How to pitch this beast radiator

Snowman1990 · January 20

I need to pitch this radiator but it’s quite stationary with the 2 pipes. It’s the only radiator that doesn’t really get hot. Barely hot towards the valve end by the time of finishing hitting room temp.

I believe it’s the incorrect pitch. Has a new gorton D on it.

How can I pitch this and not mess up the piping? It clearly is pitched in the opposite direction of what is needed.

Jamie Hall · January 20

Radiator pitch almost never affects how much or how fast a radiator will heat Not to say that you couldn't lift the vent end slightly — but I doubt that it will make much difference.

However.

How fast does that inlet pipe get hot? Does it heat quickly, up to the valve? If not, where does that inlet line heat to? What I'm thinking about is two possibilities — that the inlet line may not be able to vent, or may have a sag in it, or that that valve is not, in fact, open when you think it iis.

EdTheHeaterMan · January 20

This might get you the pitch you want,

Screenshot 2025-01-20 at 12.22.09 PM.png

but I believe that you need a way to get the air out of the radiator and let the steam into the radiator. Can you remove the vent and see if there is anything coming out the vent opening of the radiator? If nothing is coming out the vent location, then remove the radiator and see if there is any steam coming out of the pipe.

Snowman1990 · January 20

@EdTheHeaterMan amd @Jamie Hall so the pipe and valve do get nice and hot and then the first section of the radiator gets warm.

I will try removing the vent all together to see if it gets hot but I have a feeling it’s years of condensate that maybe never was able to return?

thanks

Jamie Hall · January 20

The condensate would all return. If, that is, the valve is open and the pipe clear…

Waher · January 20

I suspect the valve is clogged or otherwise no longer functioning as intended

Mad Dog_2 · January 20

You can try goosing the air end with some wood 2 x 4s (wont scar wood floors) as a fulcrum and slide a few fender washers under each leg, but don't overdue it or you'll snap the brass spud.

Its so hard to tell from a picture, but it looks well pitched toward the inlet as is. Check that. Mad Dog

EdTheHeaterMan · January 20

@Snowman1990 said: "I will try removing the vent all together to see if it gets hot but I have a feeling it’s years of condensate that maybe never was able to return?"

YEARS of condensate? what does that look like. I have a bottle of water that has been in the back seat of my car for a couple months… I would still drink it. I didn't know that water from condensation had an expiration date.

OR

Do you mean years of debris accumulation? That can be checked out by removing the radiator by disconnecting the union fitting on that valve. Put something under the radiator, like a broken handle snow shovel, before you move it (after you disconnect it) so you don't scratch the floor. Then look inside with a flashlight to see if it is clear.

Snowman1990 · January 20

understood yeah years of whatever can sit in a radiator. This is the only one pitched the wrong way in the entire house. I’ll report back with what I discover.

Thanks everyone

EBEBRATT-Ed · January 21

@Snowman1990

If it is not hammering or making noise its probably not a condensate issue. With that riser going up its going to be difficult to pitch.

If the pitch turns out to be the issue you have a choice:

Put the rad up on blocks and slide it away from the wall and connect it with 2 45 deg elbows with a close nipple between them or a 45 and a street 45 for a swing joint.

Snowman1990 · January 23

So I was able to pitch but no dice. Valve gets very hot, so i assume it’s the radiator?

Snowman1990 · January 23

There seems to be cold air coming out of the radiator with vent off

ethicalpaul · January 23

Cold (room temperature) air will indeed come out of the radiator at first. That's what the vent does is let the air escape the radiator while the steam is coming in.

retiredguy · January 23

Make sure that the valve is fully open. If you still cannot get heat I would take the top of the valve off to make sure that there is no restriction in it. These valves will sometimes break and the parts inside will restrict the opening.

delcrossv · January 23

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1837313#Comment_1837313

Run it for a full cycle with the vent off. Does the rad get warm then? If not, then
Take the bonnet off the valve and make sure the valve is actually functional. If so then
Flip the vent upside down on the rad above on that riser (floor above) Run again with the vent off on this rad. If it then gets hot, the problem is balancing the two rads.

KC_Jones · January 23

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1837300#Comment_1837300

The only way a radiator can go bad is to leak. It's an empty vessel that allows steam in with a vent to let air out. The problem is not the radiator, especially if you can feel air coming out with the vent removed.

How big are the vents on the other radiators? They may need slowed down. One can only speed up so much before the venting, potentially, exceeds the steam supply. At that point control becomes very difficult. Given that you mentioned having a D vent on that one (huge BTW), I'm curious about the other radiators.

Snowman1990 · January 23

@KC_Jones i have a D on the smaller radiator that the riser runs too as well. So put maybe a Gorton 5 on that and see what happens?

Snowman1990 · January 23

@delcrossv how do I remove a “Bonnet”?

KC_Jones · January 23

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1837380#Comment_1837380

I have a feeling that could make a big difference. That said, it's not necessarily just about the radiators on that one pipe. It's about main venting, then all the radiator vents to get things balanced.

Out of curiosity, what is your main venting like?

delcrossv · January 23

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1837381#Comment_1837381

It unscrews from the valve body. Use two wrenches: one on the bonnet, one on the valve body to counter.

delcrossv · January 23

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1837380#Comment_1837380

Yes, Try a 4 or 5 and see what happens. Like @KC_Jones , I'm also interested in how your mains are vented as a D is awfully large to use on a rad.

EBEBRATT-Ed · January 23

@Snowman1990

I would do as @delcrossv recommended.

Take the vent off the radiator. Turn the vent on the radiator above it upside down and make sure the valve on the lower radiator is open.

You want to find out if the radiator will heat. Once you find out it will actually heat then you will be able to troubleshoot further. Be ready to screw the vent back on before steam comes out.

If it does not heat, then I would investigate the radiator valve.

Snowman1990 · January 23

@KC_Jones @delcrossv @EBEBRATT-Ed thank you all. So there is a Gorton 1 at the end of the main line and that’s it. There are no other main vents on the system, which is why I opted to put a D on this one, the room across the way, and the radiator above this one. Everything gets hot except this one big rad

delcrossv · January 23

Flip the upstairs vent over with no vent on the lower one. Bet this one gets hot.

You may be under-vented on your main, but it certainly looks like you're over-vented on your upstairs rad.

EBEBRATT-Ed · January 23

Air and steam will take the path of least resistance. For instance, air and steam coming up the riser to the radiator tee.

Which way do you think the air and steam will go? Pretend you are inside the pipe.

Is it easier for the air and steam to go straight up the riser or is it easier to make a right hand turn and go into the big radiator? The answer is obvious.

You probably need to restrict the venting slightly on the other rads to make this one heat

Don't make a lot of big changes at once or thing will go out of wack.

Just keep tweaking things little by little.

First thing is to find out if the rad will heat at all.

Snowman1990 · January 24

@EBEBRATT-Ed @delcrossv could I just test this by shutting off the valve upstairs vs flipping vent?

delcrossv · January 24

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1837438#Comment_1837438

Do you KNOW the upstairs rad valve works? Flipping the vent shouldn't be hard, just loosen it 1/2 turn. Messing with the upstairs valve just adds a variable.

109A_5 · January 24

Is this the right type of valve and the spud looks like it is going into the Tee and not the radiator.

delcrossv · January 24

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1837449#Comment_1837449

They'll work in either direction. In any event that's not causative here. Looks like a typical in-line rad valve, albeit installed backwards.

Snowman1990 · January 24

@delcrossv @EBEBRATT-Ed you and everyone else were correct. I had to restrict, but by doing so, it threw off other radiators in different rooms. Which tells me that maybe I do have a venting problem at the end of the line in the basement?