Steam expert needed in Fairfield County, Connecticut

GAC

Dear Heating Help community,
We live in CT. We recently converted our steam heating system from oil to gas. Our old system worked but we wanted a more efficient unit and the price of oil kept rising. The HVAC company installed the new boiler but we have been experiencing some issues since. There is now a leak on the equalizer pipe and a frothy substance in the sight glass. There is also an incessant banging in the pipes. The HVAC company said they did their job by replacing the boiler and the boiler works so we should get someone else to fix the issues. They are insisting that they did not touch the equalizer pipe, even though they attached a pipe to it during installation, and they claim that they skimmed the boiler even though the frothy substance is still appearing in the sight glass. In addition, we were continually in the basement during the installation and never once did we see them do anything that looked like skimming. We cannot find anyone who understands steam who can help us figure out how to fix these issues. Please help!
GAC

KC_Jones

First rant. If a company can't diagnose, and work on all aspects of steam they absolutely should not even be quoting a boiler replacement. It's really a shame on them situation, but that doesn't help you.

First the equalizer. Whether they touched it or not is immaterial. The hartford loop connection is supposed to be at a certain height relative to the water line. If they didn't touch it, that could actually be a problem as putting it above the water line could cause banging at the connection. The banging could have caused the leak. Also, I don't see how it's possible they didn't touch the equalizer, actually since the equalizer is part of the near boiler piping and connects to the return on the boiler, they had to touch it.

The banging could be caused by surging putting water into the mains. If they didn't spend, I'd say at least 4-6 hours skimming properly, then it needs done more. Basically if they didn't come back after the install and spend some time down there, they didn't skim, at least not properly.

The banging also could be incorrect piping causing water to shoot up into the mains.

I think it would be a great idea to post pictures of the installation. The boiler, piping around the boiler etc. Make sure there are views from far enough back to see all the piping and the boiler so we can see what you are dealing with.

I love that this site is here to help people, I hate that it needs to exist because of garbage contractors. I'm sorry you are going through this.

ethicalpaul

With some photos we can offer some opinions, like KC said. If you haven't paid the final payment on the boiler installation, withhold it until they have it behaving quietly and correctly (I realize it may be too late)

MaxMercy

GAC said:

Dear Heating Help community,
We live in CT. We recently converted our steam heating system from oil to gas. Our old system worked but we wanted a more efficient unit and the price of oil kept rising.
GAC

I have oil at home and gas at my business, and gas has gone up over 60% in the last two years. Oil peaked and now is below $3.50 a gallon as I type this (my last fill I paid over $5).

Hopefully your new boiler is more efficient because it's newer, but all things being equal, oil and gas come out the same year in year out.

I don't know nearly enough about steam to comment on your problem as a lot of guys here, so I'll defer to them, but if you post half a dozen pics of the new system from several angles getting all the piping in, I'm sure folks here will tell you why you're getting banging (steam only bangs when something's wrong).

ChrisJ

MaxMercy said:

GAC said:

Dear Heating Help community,
We live in CT. We recently converted our steam heating system from oil to gas. Our old system worked but we wanted a more efficient unit and the price of oil kept rising.
GAC

I have oil at home and gas at my business, and gas has gone up over 60% in the last two years. Oil peaked and now is below $3.50 a gallon as I type this (my last fill I paid over $5).

Hopefully your new boiler is more efficient because it's newer, but all things being equal, oil and gas come out the same year in year out.

I don't know nearly enough about steam to comment on your problem as a lot of guys here, so I'll defer to them, but if you post half a dozen pics of the new system from several angles getting all the piping in, I'm sure folks here will tell you why you're getting banging (steam only bangs when something's wrong).

I suspect that varies greatly from area to area.
Our natural gas hasn't changed much, but oil certainly has for now.

JohnNY

I perform mechanical consulting work and provide expert witness testimony all over the east coast. If you think I can help you, please get in touch. www.72Fmechanical.com

BobC

Charlie from western mass (garrityplumbing@gmail.com) is the guy to sort this out for you but he is very busy so he's not going to come right out and look at it. New England Steamworks might also go down to CT (https://newenglandsteamworks.com/). Contact both of them to see if they service your area.

Post some pictures of the boiler and the piping around it so we can see what kind of a butcher jab they foisted on you - stand back a bit and try to capture it from different angles so we can see where everything goes.

It sounds like they dumped in some cleaner instead of skimming, that stuff should be flushed out after a week or two to get rid of some of the crud.

Did you sign a contract for this, was it inspected by the town? I'm sure you paid a good chunk of change to have that boiler changed out, if you have a signed contract from them I would tell them your going to seek legal redress and if that doesn't get them to move on it find a lawyer. Shady contractors get away with this crap because people don't hold them accountable for the work they do.

Bob

MaxMercy

ChrisJ said:

I suspect that varies greatly from area to area.
Our natural gas hasn't changed much, but oil certainly has for now.

Probably, but I'm in Connecticut using Eversource, and even when I shut my boiler off for the summer, I'm paying "transportation" costs of about $700 per year at my commercial building.

The last few years oil has been *very* cheap. Right now it's up but, like the stock market, I believe that if you average out for the long term, you come out ahead with oil. When I replaced my home boiler a few years ago, I went with oil because, in CT anyway, it's cheaper.

I keep gas at my commercial building because I have tenants who pay their own gas as well and I believe gas apparatus is less maintenance overall.

ethicalpaul

Let's consider not having another oil vs gas discussion in the middle of this person's boiler thread

Mad Dog_2

Call John Cataneo. He's not far and will set you straight. Mad Dog

Jamie Hall

I too thin @JohnNY is your man. So far as I know, @New England SteamWorks doesn't get to Fairfield County at all. @Charlie from wmass might -- but he' very busy.

Charlie from wmass

I habe a half dozen or so installations in Fairfield County but none are up for service until next Summer. Perhaps post a few photos here as a starter. 

GAC

This is a year late but I am still having banging issues so I will post some photos. We have since changed the leaking pipe that was left by the company that did the installation. 
  

Mad Dog_2

Oh My.no wonder...Mad   Dog 🐕 

neilc

can we see a wider veiw, and higher, any pipes to the left?
and more of what's to the right, including up higher to the ceiling,

then also post a picture of the other side of the boiler, showing the controls, and sightglass,

where are you in Ffld Cnty? what town?

pedmec

No amount of skimming is going to stop the banging. The riser on the right hand-side should not be on a horizontal plane before tying into the header. There is a reason your riser is supposed to be 24" above the water line before changing directions. maybe you can get lucky with the two risers and skimming.

Looks like another contractor trying to fit a square peg into a round hole. He tried to use the existing header to save himself from threading pipe instead of just doing a new header. Probably another contractor who doesn't own a threader.

i would try and repipe the riser and see if you can get (2) 45's to work if the skimming doesn't work.

mattmia2

Took me a minute to see the horizontal section in what should be a riser. Looks like there are 2 generations of old headers that weren't removed. If the manual calls for larger risers bring both risers up to the size in the manual at a minimum.

Mad Dog_2

It needs complete repiping...the last two installers took major short cuts   Mad Dog 🐕 

Charlie from wmass

Call me and we can discuss my terms and I will try to fit you in the schedule. The banging may have nothing to do with what is in these photos. I do not see any water traps or puddles. While they did try and cut corners it doesn't mean that the problem is at the boiler. Do you have a count of your radiators? Do you have a size and model of your boiler?

EBEBRATT-Ed

Probably can be fixed without destroying everything that is there. The risers are probably undersized and the one on the right could be fixed. The configuration looks to be right.

GAC

GAC

There are 13 radiators and the boiler is a Utica PEG 299 series gas steam boiler.

dko

Could you take some quick pics of some of the radiators? All roughly the same size?