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Air elimination demo

hot_rod
hot_rod Member Posts: 24,426

I built this demo, 1" copper tube running 8.8 gpm, room temperature.

30- 35% glycol.

I pump 1/2 tube of air from the hand air pump. Run until the fluid turns clear.

The Discal cleared the fluid 100% within 20 minutes.

I switched to the ramp purger, wit 18" upstream piping for best performance. I ran it for an hour and 15 minutes and the fluid is still cloudy, foam.

Switched back to the Discal and same 20 minute result to clear the air microbubbles out.

I'd guess maybe 20% of ramp purgers are properly installed with 18" straight piping upstream, making performance even worse.

I'll try the demo tomorrow with plain tap water for comparison.

Bob "hot rod" Rohr
trainer for Caleffi NA
Living the hydronic dream
mattmia2ethicalpaulEdTheHeaterManEBEBRATT-EdPC7060

Comments

  • ethicalpaul
    ethicalpaul Member Posts: 7,271
    edited February 20

    You know I love this! time lapse video of the 20 minute one requested please!!

    Edit: I like it so much I'm going to paste the images inline so people don't have to download them. The forum software here for some reason doesn't always make the images inline…I think maybe if you import them with the button they don't get inlined. Not great!

    NJ Steam Homeowner.
    Free NJ and remote steam advice: https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/new-jersey-steam-help/
    See my sight glass boiler videos: https://bit.ly/3sZW1el

  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 11,735

    I think my parents had that bike pump except it got thrown out when it broke instead of those numerous repairs.

  • hot_rod
    hot_rod Member Posts: 24,426

    This one has a piece of Heatway Entran tube on it! It made a great air hose.

    Bob "hot rod" Rohr
    trainer for Caleffi NA
    Living the hydronic dream
    mattmia2
  • hot_rod
    hot_rod Member Posts: 24,426

    I'll film it tomorrow and send it to Ray for a Boiler Room Detective post.

    How do I make it a time lapse? Using my I-phone for the video.

    Bob "hot rod" Rohr
    trainer for Caleffi NA
    Living the hydronic dream
    mattmia2ethicalpaul
  • ethicalpaul
    ethicalpaul Member Posts: 7,271

    Cool thanks! This document describes how, toward the bottom in the Time Lapse section:

    https://support.apple.com/en-my/guide/iphone/iph61f49e4bb/ios

    NJ Steam Homeowner.
    Free NJ and remote steam advice: https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/new-jersey-steam-help/
    See my sight glass boiler videos: https://bit.ly/3sZW1el

    hot_rod
  • RascalOrnery
    RascalOrnery Member Posts: 65

    Neat, I love stuff like this. Do the micro bubbles cause boiler and components to rust or is that more large quantities of air?

  • hot_rod
    hot_rod Member Posts: 24,426

    within the air bubble is some oxygen. The o2 contacts ferrous metals and oxidizes or rusts the metal. So the more you eliminate on start up the lesser the oxidation potential

    Ideally within a short period of time the 02 in a sealed system becomes consumed and corrosion stops. You have what is called “dead” water. Water that is starved of oxygen.

    However Mother Nature hates imbalance, so 02 will try and continue to migrate into closed oxygen starved systems. It does this through Pex tube, yes even with oxygen barriers. Around seals and packings, valve stems, pump seals, butyl diaphragms in expansion tanks. The hotter the fluid, the higher the rate of O2 ingress.

    So you want an efficient, working air separator working all the time. Because rust never sleeps.

    Some hydronic installers are going all non ferrous. Stainless boiler, stainless expansion tanks, stainless or composite circulators, copper or plastic piping.

    The other option is to use a hydronic conditioner that has oxygen scavengers in the blend. As these get consumed, additional inhibitor is added occasionally

    Open type Outdoor wood boilers, the plain steel type, are a classic example of a system needing constant scavenger maintenance.

    Additionally the air bubbles or pockets reduce the ability of the fluid to transfer the energy from the boiler and heat emitters

    Bob "hot rod" Rohr
    trainer for Caleffi NA
    Living the hydronic dream
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 17,188

    Glycol will always foam especially when pushing the velocity. The air will probably leave the water much quicker.

  • PC7060
    PC7060 Member Posts: 1,571

    I’ve often pondered why some folks attach pictures versus posting in page using the picture icon. Ford versus Chevy thing?

    ethicalpaul