like expensive things that also gather info Peace and good luck clammy

ethicalpaul

My Peerless (still on pallet) came with a 120v Cycleguard that I believe does in fact kill everything on purpose when it interrupts the call for heat in order to check the water level. I’ll go look for the wiring diagram.

<time passes>

OK yeah here is the control diagram where you can see that the LWCO interrupts the 120v side of the transformer which is effectively the same as flipping the service switch.

And here is the explanatory note that Peerless now includes in the documentation to explain why they’re interrupting the heating cycle.

Maybe someone else can advise on something you can do to prevent your thermostat from shutting down—maybe wire the thermostat onto its own independent transformer for example

clammy

That’s correct Paul good thinking there’s your issue like I said easy fix add a isolation relay w a transformer ex taco circ pump relay no re wire easy for everybody Peace and good luck clammy

HVACNUT

> @ethicalpaul said:
> My Peerless (still on pallet) came with a 120v Cycleguard that I believe does in fact kill everything on purpose when it interrupts the call for heat in order to check the wayer level. I’ll go look for the wiring diagram.

I looked at that. Intermittent Level Test. But it even disconnects power to the transformer? Every 20 minutes? All "add on's" or retrofits need to get supplied by a secondary source?

That might be a clever CYA clause by Hydrolevel and, or Peerless.

ethicalpaul

Yes @HVACNUT the way I read the diagram it cuts power to the primary side of the transformer, shutting everything down.

Ironman

God rid of the CycleGuard and replace it with a SafeGuard. It's the same control without that annoying feature. It wires the same and uses the same probe.

Hap_Hazzard

I think you just need to connect the optional jumper to syncronize the CycleGard's cycle with the initial call for heat. Which model do you have there? I can't quite make it out in the picture. is it a CG450-1090?

Hap_Hazzard

My CycleGard (CG400-1090) is wired in series with the other controls. It doesn't shut down the primary. When it interrupts, the burners shut off and the flue vent closes, just as it would if the pressuretrol or thermostat turned off. I'm pretty sure that's how they're supposed to work. The 120v models (CG450 series) are intended for boilers with 120v burners.

ethicalpaul

> The 120v models (CG450 series) are intended for boilers with 120v burners.

Sorry to disagree but my 2019 Peerless 63-03L has the 120v Cycleguard wired to cut the primary transformer coil. All the rest of the controls and the burner are 24v. You can see it in the ladder diagram I posted above.

There is an optional wiring method they call SmartCycle that may be the burner synchronization feature you are thinking of. See https://hydrolevel.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/CG400-Instructions-web.pdf

Zman

I have never worked with that t-stat or boiler but it sure looks to be wired incorrectly, A heating wire on Rc?

HVACNUT

@Ethantwist !
Where you at?

I do see there's a model that interrupts 120v to the burner circuit, but I don't think that it's this model in this case.

I'm just having a hard time understanding why. Like @Ironman , I wouldn't even use that model. You know this isn't going to be the first post concerning this issue.

Now since @ethicalpaul got the fix, you're punishment is to post a diagram showing the the isolation relay wired in.
Don't forget in the future someone will want to pipe in a hydro or indirect zone, so we'll take those schematics too. Thanks much.

Hap_Hazzard

ethicalpaul said:

There is an optional wiring method they call SmartCycle that may be the burner synchronization feature you are thinking of. See https://hydrolevel.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/CG400-Instructions-web.pdf

Yes, that's the one.

This 120v application looks like something new. If this is how they'd originally intended them to work, they wouldn't have needed to make 24v models.