Manufacturer OEM parts

zepfan · January 8

Does anyone know if there is any type of law that equipment manufacturers are required to make replacement parts for their equipment? It seems to me that the time that replacement parts are available is getting less, and less. As an example ECM motor modules(the part that almost always goes bad, when the motor is still ok) is now no longer made by one manufacturer as a replacement part. You have to purchase the entire assembly, the motor, and module. The unit that this out of is only 11 years old. The customer is stuck with either an expensive repair, or a much more expensive complete replacement. Any thoghts would be greatly appreciated. thanks to all

hot_rod · January 8

this is not uncommon throughout the appliance industry now, also.
7 years is what the repairman told me when he worked on our wash machine. Parts will be obsolete and the appliance is consider scrap or recyclable.

It sometimes called a sunset date when a manufacturer looks at the life cycle of a product.
Computers and cell phones are an example of a product that improved almost year by year, and replaced often

I do not know of any laws about parts availability or how they would even get passed ?

mattmia2 · January 8

there is probably some regulation for cars and engines but not much beyond that and much of it i think has to do with safety systems and emissions systems. almost everything on a car is part of one or the other of those systems

EBEBRATT-Ed · January 8

Should be 20 years………Oh I forgot since nothing lasts 20 years anymore, they don't need to make parts available.

GGross · January 8

If the OEM motor is too expensive then source a 3rd party replacement of the same spec, it's not under warranty so where is the issue with that? I have seen manufacturers go back and forth with separated modules/motors, and complete assemblies. the labor will typically cost more than either option. Too many times a customer pays to replace one part and the other was also bad so now they pay for the labor twice, and the part twice when the complete assembly would have been cheaper to begin with. There is also the chance with big brand names that if you are not a dealer they are just charging list price for the part, or if you buy from a wholesaler that doesn't have a direct account with that brand they buy it at list price, mark it up 30% and sell it you, who marks it up 30% and charges the customer. whats the info of the unit you are looking to get parts for? might be worth double checking part availability.

Jamie Hall · January 8

Fortunately — in my view — there is no such law or regulation, even in the EU which is usually full Karen on such things. The only area where this can present a real problem is if the part is patented. Then, unless the OEM is willing to license the patent, there can be problems..

Otherwise, if there is a market for the part someone, somewhere, is going to be making it. Not, unhappily, necessarily tp OEM quality (a real problem in the automotive industry) but at least available. Now again depending on market forces, it may or may not be cost effective to buy and replace it!

There is an interesting situation in the automotive and heavy machinery side on this — and it may also be true on the HVAC sie. As a general rule, if the fault or problem is traced to something with a computer chip or even solid state chip such as a solid state relay, it's going to be a good deal less trouble to junk at least the item in question and substitute a new one than it will be to try to repair or even replace it, like for like, unless you have to (in some extreme automotive cases it's going to be cheaper to junk the whole car than it is to replace some of the faulty "modules" — EV power and battery systems being a good example of that.

I don't think our fancier boilers have gotten there yet, but I dare say that that might apply to the control systems for them.

hot_rod · January 8

Didn't John Deere take it to the point where only John Deere could access the on board computers. So no independents or even equipment owners can work on their own equipment!!

Jamie Hall · January 8

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1881360#Comment_1881360

yup.

zepfan · January 9

Thanks to all that responded. In this particular case the unit in question is a Carrier Infinity communicating VS air handler, so I have not found a third party option if there was it would be risky, in my opinion. In the years I have been doing this I have only had one motor that was bad, while I would imagine I have changed over 100 modules, when they were sold separately. If the motor checked out ok resistance wise, i would re use it with a new module. In some cases if the air handler or furnace was non communicating where it did not need motor feedback in order to enable the heat and cooling I will replace the ecm with a psc motor, and add a relay until the customer could afford a new unit. thanks again to all, and take care

EBEBRATT-Ed · January 9

There was a big to-do about auto repairs around here a few years ago. I don't know if this is nationwide or just here but the automakers fought it for years

The Massachusetts Right to Repair law, passed in 2020, mandates that automakers provide vehicle owners and independent repair shops access to telematics data, enhancing consumer choice and repair options.

Overview of the Law

The Right to Repair law in Massachusetts was approved by voters in November 2020 with approximately 75% support. This law requires automakers to allow vehicle owners and independent repair facilities access to the data generated by their vehicles, particularly through telematics systems. This data is crucial for diagnosing and repairing vehicles, especially as modern cars become increasingly reliant on technology and software. WBUR+1

Key Provisions

Legal Challenges

The law faced significant legal challenges from automakers, who argued that it could compromise vehicle safety and consumer privacy. However, a federal judge dismissed the remaining claims against the law in early 2025, allowing it to be enforced. This ruling was celebrated by advocates who view the law as a victory for consumer rights and competition in the automotive repair market. WBUR+1

Current Status

As of June 2023, Massachusetts Attorney General Andrea Campbell began enforcing the Right to Repair law, marking a significant step in its implementation after years of legal battles. The law is seen as a landmark measure in the ongoing Right to Repair movement, which advocates for consumer rights to repair their own devices and vehicles without manufacturer restrictions. Boston.com+1
In summary, the Massachusetts Right to Repair law represents a significant shift in the automotive industry, promoting transparency and consumer choice in vehicle repairs. It is a crucial development for both vehicle owners and independent repair shops, ensuring they have the necessary access to repair data.

hot_rod · January 9

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1881419#Comment_1881419

John Deere backed off a bit on right to repair with the exception of modifying the controls to bypass emissions and operating conditions

Jamie Hall · January 9

Actually I have some sympathy for the automotive and heavy equipment manufacturers. Why? Because in many States — particularly those following California — if equipment is modified or repaired in such a way as to alter emissions, guess who pays? The manufacturer! Not the bozo who messed up the equipment. This creates a very powerful incentive for the manufacturer to figure out how to keep the bozo out of the equipment…

So in a way you can't blame them…

hot_rod · January 9

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1881457#Comment_1881457

Everyone is involved and can be held liable in those emission delete cases. A diesel tuner in Missouri was fined for doing emission deletes when I lived there.

GGross · January 9

Here they would never dream of actually fining the kids deleting their diesel emissions systems. its really easy to tell when someone does it, its quiet up here you can hear them from miles away, you can see the black smoke. They have gone after a mechanic shop for advertising it as a service but thats it.. Whether you care about the emissions or not the kids deleting those emissions are doing it so they can be loud and obnoxious and blow black smoke all over the neighborhood so they can put it on tiktok. and then they cry because their truck has early parts failures. I could go on and on about this one, im related to one of those kids and it is one of my biggest pet peeves, and the third highest source of stress in my life.

hot_rod · January 10

it was more the farmers, ranchers and RV owners deleting in rural Missouri. They were after the extra hp like the early 12 valve non emission Cummins had.

The pile of parts from my neighbors Duramax delete weighed about 300 lbs! He pulled a big 5th wheel RV with it.

Although he canceled a summer long trip to California after reading about the fines out there😳

The kids “rolling coal” was a different modification. They weren’t looking for extra hp, just trying to make a statement. I guess.

RascalOrnery · January 10

What an interesting dialogue! I work as a machinist and some of the equipment is rather high dollar, and buying stuff that has tech support and parts is the number one factor well above price.

I have noticed a lot of items bought on Amazon or other online Sellers that come from China are nowhere to be found a year later. It appears they crank out product and then dissolve to prevent liability. This is why buying local in any merchandise form usually carries the most security. Local businesses often hold a higher standard, and often will make good or make repairs because they respect your dollar.

Big business makes it cheap but at the cost of practically "sold as is" many times, which sometimes is fine, but not for something you want to last decades. This is what makes me as a home owner leery about a new heating system that is heavily electronically driven. Import items. Delays. My locally built boiler company is still in business and the only electronic needed is a electric motor, everything is made by good old fashioned fabrication, welding and machining. They still make parts and my boiler is nearly 70 years old. Wish I could say the same for my car,

Manufacturer OEM parts

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