Water heater replacement advice...

edsut

Hi
Over the last few months I've noticed a reduction in the amount of hot water and just recently I saw a water stain under my AO Smith 30gal gas hot water heater. I went to the AO Smith site and tried getting information on my heater, but the serial number and/or model # isn't even in their system, so I guess that means it's quite old and likely overdue for update. Anyway, I searched the forum and didn't find an recent posts on this, so I'll just ask...

Any advice on replacements? That would include manufacturer as well as technology. I think I wanna stick with gas/pilot-30-gal tank style; but if there are other options there I'd like to hear what folks have experienced. Also, is there a better option when its in a garage (colder in winter)?

Note, I plan to do this myself. The gas feed is a flex line and the water in/out lines are just soldered 3/4" copper. I'm hoping to just buy the same size unit so there should be little to do aside from the water in/out lines. I'm not a plumber but have done a lot of copper/pvc/gas piping over the years in my homes, so thoughts on that are also appreciated.

Thanks in advance,
Ed

EdTheHeaterMan

Stick with the simple gas automatic water heater like you already have. When there is a power outage, that water heater will still make hot water. no electric required. All the new stuff has electrical motors and micro processors to save you 10% on your hot water usage. they don't last as long and there are technical problems that you may not be able to overcome in the DIY world.

30 gallon water heaters are less popular, so a 40 gallon may be less expensive. That is the only change i would recommend. KISS

hot_rod

You may not find the exact size. With upgraded insulation tanks have gotten larger 
Shop around the most common size 40 and 50 may be less $$

EdTheHeaterMan

Oh Yea... they make DIY flex connections for the water line also. You may need to cut the pipes back a little to use those push to fit fittings. I have used them as a professional and I believe they are just fine.

JUGHNE

Any WH in a garage is supposed to be elevated so the burner (source of ignition for your auto gasoline leaking) is at least 18" above the floor.

Do you have that there now?

Larry Weingarten

Hi, In addition to everything said above, I'd use the corrugated stainless steel flex connectors as they are simpler to work with than copper. I'd get a six year non-prorated warranty tank and add a second magnesium anode, probably in the hot outlet port. This will help you get a long-lived heater. For one or two people, a 30 gallon tank should work. If you have a larger tank and are conservative about hot water use, you could get an odor (rotten egg) problem, which isn't much fun 🦨
Yours, Larry

EBEBRATT-Ed

40gallon water heaters are usually cheaper than 30 gallon because they sell more of them.

Same thing with a 4" square electrical box is always cheaper than a handy box.

pecmsg

If the space the heaters in allows heat pump water heaters are a consideration. 

JUGHNE

Depending upon the age of your existing WH, you might check the BTUH input on the label.

Some years ago to be "more efficient" burners were downsized resulting is longer recovery time.

So a 40 gallon tank may not have a burner much larger than your old 30 gallon.

edsut

Thanks for the responses! Sounds pretty unanimous to go 40gal rather than 30 if only for cost. It really just depends on size. My boiler is in front of the WH with not a lot of space between.
@JUGHNE yes, it is raised off the floor by what appears to be about 18". Thanks for the pointer.
@EdTheHeaterMan I will look into a flex connector for the water line as well. That will make it easier for the "next" time. :-)
@Larry Weingarten not sure I understand regarding "...add a second magnesium anode...". Do you mean I modify a brand new WH before installing it, or is this a feature that I should make sure I get with whatever I buy?

To all: are there any preferred (or not-recommended) manufacturers?

WMno57

edsut said:

My boiler is in front of the WH with not a lot of space between.

Another option is an indirect water tank heated by the boiler. Then only one flue connection and one gas line for the existing boiler. You could even move the tank to a different location. Just need to pipe the hydronic water to and from the boiler for heating the tank, and the domestic water to and from the tank.
Electric resistance and heat pump water heaters are also possible options to consider.
How big is your household? How much hot water do you use?
We can offer better advice if you post some pictures.

Larry Weingarten

Hi @edsut , Yes, I am talking about modifying a new heater. Two things: If the tank comes with an aluminum anode, I replace it with magnesium. Let's assume you found a tank that has the hex plug type of anode. Then add another magnesium rod at the hot outlet of the tank. This way you get a superior tank that delivers clean water and needs service less often. Changing an anode in a tank that's not been wet and is not in a confined space is much easier too!

Yours, Larry

hot_rod

Check the tank before you remove or replace the anodes. I think Bradford White tanks come with one or two magnesium rods from the factory. Energy saver models have better insulation typically.

edsut

Here's the setup:


Notice that the gizmo that opens the to the flue is actually touching the pressure relief downspout of the water heater. I may have to investigate whether or not that can be rotated 90 degrees..

Here's the top of the water heater.. @Larry Weingarten is that the hex plug you're referring to?


As always, thanks for the responses. This is an amazing forum!

hot_rod

Yes the vent damper can be rotated.
Check the dimensions of the tank you are considering to be sure.
Looks like the gas line is the determining factor

Larry Weingarten

Hi @edsut , Yes, that's an anode. You'll want a 1-1/16" socket to remove it. I'd prefer to use a six point socket so there is no chance of slipping. Also, I believe it's an aluminum anode as there is no weld bump in the top center of it, like most magnesium rods have. An anode could also be added to the hot side... And if you could give us the serial number, I'm pretty sure we could tell you when it was made. Lastly, if you have a look inside of the combustion chamber and find no evidence of leakage there, your heater is probably a candidate for maintenance. Can you give us more info on the water stain you found under the heater? Maybe a photo of that and the name tag? ... What I'm getting at is that your heater may not need to be replaced. There are ways of determining why you're not getting enough hot water. It might have something to do with the plumbing rather than the heater.

Yours, Larry

edsut

@hot_rod Why do you say the gas line is the determining factor? Isn't that the easiest part since I can just use the same or a new/longer one for the replacement? Just trying to understand...

edsut

@Larry Weingarten The serial number is MF99-0065424-246. Model is FCG 30 246. If you can find out
what the age of the unit is, that would be great.
The wet spot is to the bottom left of the tank, visible in the picture. I will certainly do a "repair" rather than "replace" if that is recommended.

hot_rod

edsut said:

@hot_rod Why do you say the gas line is the determining factor? Isn't that the easiest part since I can just use the same or a new/longer one for the replacement? Just trying to understand...

If the new tank is larger diameter you may need to move the gas line over

that looks like s tall model, does  it have a T in the model number? Those were small diameter, but taller, hard to find that size anymore.

something will fit in that space

Intplm.

edsut said:

Thanks for the responses! Sounds pretty unanimous to go 40gal rather than 30 if only for cost. It really just depends on size. My boiler is in front of the WH with not a lot of space between.
@JUGHNE yes, it is raised off the floor by what appears to be about 18". Thanks for the pointer.
@EdTheHeaterMan I will look into a flex connector for the water line as well. That will make it easier for the "next" time. :-)
@Larry Weingarten not sure I understand regarding "...add a second magnesium anode...". Do you mean I modify a brand new WH before installing it, or is this a feature that I should make sure I get with whatever I buy?

To all: are there any preferred (or not-recommended) manufacturers?

@edsut
I have installed probably, every manufacturers water heater that is made.
Probably over a thousand by now.
A company that I have found that is excellent Is Bradford White.
Check out Bradford White water heaters. They do things internally that others do not do.
There water heaters are a great investment through out there entire line.
Others are very similar and often a little less money initially.

Larry Weingarten

Hi, I'm seeing the F 99 as the sixth month in 1999, so 23 + years old. I'm thinking I'd check the anode and see if there's anything left. No anode, or moisture in the combustion chamber would be a clear sign that a new heater is needed.

Yours, Larry

dko

Matters only if you want the least amount of work in repiping.
Note tank diameters, measure how much space is the gap between the rigid gas line to your existing tank.
Your existing tank is 16" diameter.

Bradford White




Aosmith

GCB-30R, the B in the model number means it's a blanketed model. Instead of adding the 2" of insulation on the inside of the tank jacket, they give it to you externally so you can wrap it around. But no one does that, they buy this model because they only could fit a 16" tank.

Your options are mainly aosmith, rheem, or bradford white. Any of them will be fine.
Bradford is big on contractor only installs and purchases. You can get them online, but will be harder to get any support as a homeowner as they do not assist more their homeowner resources on their website. Professional only tech support. Not that water heaters are that complicated anyway.

Buy from a local plumbing supply house and not a big box. Unless they give you wonky non-pro prices. There are quality differences versus buying big box (anode, gas valve, drain valve).

jesmed1

If you're going to be replacing an anode rod, I suggest getting one of these.

https://www.harborfreight.com/automotive/impact-wrenches/7-amp-12-in-impact-wrench-with-rocker-switch-61173.html

The anode rods are installed super-tight at the factory (I believe also with impact wrenches) and can be a bear to remove. Sometimes you need a 3-foot cheater bar on a 1/2-inch drive socket wrench, along with a help to provide counteracting torque on the water heater body, and even then, you might not get it out. Or with a $50 corded impact wrench, and the correct size impact-rated socket, you can get the anode rod out by yourself in 10 seconds.

And depending on how long you want the water heater to last (and how much you relish the idea of replacing the consumable magnesium anode rod every 1-2 years) you might want to look at installing a powered anode rod instead. I got tired of replacing magnesium anode rods every year in our 4-unit condo building and decided to try a powered anode rod. This one has a 20-year warranty.

https://www.corroprotec.com/product/water-heater-anode-rod/

edsut

@Larry Weingarten This is probably a stupid question but... I assume I have to drain the tank and shut off all water lines to/from before attempting to remove the anode, true?
@jesmed1 Yea, no problem with purchasing an impact wrench (any reason to buy a new tool is a good reason); but I'll probably try doing it with a breaker bar and pipe extension first. Then, if I haven't already broken my neck or the water heater and the anode is still stuck, then I'll go for the wrench! LOL!! (not really kidding though)...
Thanks to all!

Larry Weingarten

Hi, No stupid questions! 🤪 Yes, water must be off and pressure relieved, usually by using the drain valve. You don't need to drain the tank down, and don't want to. If it's mostly full of water, it will stay in place better as you play with the anode 👍
Yours, Larry

edsut

Well, the decision on whether I can repair what I have or totally replace it was made for me this weekend...
I woke up Sunday morning to the sound of running water in my garage (where the WH is)...
Had to run (literally) out to Lowes and hope I could find a compatible replacement. They had an AO Smith 30-gal gas unit (very similar to the one I was replacing). The diameter is 2" more than what I had, so I had to rotate the flapper control gizmo on the exhaust stack of my boiler adjacent to the WH.
The trickiest part was getting the new one in place because not only was it a tight fit, but notice that there are water lines from the boiler running in front of it. The only other thing I had to do to make it fit was to cut off the corner of my work tabletop :-(. Yea, I could've spent 2 hours moving that and maybe I would have done that if this was a 'planned' job rather than a Sunday afternoon emergency in 20-degree weather!

Anyway a friend gave me a hand lifting it into place and I am now running with a unit that, according to the sticker, was just built in January of 2024! Can't get much newer than that!

One final question... is there any better way to verify no gas leaks than to just pour on soapy water and look for bubbles? Is there a technique for doing this? It seems like it isn't going to do very well on the bottom side of pipe fittings (know what I mean?).

Thanks to all for the advice and wisdom! This forum is awesome!!!

Intplm.

@edsut
There is a better way or should I say a different way to check for leaks besides spraying and looking for bubbles. This is a very good way to check for leaks.
The big box stores have started caring a gas detector type of wand that works well too.
You can usually find them hanging in the water heater section.
I tried one out. Works pretty much as well as the commercial ones.

edsut

@Intplm. Interesting...
Referring to Amazon, seems they can range in price from about $25.00 to $250.00. Does it pinpoint a leak or just give a general "summary" of the area around the probe?

edsut

I also noticed this stuff... https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0CHJKZ6GN , seems like it would do a much better job than soapy water also cause it will cling to the area much better. Anyone ever use it?

Intplm.

edsut said:

@Intplm. Interesting...
Referring to Amazon, seems they can range in price from about $25.00 to $250.00. Does it pinpoint a leak or just give a general "summary" of the area around the probe?

Pin points the leak.