Missing skim pipe
Hello! First post here but have been doing a lot of reading (including Dan’s book) and learning. I’m on a mission to optimize our system and care for this boiler so it lasts a long time. So as I’m learning more about my system, and fixing some major problems that have probably been going on since long before I got here, I’m mostly thankful that we have a pretty good setup. One thing I’ve noticed, though, is that the skim pipe on my boiler is missing (it should be where that hole with a little insulation is poking through).
I have searched around the forums and elsewhere - and failed to find an answer. Might have missed something - maybe these are dumb questions - but figured I’d go ahead and post here as it seems to be a friendly forum.
- Is it feasible to add the skim pipe? Other posts seem to say that if it’s under the jacket, it’s not worth doing.
- If not, then how would I go about skimming?
- And - if I don’t have a skim pipe, how would I add 8-way?
Thanks for the help!
Comments
-
- Yes it's feasible
- You could attempt to skim from the top gauge glass fitting port but I'd rather install a skim pipe
- You can add it down that plugged vertical pipe that's roughly above the gauge glass. But I wouldn't add it until your water is clean.
NJ Steam Homeowner.
Free NJ and remote steam advice: https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/new-jersey-steam-help/
See my sight glass boiler videos: https://bit.ly/3sZW1el1 -
is there a plug behind that insulation?
2 -
Looks like the water quality and the sight glass need a bit of TLC.
'S' on the drawing. Is it on the other side of the boiler ?
National - U.S. Gas Boiler 45+ Years Old
Steam 300 SQ. FT. - EDR 347
One Pipe System0 -
Looks like the water quality and the sight glass need a bit of TLC.
That's why he's asking about the skim tapping! It's behind the jacket hole
NJ Steam Homeowner.
Free NJ and remote steam advice: https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/new-jersey-steam-help/
See my sight glass boiler videos: https://bit.ly/3sZW1el1 -
If that boiler was installed more than three or four years ago, the plug in the skim tapping will be difficult to remove. It may be difficult even if it hasn't been there too long; that depends on your tools and your skill. Any plug can be removed with the right knowledge, skill and tools.
As Paul says, you can add chemicals through the plugged pipe on the top of the jacket. Or you can remove the safety (relief) valve.
If I had to skim that boiler, I would remove the gauge glass, thread in a nipple and skim it through the upper gauge tapping. That would be much easier than trying to access the skim plug.
If the boiler has been in service for a year or more, I would just flush and refill it several times using the bottom boiler drain valve and consider the job done.
1 -
I think it needs more than just skimming.
National - U.S. Gas Boiler 45+ Years Old
Steam 300 SQ. FT. - EDR 347
One Pipe System1 -
Luckily, between the skimming, then the draining to get the water level back down, you should have a complete replacement of all the water, so he should be good.
NJ Steam Homeowner.
Free NJ and remote steam advice: https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/new-jersey-steam-help/
See my sight glass boiler videos: https://bit.ly/3sZW1el1 -
Yes, that's the idea! This system (as you can see from the condition of the sight glass) has been suffering from a ton of oxygenated make-up water being added to compensate for a ton of leaks all around the house for some time. Pressure was running way too high, so on top of leaky old valves, water was squirting out of the radiator vents on cold starts (a daily occurrence in the depths of winter). Nothing was balanced, water hammers everywhere, you name it. Got some very bad advice over consecutive winters until finally someone recommended the book.
Now the system is running at minimum pressure, all those valve leaks are fixed, I've swapped just about every vent, and things are generally quiet, warm, and peaceful. Water line is stable, so it's time to get that water quality situation cared for. Thus, the skimming, 8-way, pH, and other such questions brought me to seek the skim tapping… alas, all I found was a hole in the sheet metal and some insulation.
As @Long Beach Ed makes a wonderfully salient point regarding the difficulties that ensue from the interaction of corrosion and threaded fittings, I think I'll save the adventure of the plug removal for the warmer months when stakes are a bit lower (I suspect that may be a multi-day endeavor involving the blowtorch and other medieval implements). Or maybe I'll give it a quick attempt for now - but either way it is great to know I can use that top glass port for the purpose.
Thank you all for the help, really amazing!
0 -
you only have to skim if you have oils floating on your water.
If it’s just tds or rusty water you can just drain it
NJ Steam Homeowner.
Free NJ and remote steam advice: https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/new-jersey-steam-help/
See my sight glass boiler videos: https://bit.ly/3sZW1el1 -
Yeah maybe one silver lining is that any surface oils have previously percolated their way up and spat out the end of the nearest radiator ("radiator" is actually an overstatement - it was a homemade 3-foot section of copper pipe with some fins in a bathroom directly overhead)… honestly it was that bad in the worst of times
1 -
the oils don’t do that. Is your boiler surging today?
NJ Steam Homeowner.
Free NJ and remote steam advice: https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/new-jersey-steam-help/
See my sight glass boiler videos: https://bit.ly/3sZW1el0 -
The water dances a bit in the glass when firing but nothing heinously dramatic
1 -
I would leave the skim port for the spring. You could skim at the top gauge glass tapping for now. Find out the water content of your boiler in the manual or on line. Put in 1 lB of washing soda/50 gallons of boiler water (so you only need a 1/4 lb or so and skim it
0 -
Just flush and add your 8 way. Put in half or less of the instructions on the bottle. Get some litmus paper off Amazon to actually measure your pH.
Trying to squeeze the best out of a Weil-McLain JB-5 running a 1912 1 pipe system.0 -
While you are waiting for Spring you can research and procure the tools to remove the plug in the skim port and get the pipes and valve you want for it.
National - U.S. Gas Boiler 45+ Years Old
Steam 300 SQ. FT. - EDR 347
One Pipe System0 -
Sounds like a solid plan. Thanks all!
0 -
It’s a 1.5” and not recessed at all… I am feeling good about this. I’ve broken loose many stuck fasteners over the years (full brake overhaul on a classic Mustang was perhaps the most memorable). There’s a lot of surface area on both ends of this equation, but I have a lot of room for leverage here. Now, to get my hands on a 1.5” 4-point socket…
1 -
You may end up drilling out most of the middle with a hole saw then taking a hacksaw and cutting 2 or 3 slots almost to the threads then using a small chisel to knock out the section between the cuts so you can unscrew it.
1 -
I have used impact wrench with 12 point sockets. Should be around 34 MM. There is no universal size to the square part of the inch and a half IPS plug.
2 -
While waiting for spring, spray around the threads with Kroil or some other penetrating oil every time you walk by it and hit it with a hammer. It will be ready as ever in a couple of months.
2 -
I have actually called up several manufacturers to ask them what size socket they are using to install the plugs. Someone on the manufacturing floor has to know. Surprise of all surprises, nobody could give me an answer. So I went out and bought every imaginable socket size, up to 50 mm.
1 -
Those suckers are all different sizes. There are square sockets, but they don't always fit.
0 -
i would have gone with a caliper. if they are 4 point there is a wade range that will still fit. that is sort of the reason for square nuts and bolt heads and why they stuck around as long as they did. Since they are raw castings i'd imagine there is a wide manufacturing tolerance.
0 -
Can't exactly bring a caliper to every job and start ordering new sockets for each job🤣. And there's no saying they are the same. Meaning you could have three Wiel McClain boilers, with the same 1.5 inch plug, and the three plugs will have three different size heads.
0 -
1-1/2 marking is probably the pipe size (same size as the manufactures drawings) not the size of the square, measure it. Use an 4 or an 8 point socket, 12 point may work but the stated socket size will not match the measurement of the square.
National - U.S. Gas Boiler 45+ Years Old
Steam 300 SQ. FT. - EDR 347
One Pipe System0 -
there may be one on the other side that may be more convenient without the controls around it.
0 -
Success- the Harbor Freight impact wrench made quick work of the plug, and now I’ve got an impact wrench. I’ve got the elbow just tight enough to maintain a seal whether down (for draining) or up (for pouring in the 8-way). It is perhaps a little long but fits a bucket nicely. Thanks to everyone for the help, every tip (including the 34mm 12-point socket) was quite useful!
4 -
Take off the nipple and ell and install a plug when not in use.
Hang the ell from a floor above b0 -
Side note, this is why i need to get rid of the stanley black and decker stock i inherited.
2 -
At the very least, this is a good idea because Old Plug will be relieved to hear it has a new assignment and hasn’t been laid off.
0 -
Just leave the nipple and elbow in place and plug the elbow. Or install a 3/4" or 1/2" valve in the elbow with a bushing.
2 -
Any plug you plan on removing in a few years should be brass.
1 -
or put some ptfe dope on it and put it in hand tight, it is just to keep it from being a big leak if the valve gets bumped
0 -
The nipple into the tapping, and the valve, are doped and torqued for the long haul. No reason to remove those unless the valve fails. The nipple into the valve, and the L, are doped and hand-tight (to allow for rotation between ‘inlet’ and ‘outlet/skim’ mode).
Besides, removing any joint I made with PTFE dope is going to be a breeze compared to some of the other retrofitting I’ve had to do around this house… namely the old leather radiator valves and corresponding stuck spuds… and don’t get me started on the windows that were framed into the freshly poured foundation, but I digress.
1 -
Or never seized and hand tight + 1/2 turn.
2 -
A tip for anyone finding this thread in the future: If you’re in this situation, you can bet your pigtail is probably also packed full of mud! Best to unscrew and clear that out before installing your skim hardware, while you’ve got some extra clearance.
1 -
that was one of several reasons i suggested looking to see if there was another skim tapping on the other side. also if water gets spilled in the process it will get spilled on the controls.
i would suggest putting a union somewhere in the pigtail so that you can take it apart without disconnecting or disassembling anything in the future. there are also ways to make the water trap with tees and nipples and plugs such that you can flush it out by just removing the plugs.
2 -
Look up EzzyT's boiler installs. He does the water trap method. Lot better than pigtails IMO.
Trying to squeeze the best out of a Weil-McLain JB-5 running a 1912 1 pipe system.2
Categories
- All Categories
- 86.7K THE MAIN WALL
- 3.1K A-C, Heat Pumps & Refrigeration
- 54 Biomass
- 423 Carbon Monoxide Awareness
- 101 Chimneys & Flues
- 2K Domestic Hot Water
- 5.6K Gas Heating
- 102 Geothermal
- 158 Indoor-Air Quality
- 3.5K Oil Heating
- 66 Pipe Deterioration
- 934 Plumbing
- 6.2K Radiant Heating
- 384 Solar
- 15.3K Strictly Steam
- 3.3K Thermostats and Controls
- 54 Water Quality
- 43 Industry Classes
- 47 Job Opportunities
- 17 Recall Announcements