Correct Venting for faster Radiator heat up??
I finally fired up the steam boiler since I cleaned the pigtail and extended the main vent. Heres what happened. heater ran for over hour+ b 4 it shutdown cuz it reach the thermo setting, One floor house with a finish attic, 6 radiators & 1 small rad in the attic. Followed heat down the pipe. RAD 1,2,3,4 were getting hot, rad 6 end of run slower and rad 5 slower yet. Rad in attic started ticking and never got hot. Attic rad has a vent & air bleeder(key type) Tryed to let air out but still didnt get hot. Rad 2 has steam spitting out the vent ? Presure got to 1.5 on the gauage. A tiny bit of smoke coming from the main vent. A few questions??
How long does it usally take for the system to heat up ?? What can I do to get the rads to get hot more quickly evenly and the one in the attic hot?? How do I know if my main & rad vents are working right?? I see a little soot out of the peek hole form the oil burmer but flame look pritty bright. Any advice please … TY
Comments
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One floor house with a finish attic, 6 radiators & 1 small rad in the attic. Followed heat down the pipe. RAD 1,2,3,4 were getting hot, rad 6 end of run slower and rad 5 slower yet.
You can put faster vents on 5 and 6
Rad in attic started ticking and never got hot. Attic rad has a vent & air bleeder(key type) Tryed to let air out but still didnt get hot.
You may need a riser vent on that one. A pic of the rad would be helpful. Try it with the vent removed at startup. Do you get air out of the vent hole then? Picture of that radiator would be helpful.
Rad 2 has steam spitting out the vent ?
You need to replace that vent.
Presure got to 1.5 on the gauage. A tiny bit of smoke coming from the main vent.
Did the main vent stop leaking? Is that new or just repositioning the old vent?
Trying to squeeze the best out of a Weil-McLain JB-5 running a 1912 1 pipe system.0 -
Regarding the steam mains- how long are they, what pipe size, and what vents are on them?
All Steamed Up, Inc.
Towson, MD, USA
Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
Oil & Gas Burner Service
Consulting0 -
Please post a photo of the vent on the attic radiator. Key type vents are generally meant for hot water, not for steam; you may just have the wrong type of vent on there.
Also, you may need to slow the venting on the radiators that heat quickly to speed up the slow ones.
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Bburd
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TY delcrossv…
You can put faster vents on 5 and 6… should i get 6, C, or D ??
Rad in attic started ticking and never got hot. Attic rad has a vent & air bleeder(key type) Tryed to let air out but still didnt get hot. … I will post a pic of that Rad tomorrow(not at that house).
Rad 2 has steam spitting out the vent ?
You need to replace that vent. I order a Maid o Mist #5 should be here tomorrow.
Did the main vent stop leaking? Is that new or just repositioning the old vent? Repositioned old vent which was replaced new last season??
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Mains run abt 15ft to 90, 10ft conntenting rad 1 & 2 in btw, 90 20ft in btw connecting rad 3 & 4, 90 10 ft connecting rad 5 and 3/4 in copper pipe off of that up to the attic. 90 10ft back to boiler with rad 6 then the main vent. I can take pics tomorrow for carity if needed…TY
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TY i will tomorrow.. I think they use a water rad and put a vent on the side and left the key on top ..
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Hoffman 75 main and those bullet type on the rads !!
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55 feet. If that is 2-inch pipe, the main vent should be a Gorton #2. With this vent, the steam will fill the main first, then rise to all the radiators at the same time.
All Steamed Up, Inc.
Towson, MD, USA
Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
Oil & Gas Burner Service
Consulting1 -
That 3/4 inch copper riser…. oh dear… any horizontal or near horizontal offsets on it? How big is the radiator?
Br. Jamie, osb
Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England0 -
3/4 copper pipe to the attic?!? Would like to see that. Include where it connects to the main.
Trying to squeeze the best out of a Weil-McLain JB-5 running a 1912 1 pipe system.0 -
It has been like that for a long time ..lol .. small rad .. ill take pix and post tomorrow,,,TY
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Did it ever work well? 3/4 is a really small supply.
Trying to squeeze the best out of a Weil-McLain JB-5 running a 1912 1 pipe system.0 -
ill post pix tomorrow of piping and attic rad & vents .. these rad vents are old … they all may need replacing ..TY
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I dont know what # the rad vents are .. and yes its a hoffman 75 main
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I think so .. lol .. this is a rental property .. they never complained it did not ..so i'm not sure … im really interested now on your opinon …
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yes ther is a horizontal run off the main abt 3 feet then runs up to the attic ..
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75 is pretty slow for a main vent. A little offset on your vent riser and you could slip a Gorton#2 in there.
Trying to squeeze the best out of a Weil-McLain JB-5 running a 1912 1 pipe system.0 -
Thx … is the ticking in the attic rad the stearm and air crashing ??
The burners does run for a long time to get the sys full of steam (hour+). I would like to cut that time down somehow?? Could there be a clog issue somewhere?
I think this could be best case ..
Main - Gordan 2. rad 1,2,3 -#4 or 5, rad 5,6-#6, attic rad C or D ??
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Reviews saying this vent is better then #2 ???
3/4" Big Mouth Main Air VentBrand:Barnes & JonesSKU:BJ-3BM
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I prefer the Gorton. I didn't have a great experience with the Big Mouth. It wouldn't seal well and leaked steam. But I have heard later models are better (even though mine did have the seal on it).
NJ Steam Homeowner.
Free NJ and remote steam advice: https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/new-jersey-steam-help/
See my sight glass boiler videos: https://bit.ly/3sZW1el0 -
Not a clog" in the usual sense. But trapped air will keep steam from moving, so it will look just like a physical blockage. Put the Gorton #2 on and watch how much faster you get heat to the end of the main.
All Steamed Up, Inc.
Towson, MD, USA
Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
Oil & Gas Burner Service
Consulting1 -
TY Steamhead … your thoughts on the #2 vs Big Mouth ??
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#2. No question.
All Steamed Up, Inc.
Towson, MD, USA
Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
Oil & Gas Burner Service
Consulting0 -
Ive used Big Mouths. But I had 250' of 3" pipe to vent. I've had no issues with them, but they're probably overkill for your system.
Trying to squeeze the best out of a Weil-McLain JB-5 running a 1912 1 pipe system.0 -
Pix of pipe from main to attic rad,vent key ..also looks like 3 in pipe main out of boiler for 40' then reduces to 2in for Abt 30' back to boiler..
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That's your problem right there. This pipe needs to slope TOWARDS the main. You'll never get steam past that dip.
Trying to squeeze the best out of a Weil-McLain JB-5 running a 1912 1 pipe system.
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Ok ..so just low that 90 should work??
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Here are my radiator vents.
Rad 1
Rad 2
Rad 3
Rad 4
Rad 5
Rad 6
Attic
These are old but I guess some are working. Some adj but I'm not seeing how to adjust them...what should I do to get these vent right?? Thx
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That copper pipe to the attic radiator was done by someone who doesn't understand steam.
The minimum riser size for one pipe steam is 1" ID, and black steel is preferred over copper for steam carrying pipes because it expands and contracts less; copper steam pipes sometimes separate at the joints from thermal expansion stress.
The horizontal pipes must be gently pitched back towards the riser or main so that condensate can drain backwards against the direction of steam flow. Also, the takeoff from the main should be at 45° rather than 90° so condensate will flow along the bottom of the pipe instead of dropping right into the steam going to the other radiators. If you are having trouble with gurgling or vent spitting on the downstream radiators, this may be part of the reason.
You might get away with just correcting the horizontal pitch and leaving the 90° takeoff alone.
The coin vent at the top right of the attic radiator is not doing anything and can remain completely closed. The other vent is the correct type for steam.All of your vents look very old. It might be time for an update.
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Bburd2 -
Yes, all the way down to the main, or nearly so.
Trying to squeeze the best out of a Weil-McLain JB-5 running a 1912 1 pipe system.1 -
Thx bburd ..it was like that when I bought the house and it's been there for years...any recommendations on the vents and sizes for each radiator??
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Thx delcross...I really appreciate your help
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Gorton has a vent sizing chart. I like adjustable vents, which allow reducing heat easily in unused rooms and easy adjustment for oversized radiators; but they are not all created equal. Vent Rite makes a good one; Maid-o'-Mist sells vents similar to Gorton's design with interchangeable orifices of different sizes.
Quality vents are worth their cost. You will not find them at your local big box home center. Try your local plumbing and heating supply house if they will sell at retail, or order from supplyhouse.com.
I suggest you get the book "We got steam heat!", available from this site. It's a well written guide to the care and feeding of the ancient beast that is steam heat, written for the homeowner.
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Bburd2 -
Like this:
Trying to squeeze the best out of a Weil-McLain JB-5 running a 1912 1 pipe system.1 -
Here want I'm going to do . correct me it I'm wrong,
Move main vent with a Gorton #2,no room for street 45's, 90- 16" pipe-90-8"pipe coupling vent
Reposition attic pipe, can I get away with using that same 90
Replace rad 1,2,3,4 with #5 maid o mists, rad 5,6 with #6,attic #c.
Will this cut the system heat up time?? I'm hoping it will cut the current hour+ to 1/2 hour burner running time??
Any thoughts or advice ?? Ty
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Most of that looks good. The only thing which may be disappointing is the boiler total run time. You may cut it… some… if some of its run time has been increasing system pressure while the radiators are already hot, but remember that if the house loses a certain number of BTUs, the boiler has to run long enough to replace them…
Br. Jamie, osb
Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England1 -
This was the pressure gauge after the hour+ run time when the burner shut off from meeting the thermo setting. Looks like 1.5. I have not had to keep the boiler on to maintain the thermo setting cuz of the way the weather is right now and I'm losing steam from Rad 2 vent. Everything time I ran the boiler so far is from a cold start. Would losing steam from Rad 2 cuz the other rads to get hot slower??? Thx
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That gauge isn't really trustworthy, the scale is too large for the pressures you are wanting to measure. You can get a 0-3 psi gauge on Amazon.
Would losing steam from Rad 2 cuz the other rads to get hot slower???
Possibly a little, possibly a lot, depending on the size of that vent and how bad it's leaking steam. Regardless, you want to fix any steam or water leaks to minimize having to add water.
NJ Steam Homeowner.
Free NJ and remote steam advice: https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/new-jersey-steam-help/
See my sight glass boiler videos: https://bit.ly/3sZW1el2 -
Would this 1/2 in setup be ok for the Gorton #2 ?
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