Low flow in closed in floor heating system

nate379

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1744572#Comment_1744572

We use generally use 60/40 up north. A few outfits go with 50/50. TriaFrost PG and PGX is what we sell. Mostly

hot_rod

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1744731#Comment_1744731

Be aware of the pumping requirements with strong glycol solutions, and lower heat transfer.

50-50 gives you some wiggle room if someone adds water to replaced any purged air.

Screenshot 2023-03-28 at 7.41.54 AM.png

If it has to be blended on the jobsite, you need DI water.

GroundUp

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1744731#Comment_1744731

You can use whatever you want, but 60% is way more than is necessary anywhere on Earth.

nate379

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1744776#Comment_1744776

Good to around -40*. It's a slow mover, sell maybe 10-15 drums a year.

50/50 is available as well but we don't carry it. Ysed to and it was causing issues with freeze ups.

Same with vehicles, 60/40 in everything

Solid_Fuel_Man

I hate glycol.... it is a band aid generally speaking.

I'd never use over 30% in any system. It is thick, reduces heat transfer, harder to pump, sticky, stinky, makes stuff leak, and requires a lot of maintenance....which is rarely ever performed. Then it becomes aggressive, and plugs things up and pinholes copper etc...

Need I go on? And I live where we see -35F every winter, sometimes as cold as -45F. Not a drop of glycol in my own personal system. And I do my best to talk customers out of it too.

Pipe insulation and an electric heater in a small boiler room go along way.

GroundUp

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1744928#Comment_1744928

And I would never put any piping in a garage or seasonal use home/cabin without glycol. I kept track this winter of the amount of calls I got for frozen systems, and as of today, it's at 43. One of which was this morning- a 45 minute power outage at -4F froze up 2 of 3 loops in a 1000 sq ft garage kept at 40 degrees. The 3% heat transfer loss is not of concern to me, nor is the added pumping energy (maybe 5%? I don't know how to figure that out). Once it's in there, the sticky/stinky part of it is done for 15-20 years along with the maintenance. While I agree it's not great stuff to work with, that 2 minutes per year of discomfort is easily worth the thousands of dollars it costs to repair a frozen system. I put in just shy of 3000 gallons last year and will continue to do so when it's beneficial.

yellowdog

as much as i hate antifreeze, some houses do require it. never anything over 30%. usually it is because of bad pipe placement that they wont allow to be corrected. if a house has a standby generator, there is no need for antifreeze. anyone that is only heating spaces to 40° is already playing with fire. you have no buffer if something happens. i have heard, but never confirmed, that insurance companies will not cover freeze up claims if the house was mainatained at a temperature less than 55°. any unoccupied house should definitely have some sort of remote temperature monitoring so they can be alerted to a temperature drop. now the problem can be addressed before it gets to the freeze up point.

ASnatchA

I feel like it does need freeze protection in there. It's for my attached garage gym area which has a bathroom and sink in it.

This is a very good point. It would probably be much more cost effective if I had more dilutted glycol with a freeze alert device. I was looking for an excuse to upgrade my thermostat to an ecobee out there anyways.

I guess I could test it with a hydrometer to see what I might have in the system.

GroundUp

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1745091#Comment_1745091

You don't live where it's cold, do you? Very few keep their garages much above 40- it's just a place to keep things from freezing. A generator doesn't prevent a component failure during the night or while you're at work either. Antifreeze is a necessary evil for peace of mind, a lot more often than one might think. I had a call last year where a brand new $1.3M lake home froze up following a propane outage before it had even been moved into. Obviously someone dropped the ball on the LP fill, but $800 in antifreeze would have saved a $180,000 renovation. Things happen

ASnatchA

Yikes that would be aweful.

Yeah I live in Northern Ontario so yeah, it gets cold.

ASnatchA

Hey I have a question and not exactly sure where to ask it but I actually really enjoyed working on my heater system in general and wondering what you would need to become a Rinnai tech or boiler tech or what not? Would you have to become a plumber first before being able to do that work?

Solid_Fuel_Man

Ironically a system I was at today....

You guessed it glycol, and it has never been maintained in the 10 years it has been in service.

A water only system would likely be fine.