Should I replace my well pressure tank? Pictures of inlet

Jersey2

The inlet connection of my well pressure tank has a very slow drip. Maybe two drips a day. It's not condensation. I took some pictures of it. Do you think it should be replaced? The tank is 13 year old and the diaphragm is fine, which is a shame about the inlet. I think I should replace it. It looks a bit wet all over, that is from me putting fluid film on it but I did it too late, I didn't know it was rusting.

Jamie Hall

Are you sure it's a leak and not condensation? If the humidity is high and you put cold water in the tank from the well, you'll get condensation on the tank and on the inlet...

Jersey2

I'm pretty sure it's not condensation. I put my camera under it to make a time lapse video so I can see exactly how it is dripping. I think it will be an interesting video, I will let it record all night.

H2OBandit603

Try toweling everything off after the well  pump hasn’t been running for a few hours and the water in the tank has come to ambient temp to eliminate the possibility of condensation.  I’ve pulled out some really awful pressure tanks that never actually rusted out but the diaphragm had gone so required replacing.  13 years isn’t bad.  These tanks aren’t cheap but replacing it is straightforward.

Some manufacturers use a stainless steel elbow for the connection (Well X Trol) and the rust could be superficial.

The fact that you noticed it in the summer definitely has me leaning toward condensation.

Mad Dog_2

Yeah...wipe it down dry. Blow dry the area.  Get a good light on  it.  It could start condescending quickly but you should he 2-4 minutes to see if its actually leaking. Mad Dog 🐕 

H2OBandit603

2 drops a day is really low for an actual leak in my opinion.  Any time I’ve had a leak on a connection like that it has been immediately noticeable and not something that needed attention years down the road.   A leak is typically beading up every few seconds to a minute tops.  If it’s tight it’s not going to bead at all once condensation is eliminated.  Hard to believe you are leaking two drips a day

hot_rod

How do you even count two drips a day?

Jersey2

Welp I looked at the time lapes video, all I saw was condensation. So you guys might be right that it is just condensation, it is pretty humid in the basement. I will try not using the water like you suggested for it to reach room temperature.

H2OBandit603

I liked Mad Dogs blow dryer idea as well just to take the chill off the metal.  You just need to eliminate the cold surfaces and I’m pretty confident you will see there’s nothing going on at that joint.

EBEBRATT-Ed

The connection doesn't look that bad, at least not bad enough that it isn't likely to just let go. I suspect condensation as well.

Save for a new tank, 13 years is not bad. The diaphragm is usually the first thing to go

H2OBandit603

Kudos for actually noticing your tank though…

as previously stated the diaphragm is the weak link and that goes, then the pump short cycles until it kills itself, typically without the home owner noticing anything worth mentioning to their pump installer.  If the tank was replaced the pump would have had a good run afterwards with the new tank.  Worst case the guy who swaps out the pump doesn’t take the time to verify the tank is good and then your brand new pump gets cooked by the same bad tank.

The new tanks we install are 7 year warranty, pumps typically last 10-12 years but I’ve pulled out 40 year old submersibles that were finally giving into entropy.  Short cycling and lightning strikes are what kill well pumps.  Take care of your tank and it will take care of your pump.

STEVEusaPA

hot_rod said:

How do you even count two drips a day?

Lawrence Welk style...A one and a two...

Mad Dog_2

Geez...I actually remember watching Lawrence Welk with Oma...ha ha  Liberace!!!
Hollywood Sqaures, The Dating Game.  Mad Dog 🐕 

Jersey2

So after not running the water for 24 hours and hitting it with a hair dryer and making a 12 hour time lapse video I am back to thinking that it is a slow leak. I am making one last time lapse tonight just in case it might possibly still be cold enough to make condensation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WMXUfuhbvI

Jersey2

H2OBandit603 said:

Kudos for actually noticing your tank though…

as previously stated the diaphragm is the weak link and that goes, then the pump short cycles until it kills itself, typically without the home owner noticing anything worth mentioning to their pump installer.  If the tank was replaced the pump would have had a good run afterwards with the new tank.  Worst case the guy who swaps out the pump doesn’t take the time to verify the tank is good and then your brand new pump gets cooked by the same bad tank.

The new tanks we install are 7 year warranty, pumps typically last 10-12 years but I’ve pulled out 40 year old submersibles that were finally giving into entropy.  Short cycling and lightning strikes are what kill well pumps.  Take care of your tank and it will take care of your pump.

My pump is almost 12 years old. I hope it lasts a few years longer, it is on the expensive side to replace. I remember the well man telling me that the pump that I had was low quality and pumped much more gpm than I needed. It died at 9 years old.

H2OBandit603

Pump sizing back in the day was tricky, you needed a rather large tank to accept, between 40 and 60 psi, atleast 1 minute of run time, 2 minutes is better but even 1 minutes worth is optimistic.  Even a largish tank is only going to take 10 gallons to fill the bladder between 40/60 in 1 minute.

the purpose of the run time is to dissipate the heat generated during start up.  A pump that’s running is a happy pump, short cycling will shorten its life.

The upgrade we offer is the Franklin electric SubDrive which is a three phase induction(the newest ones are permanant magnet) motor which matches RPM between 1800 and 4800 to meet the demand with soft start rather than the typical pump running at 0 or 3450 rpm.  You can now pump 15, 20, 25 gpm into the house at 70 psi using a 1.5/ 2 horse power motor without needing anything bigger than a 202 sized tank and in applications around 15 gpm we’ve used a stainless tank on the wall thats the size of a thermal expansion tank although I notice the pressure is steadier with the bigger tank, with the added benefit of built in pump protection in case you over pump the well.  Not your cheapest option but when you compare apples to apples the price difference closes a bit because of the smaller tank and the smaller wire sizes allowed on the three phase wire chart.

if you priced out a standard system that could pump 20 gallons a minute vs a constant pressure I feel like you are getting a better value with the constant pressure because the performance is noticeably better even if the total expense is a little higher.

We actually special order 1”x 600’ rolls of 315 psi poly and routinely install 2 hp SubDrive motors with 10 gpm heads on them and they perform, at 70 psi, all the way down to the pump. To do this with a standard system just isn’t realistic.

in situations where the pump doesn’t need to be installed as deep higher gpm pump ends are installed on the same motor and it translates to a lot more water into the house but gives up the ability to pump to those depths.

H2OBandit603

@Jersey2 If you really think the joint is leaking I will be happy to talk you through draining the system, unhooking the T and re taping and doping the joint, checking the pressure in the bladder and flushing the system out over text or even FaceTime.  Idk if you can ever eliminate the possibility of condensation in that basement but redoing it might make you feel better. 

If you get really ambitious I can talk you through installing a new tank, union tank T and fittings.  That T looks pretty because I pressure washed it after assembly to remove excess tape/dope.  What one man can do, another can do.

hot_rod

From the rust stain it looks like a leak could be on the top of the ell, not where the copper threads in?

leonz

It is condensation, you only need to replace it if the bladder is ripped and you have problems with pressure and pump cycling to much because of the lack of resistance from a gas charge in the tank.

If you want to spend time on your system you could install a large water storage tank and mercury switches to control the deep well submersible (assuming this is what you have) and create a no back pressure operating system allowing the well pump to simply slow to a stop and run on a timer rather than be forced to stop with a bladder tank. If you have a 2 pipe jet system it will work the same way and you can use a small self priming centrifugal shallow well pump from the storage tank to feed the homes water supply.

hot_rod

leonz said:

It is condensation, you only need to replace it if the bladder is ripped and you have problems with pressure and pump cycling to much because of the lack of resistance from a gas charge in the tank. If you want to spend time on your system you could install a large water storage tank and mercury switches to control the deep well submersible (assuming this is what you have) and create a no back pressure operating system allowing the well pump to simply slow to a stop and run on a timer rather than be forced to stop with a bladder tank. If you have a 2 pipe jet system it will work the same way and you can use a small self priming centrifugal shallow well pump from the storage tank to feed the homes water supply.

Can you even buy a mercury switch any more😗

mattmia2

Not a new one.

Jersey2

So I bit the bullet and installed a new tank. The leaks were right in the metal of the inlet elbow. Plus the thing had a lot of muck in it. Not worth trying to salvage it. I guess 13 years is about the life span of a diaphragm tank for my well. I want to thank you guys for your input :-)

leonz

Your whole house filter needs to be piped before the bladder tank not after.

You need to have your submersible well and pump cleaned and the submersible pump raised up in the water column as the iron in your well water is making a mess of things for you.

H2OBandit603

If you pipe a filter in before the pressure tank you are asking for trouble. The tank T has a relief valve(75-100 psi)  if the filter plugs up before the pressure tank it’s going to explode when the pump dead heads., when the filter plugs up after the pressure tank you don’t have pressure in the house and you change the filter.  Strongly disagree with you on that one.  If he’s having problems with water quality which a cartridge filter really isn’t indicative of, raising or lowering the pump in the water column shouldn’t affect water quality, the only time we would raise a pump is to avoid a soft spot which has cave in potential and can introduce sediments and it’s best practice to stay above these spots.

Cleaning the well however, is an option in the form of a gallon of un scented bleach down the well, followed by the hose off the pressure tank T to make a nice circuit and let it go like that until it’s stirred up and you pump it off until clear and you don’t smell bleach anymore.

Jersey2

I agree, adding a filter before the water tank is looking for trouble. Flushing is a good idea, I don't want to do it now with a brand new install, doing it with the old tank would have been a good idea. I didn't think of it. I suppose I can empty the tank periodically to get the liquid rust out of the bottom before it accumulates and becomes muck.

H2OBandit603

Honestly the tank isn’t going to get gunked up if you flush it out it will be a good preventative measure, even once a year.  The problem around here is people get upset because they want to do laundry and everybody wants to shower so they don’t want to deal with waiting for the red water aftermath to clear up.  Every time I see stuff pumped out of the well I think “great, that’s not down the well anymore.”  As simple as I make it sound we don’t even do it at our own houses for the reasons mentioned lol.

Robert_25

Nice install on the new tank. Drain it annually and write the date on the tank with a market. That would also be a good time to check the air pressure in the tank. By keeping the sediment in the tank to a minimum and the air charge correct, you will maximize the life of the tank.

@H2OBandit603 I have the same issue at my house. Finding a good time to take the water out of service with a family of 4 can be a challenge.