Life span of a steam radiator valve.

HeatingN00b

Hello all, this is my first year running the steam boiler and I have notice a few things.

3 of the 3 radiator steam valves that was purchased at Lowe's last year are not working (they stay open).

I was wondering.....

1. What is the life span of a radiator valve for a steam system?

2. I have notice they are different types of valves, do the expensive one last longer?

3. What type of valve should be on the furthest radiator?

4. What type should the radiator in the same room with the thermostat have?

5. Do all steam system have a steam trap valve?

Sorry if these questions are too much. 

Jamie Hall

I;m not quite sure whether you have a one pipe steam system -- and you are using the term "valve" to refer to the vents on the radiators -- or whether you are using it to refer to the inlet valves -- or whether you have a two pipe system and are referring to the inlet valves.

But anyway. The actual valves (inlet) can last a very long time (the ones on the system which Cedric powers are 90 years old and still just fine). Valves with regular seats and packing can start to weep after a decade or two, even if they aren't used, but that's easy to fix. Vents, on the other hand, which is what I think you may be referring to, have a shorter life; they work pretty hard. Even so, I'd expect a couple of decades -- if, and only if, they are good quality to begin with and they are not abused. I regret to say that "big box" radiator vents are not always good quality, and some don't even work properly out of the box. Which is, in a way, a partial answer to your number 2. More expensive ones, by and large, are sturdier and last longer.

Again, if war talking vents, remember that the radiator vents control the heat output from that particular radiator, so it is not a question of distance, but of radiator size and heat demand in the room. There should also be main vents -- much larger -- on the steam mains in the basement which allow steam to reach all of the radiators at more or less the same time.

This comment also applies to the radiator in the room with the thermostat - except that I'd generally put a smaller slower vent than I might otherwise use, to make sure that all the rooms get adequate heat.

Do all steam systems have a steam trap valve? Well... one pipe systems almost never do (there are rare exceptions for some odd piping arrangements). Two pipe systems almost always have one on every radiator in the building, and sometimes between mains and returns.

Mad Dog_2

Gorton & Hoffmans...the only ones I'll use.  They can perform perfectly for decades.  Mad Dog 

HeatingN00b

Jamie Hall said:

I;m not quite sure whether you have a one pipe steam system -- and you are using the term "valve" to refer to the vents on the radiators -- or whether you are using it to refer to the inlet valves -- or whether you have a two pipe system and are referring to the inlet valves. But anyway. The actual valves (inlet) can last a very long time (the ones on the system which Cedric powers are 90 years old and still just fine). Valves with regular seats and packing can start to weep after a decade or two, even if they aren't used, but that's easy to fix. Vents, on the other hand, which is what I think you may be referring to, have a shorter life; they work pretty hard. Even so, I'd expect a couple of decades -- if, and only if, they are good quality to begin with and they are not abused. I regret to say that "big box" radiator vents are not always good quality, and some don't even work properly out of the box. Which is, in a way, a partial answer to your number 2. More expensive ones, by and large, are sturdier and last longer. Again, if war talking vents, remember that the radiator vents control the heat output from that particular radiator, so it is not a question of distance, but of radiator size and heat demand in the room. There should also be main vents -- much larger -- on the steam mains in the basement which allow steam to reach all of the radiators at more or less the same time. This comment also applies to the radiator in the room with the thermostat - except that I'd generally put a smaller slower vent than I might otherwise use, to make sure that all the rooms get adequate heat. Do all steam systems have a steam trap valve? Well... one pipe systems almost never do (there are rare exceptions for some odd piping arrangements). Two pipe systems almost always have one on every radiator in the building, and sometimes between mains and returns.

Thank you. For the great detailed information.
Yes I mean radiator vents. The steam system is old and has a combination of vents all throughout the house. The upstairs vents all have golden / brass vents (except for two radiator one I change and the other I am unable to remove).
I think I found the steam main vent yesterday as I was removed the panels from the wall. I don't know if the vent is the correct size or if the vent is working properly (pictures). The pipe looks like it's going back to the boiler all throughout the basement floor.

How do I know what size vent a radiator should have? I found these images on the Internet I was going to replace all the vents in the house to make sure it look like this but it does not say radiator size should have a certain vent size.

HeatingN00b

Mad Dog_2 said:

Gorton & Hoffmans...the only ones I'll use.  They can perform perfectly for decades.  Mad Dog 

Thank you. How do I know what size to install on the radiators?

Jamie Hall

HeatingN00b said:

Mad Dog_2 said:

Gorton & Hoffmans...the only ones I'll use.  They can perform perfectly for decades.  Mad Dog 

Thank you. How do I know what size to install on the radiators?

It's kind of a guessing game. There are some guides as to the correct size -- look around various threads here -- but the real objective is to get each room heating the way you want it. It's best to start off with rather slow vents.

ethicalpaul

China makes some amazing wonderful products. However, the big box radiator vents are not any of them. Both of these are cases are exclusively because American companies direct them to.

Everyone has their brands, but I like Maid O Mist and Gorton (Gorton for when I feel like spending extra $$$). Replace any big box vent you have today, don't wait for the short time for it to fail.

Here's my easy venting guide. Don't bother doing this when it's 60 degrees out, you want to set this system up for the cold days of winter, so that's when you should balance your system. You can do steps 1-3 now of course.

1. Make sure your main venting is good.

2. Put a #4 (the smallest available size) from either of the above two manufacturers on every first floor radiator.
3. Put a #5 on every upstairs radiator unless you want it cooler, in which case put a #4.
4. Run it like that for a week. Keep a piece of paper on each radiator and make a note on it every time you find that room to be too cold or too warm or just right.

Then, once every three days do the following:
5. Pick your most uncomfortably warm room. Make that radiator's vent smaller if you can. If you're at the smallest size and it's still too warm in there, cover part of the radiator with a blanket to make it radiate less. Only change one radiator's vent or blanket every three days. Keep updating your note papers.

When you are done with the warm ones above, once every three days do the following:
6. Pick your most uncomfortably cold room and increase its vent size by one (4 to 5, or 5 to 6, or 6 to C). Only change one vent every three days. Keep updating your note papers because changing one radiator can affect another.

After that, every three days you can do one of 5 or 6 until you are sick of this process and are comfortable enough. Then you'll never have to do this again.

PS: note that Maid O Mist while not "adjustable", does let you exchange the sizing orifices on their vents, so you if you find you need a "C" for example, you can buy it, and just swap the orifices. You can even buy one of their vents that comes with all of the orifice sizes. It's much easier to change the orifices than the vents, which makes it very good for a balancing process like the above.

HeatingN00b

ethicalpaul said:

China makes some amazing wonderful products. However, the big box radiator vents are not any of them. Both of these are cases are exclusively because American companies direct them to. Everyone has their brands, but I like Maid O Mist and Gorton (Gorton for when I feel like spending extra $$$). Replace any big box vent you have today, don't wait for the short time for it to fail. Here's my easy venting guide. Don't bother doing this when it's 60 degrees out, you want to set this system up for the cold days of winter, so that's when you should balance your system. You can do steps 1-3 now of course. 1. Make sure your main venting is good. 2. Put a #4 (the smallest available size) from either of the above two manufacturers on every first floor radiator. 3. Put a #5 on every upstairs radiator unless you want it cooler, in which case put a #4. 4. Run it like that for a week. Keep a piece of paper on each radiator and make a note on it every time you find that room to be too cold or too warm or just right. Then, once every three days do the following: 5. Pick your most uncomfortably warm room. Make that radiator's vent smaller if you can. If you're at the smallest size and it's still too warm in there, cover part of the radiator with a blanket to make it radiate less. Only change one radiator's vent or blanket every three days. Keep updating your note papers. When you are done with the warm ones above, once every three days do the following: 6. Pick your most uncomfortably cold room and increase its vent size by one (4 to 5, or 5 to 6, or 6 to C). Only change one vent every three days. Keep updating your note papers because changing one radiator can affect another. After that, every three days you can do one of 5 or 6 until you are sick of this process and are comfortable enough. Then you'll never have to do this again. PS: note that Maid O Mist while not "adjustable", does let you exchange the sizing orifices on their vents, so you if you find you need a "C" for example, you can buy it, and just swap the orifices. You can even buy one of their vents that comes with all of the orifice sizes. It's much easier to change the orifices than the vents, which makes it very good for a balancing process like the above.

Thank you for your great and detailed explanation on the vents options and the balancing process. This is what I was looking for. I will print this guide and follow it to the notes.

I will go with the maid o mist vents, love the option of being able to change the orifices and the price thank you for sharing this information.

Questions.
Some of my radiators have an extra part that the vent are screwed on to. Do you recommend that I remove the part or leave it (the additional part makes the whole smaller). Also how would I find the correct size (threaded size for the vent).

We bought like 3 different sizes and just screw on the one that fits.

Will wd40 work to loosen the vents?