Sewer Pumps

9326yssh

Hi

Can anyone share experience with Basment sewer Pump installation my supplier is pushing me to what he says is new non clogged pump working with a vortex impeller

I would love to hear if someone have installed dose type of pumps and had good success with it

Thanks all

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes

Can you give us a make and model? Most ejector pumps work fine until sanitary napkins are flushed down the toilet.

Mad Dog_2

Yeah...and baby wipes..cat litter.. You can't beat a good Liberty or Zoeller macerating sewage ejector. Mad Dog

Jamie Hall

Both "vortex" types (which are hardly new — I was playing with them 50 years ago) and macerating pumps will work just fine.

Until something gets into the sewer which doesn't belong there. Exactly what will stall which type of pump differs with the type of pump. Which kind of object will stall which kind of pump varies, although some things — socks, panty hose, wash cloths, as noted baby wipes, sanitary napkins — will kill any of them.

There are two rules: if it can be flushed, sooner or later it will be, and sooner or later something will be which will jam the pump. Just plan on it.

Intplm.

A sewage pump in the basement. This is not ideal but surely it must be the only way for your situation.

The type of technology that is mentioned by your supplier is not new, its been around for decades as previously mentioned.

A well-maintained sewage pump/sewage ejector works best when sewage and strictly sewage goes down the drain. If anything else gets in there that's when the troubles start.

If by some chance you could use something called a macerator made by a company called Muffin Monster (I think thats the name), clogs would have a lesser chance of occurring.

If this is a residential application, vortex is fine and what is used most of the time.

9326yssh

First Thanks all for replying

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1802160#Comment_1802160

The models I was getting priced for are Barnes 3SEV1094L and Ashland SWH100M3-20

I summary I know now from listening that vortex has been on the market for 50 years I guess it wasn't proven to be the better pump option, please correct me If I'm wrong

I was told that those pumps would handle baby wips with ease and only somthing like wood would get stuck in there

I would greatly appreciate any more feedback and if someone could confirm a model that was installed and almost never cause a problem

Good night / morning for dose far from NY

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1802163#Comment_1802163

These are the brands professionals use. I would add Little Giant and Myers.

Mad Dog_2

Yes, the Muffin Monster is a Nasty, meat grinder. I've used them on municipal sewage treatment, but I don't know if the make residential sizes. They devour everything...Mad Dog

Jamie Hall

Vortex type pumps and macerator/grinding pumps handle different solids well… differently. I have used and installed both types, over the years, both for residential pumping and for municipal lift stations. I have had both types jam because of things that got into the wastewater stream. I've had both types in place for years, working without any attention.

If you have a reasonably well-disciplined household, I would be quite willing to use either type.

hot_rod

they don’t like latex prophylactic so much either, a customer of mind discovered 😯

Mad Dog_2

Our two biggest culprits in NYC sewers are Baby Wipes & grease.Mad Dog

jimna01

My general rule of thumb if it’s not water detergent, soap or human waste it doesn’t belong in the sewer, pump or no pump. Baby wipes etc clog up municipal sewer as well .

Intplm.

You might want to look for a pump that has an auto-reverse feature. This can work wonders when something gets in the way. The pump would sense the obstruction and reverse its rotation. This can often help avoid a clog.

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes

I’ve installed them, but refused to service them. There are better ways to earn a living.

Commercial systems get duplex pumps.

JUGHNE

I have put 3 of them, in hoping to have never see them again. That worked for 2 of the 3.

I did learn to set the basin and then fill it with water, as they want to float up out of the ground.

Also if possible to get the controlling float switch that has it's own cord that you piggyback the pump cord into.

This lets you run the pump in the event of switch failure.

And then just this story of an install I was NOT involved in:

HO wanted to save money and not have a separate basin/pump for his drain tile that surrounded the footing of the house. (SOP here for new construction). So he piped his drain tile into the sewage pump pit along with the DWV from basement bath.

After a couple of years he noticed the basement has some foul odors. Investigations shown that his sewage pump, for some reason, had never run. Rather the basin was overflowing out into the drain tile buried 8' deep around the house, the tile was set in a bed of gravel which worked quite well as a drain field.

I don't know the outcome of this disaster, just glad to not be on that job.😐️

jumper

Anyone remember system called "vacuum lift station"?

Jamie Hall

Yup. Installed a few, too. The big advantage was that when something went wrong, it was rarely at the customer's house but at the central vacuum station.

As a sort of side note — that brings up the biggest problem I've had in the past with any of the small lift station sewer systems, whether they are just going up hill to a septic field or up hill to a collector. The lift station is on the customer's property — and usually is the customer's responsibility. You just know how that's going to work out.

jumper

How did they work, Jamie? Did customer need a "deep" trap to maintain suction?

I also vaguely remember people trying to replace water powered eductors on "flush up" toilets with air powered ones.

Jamie Hall

Actually, both the vacuum type and the lift pump type (either macerators or vortex) work very well. We always tried to get the lift station after a septic tank — and tried (sometimes required, depending on the installation) that the tank be pumped regularly. And the pump types were always duplex, with the alarm set at the lag pump on level.

Vacuum systems are a little tricky, if you have more than one user, as then there has to be a way to close the vacuum off to a sump which has gone dry — otherwise you lose your vacuum on the rest of the line. If you use a float valve (best option) you have to have a screen before it, otherwise it WILL clog.

The septic tank (and pumping it) got rid of most of the nuisance clogs — not all of them, but most of them,

No the problems came not so much from the equipment, but homeowners or renters being completely oblivious to the fact that the equipment was there, and that there was an easement to get at it. But that's a problem not unique to sewer pumps…

9326yssh

Hi

I'm grateful for all who took the time to share their expertise with me I'm still in the working age so I'm not here writing too often

I am also still in the learning age so I will be sharing my thoughts even though some of them might be naive

I wish we could teach renters and especially hotel guests how to use the toilets and what not to flush but that's not my part of the job I recently spoke to a hotel caretaker he told me a story about a guy flushing a bad apple and the toilets and the mess that made and that's without a pump

The concept of a vortex pump looks to me very simple and understandable I wonder why that wouldn't be the first choice for any plumber I'm still on the field cleaning Liberty Pumps and also vertex pumps and the concept of having the impeller more up not inside of the garbage and the impeller vane couple inches away from the volute makes a lot of sense to me

I aware of 2 big commercial spaces using vortex pumps and they have no issues concerning the pumps vs another commercial place with liberty pumps and I'm having the opportunity to service them twice a month apparently when I'm talking about installing a vortex there are a couple of experts saying it's junkie pumps not worth the money I'm wondering why people would say that about vortex

Thanks again for all comments it means a lot for me

Jamie Hall

I wonder if the biggest problem with vortex pumps — which I almost always specified back when i was specifying things — is that they are, inherently, less efficient, particularly in higher head applications. I can't think of any other reason not to like them.

Not that they can't be clogged — I had a nice big four inch vortex pump defeated by a pair of pany hose once — but they are much harder to defeat…