Loud radiators - first “shoulder season” night

holograham

so last night was the first time in awhile we had a shoulder season night (~45 degrees) so the heat had a long lag before it kicked on again. The radiators in our bedrooms were especially loud (some gurgling, definitely more of the metallic ticking on warm up). These are one pipe steam radiators mostly gorton C vents on second floor.

Any suggestions here? The valves are all open (several recently replaced even on gurgling one). The pitch is fine. The real change is these had been pretty warm all season given it’s been cold in the Northeast.

ethicalpaul

Don't worry about the pitch, it doesn't matter as long as it's reasonable level.

But since you hear gurgling, there is likely a "settling" that has occurred in your house that has changed the pitch of the pipe under the floor that supplies that radiator. You replaced the valves which rules out another cause which is the valve's seal plate thing rusting and dropping from the valve's vertical screw.

If you hear a radiator gurgling try raising the radiator (both sides) a small amount every few days, like 1/4"-1/2" and see if the behavior is affected. If you are lucky, you will correct the pitch enough to let the condensate drain out of that section of pipe.

As it seems like you know, the reason it does this in the shoulder seasons is the trapped pool of water has time to cool off enough that it causes the steam to collapse when they come into contact. When the water is warm/hot the steam can co-exist with the water.

You can use a two-by-four and a block of wood to make a lever and you can use 1/4" pieces of plywood or whatever under the legs.

holograham

ok I’ll play with the pitch for the gurgling one

The rest I assume the metallic ticking is thermal expansion and not much I can do there

ethicalpaul

I do have one radiator that ticks. For awhile I wasn't sure if it was condensate in the bottom that was making small water hammers, but since then I have done some radiator experiments that showed me this is not "a thing".

I had tried putting plastic sliders under it but the tick remained. When I mentioned it to my wife she unexpectedly said she liked the tick because then she knew she was going to be warmer so now I don't worry about it.

PS: for those wondering why I think condensate in the bottom of a radiator doesn't matter, it's because due to the radiator castings, there is ALWAYS condensate left lying in the bottom of every radiator. Anyone who has removed a radiator from a supply pipe and tilted it can see this. The steam seems to enter the radiator, and flow upward (not surprising), where it condenses on the cool radiator. That condensate of course flows down to the bottom of the radiator where it eventually warms the pool of old cold condensate on the bottom. The steam never comes into contact with cool water, so it doesn't hammer. Even if the radiator is pitched the wrong way.

holograham

So update here - I pitched the radiator a bit more and that helped a significant amount with the gurgling. Still get a little but not nearly as bad.

My radiators definitely have thermal expansion metallic ticks/tings alot more in the shoulder season (likely because of the time between the steam cycles allows the radiators to completely cool. I get the sound both on warm up and while the radiator cools down (though not as rapid/loud on cool down). I assume not much can be done here - have read both tightening and loosening the tie bars - though these are 100+ year old radiators so not really a fan of messing around with them.

ethicalpaul

It's not the pitch. Try to raise the whole thing, not just one side. You really want to raise the valve side, but you want to keep it level so you raise both sides.

Jamie Hall

Expansion ticks within the radiator itself are almost impossible to get rid of. And unless the tie rods are actually loose (you can wiggle them) don't try tightening them — they aren't meant for that. Finger tight and then no more than half a turn on one of the nuts. If that.

And I like your wife's approach…

holograham

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1845943#Comment_1845943

ah I re-read your original post and makes sense now. Will try that though running out of heating days here in NJ