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CONFUSED: Triangle Tube condensing gas boiler + indirect fired water heater

HillEasternerHillEasterner Member Posts: 4
edited October 2018 in Domestic Hot Water
Hello,

I recently bought a home that uses a combination of two Triangle Tube products—a Prestige Solo 110 condensing gas boiler and a Smart 40 indirect fired water heater—for domestic hot water, which is also used to heat radiators. I am very confused about how they work in relation to each other. For instance, as the attached images show, I have selected a setpoint of 120 degrees, and yet the "standby" screen shows an incoming heat of 94 degrees and an outgoing heat of 100 degrees. So a few questions:

—Why wouldn't it be going out at 120 degrees?
—Is that "standby" screen referring to the temperature in the Prestige Solo 110 or the Smart 40?
—There is also a blue-to-red dial on the Smart 40? What's the purpose of that if I am selecting a temperature on the Prestige Solo 110?
—I currently don't have the system feeding water to the radiators, but once it gets cold enough, what should the setpoint be for the Solo 110 and where should the temperature dial be for the Smart 40 to ensure my home (a 900 sf, two-story row house) is properly heated?

Thanks for any help you might be able to provide!








Comments

  • CanuckerCanucker Member Posts: 604
    I've attached the user manual for your boiler. I'm not experienced with that model but from the literature, I believe that CH 1 is the zone that will control your space heat. The dial you pictured is the set point for your hot water(indirect). That is usually set as a priority, so it will shut down other zones until it's satisfied, which usually isn't long enough to affect the house temp. The picture with the black dial is your mixing valve. That controls the temp of the water that feeds your taps. You can set the indirect to a high temperature for bacterial control and the mixing valve will prevent scalding. The rest of the settings you reference I'm not familiar with but someone who is will probably be along shortly and can clarify
    You can have it good, fast or cheap. Pick two
    HillEasterner
  • flat_twinflat_twin Member Posts: 248
    Standby mode usually means there is no call for central heating or domestic water heating. The readings you see are the current temps in and out of the heat exchanger.
    Having a good overview and understanding of how your heating system works is a great idea. I would't change any settings until you know more about what each of those parameters does and see how the system performs when cold weather arrives. Is there reason to think that it's not working right?
    Find the installation / operating manuals for your boiler and indirect and study them. Understand how the outdoor reset curve works.
    Identify and trace your heating and DHW boiler piping in and out.

    CH refers to central heating settings
    DHW refers to domestic hot water settings
    The red/blue dial is the indirect aquastat. It tells the boiler to go into DHW mode.
  • HillEasternerHillEasterner Member Posts: 4
    Thanks @flat_twin. Unfortunately I reset the settings by accident! I have been studying the manuals, but finding out how they work together has been the challenge. When you refer to the "heat exchanger," would that be the boiler, the indirect, or something else?
  • IronmanIronman Member Posts: 5,574
    edited October 2018
    When the aquastat on top of the indirect is used, it calls for the boiler to heat the tank. If instead, a sensor was used in the tank, then the temp setting for domestic on the boiler would apply. Since you don't have a tank sensor, the dial on top of the tank applies.

    "CH1" is central heating, heat curve 1.
    Bob Boan


    You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.
    HillEasterner
  • flat_twinflat_twin Member Posts: 248
    edited October 2018
    The heat exchanger is in the boiler. There's a temperature sensor on the inlet and outlet of the heat exchanger, those are the readings you referred to in your 1st post.

    Your indirect is also considered a "heat exchanger". I believe your indirect is a tank inside a tank design. The hot boiler water circulates around an inner tank which heats the water inside. This is the hot water that goes to your faucets, showers.


    Canucker
  • kcoppkcopp Member Posts: 3,470
    Where are you located.? It would be helpful to have someone familiar w/ the boiler to show you vs. trying to type out an explanation....
    PS... that T&P valve on the water heater needs to be re-piped... it is not in the top 6" of the water heater.
    HillEasternerrick in Alaska
  • HillEasternerHillEasterner Member Posts: 4
    edited October 2018
    @kcopp I live in Washington, DC. What do you mean “not in the top 6”’?

    @flat_twin I have radiators. They’re the really old kind that stand on the floor. Haven’t had these since boarding school.

    Is there any way to figure out how the dial on my indirect heater corresponds with actual temperature? The “scald hazard” zone would begin at what temperature? 120? Currently I feel like I have to turn my shower all the way to hot to get it more than warm. I suspect my washing machine and dishwasher are not getting very hot water. And I may not be killing potential bacteria (Legionella) in my water.

    I’m also not clear where I should set the mixing valve.

    I miss the days of forced air and a simple hot water heater!
  • flat_twinflat_twin Member Posts: 248
    edited October 2018
    You're a lucky man to have those nice old radiators. They work really well with modcon boilers. If you get things dialed in right, you won't miss forced air ever again!
    Canuckerkcoppdelta T
  • ZmanZman Member Posts: 5,753
    edited October 2018
    With that boiler it it is way too easy for the consumer to change settings by mistake.
    Does your domestic water work correctly? Does anything change if you turn the dial on the tank.If not, it has been disabled and the boiler is controlling tank temp.
    The heat seems to be turned off as indicated by the radiator with the x through it. The CH would normally be switch and setpoint rather than 0-10 vdc.

    The system you have will give you better comfort and higher efficiency than scorched air and inefficient water heater.
    "If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough"
    Albert Einstein
  • kcoppkcopp Member Posts: 3,470
    The relief valve is element is not actually in the tank. The copper piping extends too far out of the tank and it does not provide as good of protection it should.

    ZmanDan Foley
  • kcoppkcopp Member Posts: 3,470


    this may help
    HillEasterner
  • IronmanIronman Member Posts: 5,574

    @kcopp I live in Washington, DC. What do you mean “not in the top 6”’?



    @flat_twin I have radiators. They’re the really old kind that stand on the floor. Haven’t had these since boarding school.



    Is there any way to figure out how the dial on my indirect heater corresponds with actual temperature? The “scald hazard” zone would begin at what temperature? 120? Currently I feel like I have to turn my shower all the way to hot to get it more than warm. I suspect my washing machine and dishwasher are not getting very hot water. And I may not be killing potential bacteria (Legionella) in my water.



    I’m also not clear where I should set the mixing valve.



    I miss the days of forced air and a simple hot water heater!

    I'd recommend that you call Dan Foley of Foley Mechanical in Lorton.

    Bob Boan


    You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.
  • ednelsonednelson Member Posts: 10
    I am in Tech support at Triangle Tube
    if there is anyway I can assist you in understanding how your unit works please contact me
    my name is Ed Nelson I can be reached by phone at 856 228 8881 ext 155
    or email [email protected]
    ZmankcoppHillEasterner
  • rick in Alaskarick in Alaska Member Posts: 1,077
    On your indirect tank, the relief valve is supposed to be installed in the fitting that the drain valve is in. Take the relief valve out of the top of the "T", plug the "T", remove the drain valve, and then move the relief valve to the fitting the drain came out of.
    Do this right away as you are in a very dangerous situation now!
    Rick
  • modconwannabemodconwannabe Member Posts: 49
    I have the same exact system. A couple quick points.
    You misread the diagram of the display: it was showing 100 out, 94 return. That's fine--it's not cold out in DC yet. Depending on the parameters you choose and your house you may see something like 120 or 130 degrees going out and 100 or 11O returning during heating season, or even higher when the temperature dips. If I'm not mistaken your boiler is most efficient when the return water is below 130 degrees so that the exhaust fumes condense.
    The 10v modulating signal in the photos likely means that your system is using an outdoor reset, which means you have a thermostat outside the house that tells the boiler to use more or less power (gas) in a maximally efficient way. That's great!

    If you want your hot water warmer at your shower you can do a few things. One way to do that is turn up the set point for DHW (that's domestic hot water), perhaps 130 or so which is scorching hot, turn the mixing valve above your hot water tank to fully hot water, then run hot water at your shower (make sure your kids aren't around so they don't get scorched). Test the water then go back and use the mixing valve to add in cold water a bit at a time till you get the maximum temp you like at your shower. Then you're done.

    Read the manual and best of all call in a TT-experienced plumber who can look at your system, make sure all is well, and then guide you through the best settings.


  • ZmanZman Member Posts: 5,753
    The 0-10 VDC means it is being controlled by a 3rd part controller. It is the easiest setting to accidentally change.

    I would take the @ednelson from TT up on his offer..
    "If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough"
    Albert Einstein
    delta Tkcopp
  • bennyboybennyboy Member Posts: 7
    I also own the same unit but with a built-in DHW tank. The symbols (looks like a radiator) and settings for CH1 which is the boiler making hot water based on the temperature outside, etc. Then there is the symbol for DHW which looks like a top handle facet has its own settings and sensor.
    Please read or download the manuals in the post-installation area to redo the system's set up.
  • HillEasternerHillEasterner Member Posts: 4
    edited October 2018
    @Zman I now have the temperature dial atop the indirect heater set to halfway, and seem to be getting hot enough water—though admittedly I'm still not sure if my DHW temperature is being determined by that dial or by the boiler.

    @kcopp Thanks for the video, and for the info about the relied valve. I will get that looked at right away. cc @rick in Alaska

    I will be contacting @ednelson ASAP, but just wanted to update that because it's gotten cold here in D.C., I have turned the heating on in the boiler/Solo 110 menu. I know I don't have an outdoor sensor—just one thermostat indoors (see attached photo). I'm wondering whether that means I should use "Switch & Setpoint" or "Constant & Setpoint," and what my CH1 setpoint should be. I have it set to 160, and my radiators seem to be getting quite hot. (My thermostat says it's 75 degrees in my house, but it's clearly wrong. It feels more like 65.)





  • ZmanZman Member Posts: 5,753
    edited October 2018
    You want switch and setpoint.
    If your DHW is working then it is set correctly. If the boiler shows DHW temp in the status, it is reading the temp and controlling it. If not, the dial is doing the work.
    160 degrees is probably enough. you will find out on the cold days.
    "If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough"
    Albert Einstein
    HillEasterner
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