Low flow in closed in floor heating system
Comments
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We use generally use 60/40 up north. A few outfits go with 50/50. TriaFrost PG and PGX is what we sell. Mostly
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Be aware of the pumping requirements with strong glycol solutions, and lower heat transfer.
50-50 gives you some wiggle room if someone adds water to replaced any purged air.
If it has to be blended on the jobsite, you need DI water.
Bob "hot rod" Rohr
trainer for Caleffi NA
Living the hydronic dream0 -
You can use whatever you want, but 60% is way more than is necessary anywhere on Earth.
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Good to around -40*. It's a slow mover, sell maybe 10-15 drums a year.
50/50 is available as well but we don't carry it. Ysed to and it was causing issues with freeze ups.
Same with vehicles, 60/40 in everything
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I hate glycol.... it is a band aid generally speaking.
I'd never use over 30% in any system. It is thick, reduces heat transfer, harder to pump, sticky, stinky, makes stuff leak, and requires a lot of maintenance....which is rarely ever performed. Then it becomes aggressive, and plugs things up and pinholes copper etc...
Need I go on? And I live where we see -35F every winter, sometimes as cold as -45F. Not a drop of glycol in my own personal system. And I do my best to talk customers out of it too.
Pipe insulation and an electric heater in a small boiler room go along way.
Serving Northern Maine HVAC & Controls. I burn wood, it smells good!0 -
And I would never put any piping in a garage or seasonal use home/cabin without glycol. I kept track this winter of the amount of calls I got for frozen systems, and as of today, it's at 43. One of which was this morning- a 45 minute power outage at -4F froze up 2 of 3 loops in a 1000 sq ft garage kept at 40 degrees. The 3% heat transfer loss is not of concern to me, nor is the added pumping energy (maybe 5%? I don't know how to figure that out). Once it's in there, the sticky/stinky part of it is done for 15-20 years along with the maintenance. While I agree it's not great stuff to work with, that 2 minutes per year of discomfort is easily worth the thousands of dollars it costs to repair a frozen system. I put in just shy of 3000 gallons last year and will continue to do so when it's beneficial.
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as much as i hate antifreeze, some houses do require it. never anything over 30%. usually it is because of bad pipe placement that they wont allow to be corrected. if a house has a standby generator, there is no need for antifreeze. anyone that is only heating spaces to 40° is already playing with fire. you have no buffer if something happens. i have heard, but never confirmed, that insurance companies will not cover freeze up claims if the house was mainatained at a temperature less than 55°. any unoccupied house should definitely have some sort of remote temperature monitoring so they can be alerted to a temperature drop. now the problem can be addressed before it gets to the freeze up point.
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I feel like it does need freeze protection in there. It's for my attached garage gym area which has a bathroom and sink in it.
This is a very good point. It would probably be much more cost effective if I had more dilutted glycol with a freeze alert device. I was looking for an excuse to upgrade my thermostat to an ecobee out there anyways.
I guess I could test it with a hydrometer to see what I might have in the system.
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You don't live where it's cold, do you? Very few keep their garages much above 40- it's just a place to keep things from freezing. A generator doesn't prevent a component failure during the night or while you're at work either. Antifreeze is a necessary evil for peace of mind, a lot more often than one might think. I had a call last year where a brand new $1.3M lake home froze up following a propane outage before it had even been moved into. Obviously someone dropped the ball on the LP fill, but $800 in antifreeze would have saved a $180,000 renovation. Things happen
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Yikes that would be aweful.
Yeah I live in Northern Ontario so yeah, it gets cold.
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Hey I have a question and not exactly sure where to ask it but I actually really enjoyed working on my heater system in general and wondering what you would need to become a Rinnai tech or boiler tech or what not? Would you have to become a plumber first before being able to do that work?
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Ironically a system I was at today....
You guessed it glycol, and it has never been maintained in the 10 years it has been in service.
A water only system would likely be fine.
Serving Northern Maine HVAC & Controls. I burn wood, it smells good!0
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