steam baseboards are to hot.

GCbrian

We recently did a remodel in a home that has a two pipe, low pressure steam heat system. Per the architects plans we (I am the GC) replaced a few cast iron radiators and sheet metal enclosures with some burnham base ray cast iron baseboard radiators. They get extremely hot ( I know, they are filled with steam) and so the client who has small children wants them covered or the temp reduced. My HVAC contractor says we can't do a lower temp loop since it has to be steam to work in a steam system, which seems logical, but per his own admission he does not do much steam work. I don't want to lay awake at night thinking a child could get burned as a result of our work. Any ideas out there?

EBEBRATT-Ed

House's have had steam heat for over 100 years. The kids will learn not to touch something hot.

We all survived it growing up with steam. You can't cover the baseboard without loosing capacity.

Steam is 212 deg nothing you can do about it unless you convert to hot water.

Ironman

If it goes below 212*, you don't have steam; you've got hot water. And a steam system makes steam.

It amazes me how we had these and wood stoves for generations and children learned very quickly what the word "hot" meant, but now everyone's afraid that a child's gonna be injured on one.

I raised seven children with a wood stove and none of them were ever injured on it because they learned what "hot" means.

Kids understand a lot more than what most folks think they do.

FranklinD

Well...he's right, I don't believe there is a way to lower the temp much, short of converting it to a hot water loop off the boiler with a mixing valve (and getting GREATLY reduced heat output).

Beyond that...lots and lots of people grew up around steam heat. Usually one good "OUCH" is all it takes to learn not to touch the hot thing.

I'm not advocating for being mean to kids, nor would I want a kid to get hurt on purpose...but cripes. I've read the same story in Dan's books, and my kids all went through the same "learning curve" too.

Kids are smart, and tougher than they look. They'll figure it out quickly.

Otherwise, it's on the designer to come up with some kind of cover I guess, but I imagine it will significantly reduce the heat output and probably be rather unsightly (I'm thinking about a radiator enclosure shrunk down to baseboard size - ick).

Good luck!

KC_Jones

Campfires are much hotter and more fascinating to children, but people still build them. The homeowners worries are unfounded. First we are parents we teach. Second as was said they will touch it and let go LONG before it actually burns them. I am currently raising 3 children with steam heat and none of them have ever even touched them. Well there was one time he tripped and fell into it, but that made a knot on his head not a burn.

Boon

Maybe consider offering non-heating-solutions like painting clown faces on the baseboards. Ok, seriously, something like painting maybe germs or big hairy spiders. or clown faces. oh hell I wouldn't go near a clown face baseboard.

If you know someone who stages houses for sale maybe call in a favor and ask if they have any ideas for furnishing rooms to keep kids away from radiators and baseboards.

Fred

All they have to do is say "Hot, Hot" a couple times, like they do with the kitchen range and that usually takes care of the problem???
I have to say I like the Clown idea too though. LOL

neilc

yeah,
and now that you've all talked about it you'll all get invited to the lawsuits,
have fun with that guys , , ,

Fred

neilc said:

yeah,
and now that you've all talked about it you'll all get invited to the lawsuits,
have fun with that guys , , ,

Not a problem. My real name is neilc , by the way.

jumper

You can install shields made from perforated metal or wire. Baseboard isn't any hotter than radiators. With TRVs most of the baseboard won't get so hot most of the time.

Jamie Hall

Unfortunately, @neilc does have a point. The kids aren't stupid -- they'll get the point quickly enough -- but the parents are, and they will sue at the drop of a hat. The architect was also stupid.

Your solution is simple, though -- construct an enclosure, open with a wire grill at the top and a solid wood front. It will be a bit ugly (paint it purple?) but that's the architect's problem, not yours. If you have a wire grill on top and an open bottom, it won't affect the heat output much.

Leon82

They sell wooden covers with spindles in the front. It kind of looks like a bookcase almost

EBEBRATT-Ed

I think someone that sues would have a impossible case to win though if this PC world they would try. Over 100 years of steam heat. Next the city water will be to cold so you can freeze your pinkie in the sink.

Ironman

GCbrian said:

We recently did a remodel in a home that has a two pipe, low pressure steam heat system. Per the architects plans we (I am the GC) replaced a few cast iron radiators and sheet metal enclosures with some burnham base ray cast iron baseboard radiators. They get extremely hot ( I know, they are filled with steam) and so the client who has small children wants them covered or the temp reduced. My HVAC contractor says we can't do a lower temp loop since it has to be steam to work in a steam system, which seems logical, but per his own admission he does not do much steam work. I don't want to lay awake at night thinking a child could get burned as a result of our work. Any ideas out there?

Not to be unkind, but this is the kind of feminized thinking that's turned our country into a bunch of sissies that are afraid of getting their feelings hurt.

Brewbeer

I think some of you guys are being too hard on GC Brian. He is merely doing his job diligently, which is to respond to his client's requests during the remodel. As fun as it may be to say so on this forum, you guys already know that he can't tell his client to grow a set; @GCbrian needs helpful recommendations that he can bring back to his client so the client can make some informed decisions about how to proceed. If the client wants to spend 20-30K to convert the steam and install a low(er) temp hot water system, that would be a really nice job for someone who knew what they were doing. The client is always right, even when they are wrong.

I also wonder how many on here advocating letting the children to figure it out on their own, would be willing to argue with their wives who might disagree with the notion that it's ok for their 1 or 2 year old children to hurt or burn themselves while figuring it out on their own.

Sailah

When I was a kid my dad always had bees, still does, and now I do too. He was out in his garden, I was mowing the lawn. I got a little careless around the beehive and bumped it.

I'm pretty sure he was laughing at his son sprinting across the lawn, slapping and swatting but to no avail.

I'm paraphrasing but he said "Son, there are 2 lessons here. First, it's good to be fast. 2nd, if you're gonna be dumb, you better be tough."

Well, I'm not fast anymore lol.

My 5 yo son punched out a glass pane in our front door last fall and all I had to say was "Peter, what's the lesson here?"

"If you're gonna be dumb, you better be tough!"

"Yes, that's true. And girls dig scars."

Jamie Hall

I'm not being hard on @GCbrian . The poor man is in a bind which isn't his fault at all, and I think we are trying to help the man out. And I completely agree with @Sailah -- but that doesn't make the problem go away.

Charlie from wmass

I give them the "if the child touches it a third time get them tested" speech. I give it 2 touches as some are slow learners. This is from the leftest leftist on the wall.

Tinman

My kids were tough, still are. All girls. 29 years ago my oldest went down a flight a stairs head over heels in her walker. Scared the crap out of me but she landed on her wheels and just started laughing - probably at the terrified look on my face.

Fred

I wasn't making fun or being hard on @GCbrian either, just acknowledging that life is a series of lessons for all of us and modifying something as basic as a steam radiator, that is hugging the lowest portion of a wall is not a threat to anyone, as long as you assume some level of accountability for teaching your offspring. I mean there are kitchen ranges, with open flames, ovens, steaming coffee/pots, sharp edges, etc.
I remember when we were kids, my youngest brother who was about 5 at the time, was in the basement while we were having an addition put onto the house. He had the bright idea to stick a metal curtain rod into the breaker box that had been uncovered for electrical work. The power went out in the entire house and we went to the basement to see what the "thud" was that we heard. He was up against the wall, opposite the wall with the electric panel, dazed. He never touched that panel again, although I always said he hasn't been "right" since.
Dangers abound in every home.