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EdTheHeaterMan
EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 4,205
edited February 20 in THE MAIN WALL
I have seen so many times that a discussion to resolve a problem is hijacked by persons that like a particular answer that reminds them of another story that is completely off topic. Perhaps this is a good forum to tell those stories but it may be a disservice to the original poster who's problem gets buried in all that good fun.

Maybe we can refer those stories to this discussion to let the OP get back to problem solving.

Here is an example:

Your have a real issue that may be unique to your installation. This reminds me of a story about a BlueRay oil fired furnace. This was a failed experiment where the BlueRay Systems Inc developed a oil burner that burned with a blue flame. It was more efficient than the conventional yellow flame we all know and understand. There were thousands of units sold over the few years they were popular. The maintenance was difficult and if not completed properly the furnace or boiler would soot up rather quickly.

On one of the successful systems the furnace was installed in a basement directly under the living room where the homeowner had a rocking chair that was her normal sitting position for the majority of her time in the home. When ever the burner operated the chair would vibrate with much annoyance to the home owner. No adjustment would resolve the issue. When the factory technical people arrived at the job, it was determined that if the chair was moved to the left or to the right by just 24" the vibration was not detectable. As this was the least costly way to resolve the problem, the factory requested that the chair just be moved.

The customer was old and set in her ways and did not want to move the chair. So after months of consternation and negotiation, the furnace was replaced with a different furnace of the same specification and model number. The problem was resolved. The factory engineer report concluded the a harmonic vibration inside the equipment was in perfect tune with the structural members of the home directly above the furnace and directly below the rocking chair. The rocking chair acted as an amplifier of the vibration. The replacement furnace flame/heat exchanger combination did not have an identical frequency and therefore the vibration was not detectable.

I also experienced something called Tank Hum in a fuel tank connected by a copper tube to a Sundstrand model J pump. The customer complained about the noise after I completed the annual maintenance. It may have has a small wafer called an anti-hum device that fell out of the pump while i was cleaning the pump strainer. The fuel tank acted as an amplifier for the vibration frequency of the 1725 RPM gear set in the fuel pump. I was told by the service manager to take a piece of copper and coil it around a coffee can to create a loop and install that loop at the tank valve with the other end connected to the fuel line to the burner I just removed from the tank valve. ...HUM was gone!

To your point, you have a harmonic hum that is being amplified by something. It could just be that adding a vibration damper somewhere, or a loop of pipe, or bending a fitting, or loosening a screw, or moving a support hanger will interrupt the unusual harmonic vibration that is being amplified to your particular home. I don't think the equipment is at fault... I just think your home is just really tuned in to that heater!

Edit.
Try adding a u shaped trap the the piping near the suspect mixing valve, or try a different pump. Process of elimination. one thing at a time



Another poster added:

As I recall after a couple of years they came out with a 'Conversion Kit" to change the original Carlin burner back to "yellow flame"

Most of the complaints were of smell and you would find the burner carboned up.

If you were one of the lucky ones you could have the burner cleaned twice a year and it would run OK. They had draft issues.

When the company owner sold the business in the mid 80s my last job for him was to install a new Weil McLain boiler in his house. Since I was starting my own business at the time he had given me a "deal" on a truck and some tools. The pay back was he would buy the new boiler and I had to install it for free.

Unfortunately for me I not only had to remove the blue ray boiler and install the Weil but I had to remove the old original boiler which "his boys from the Hartford office" left their because they couldn't figure out how to remove it when they installed the blue ray. I took it apart and slid the sections through the cellar window.

There was only cellar access through his front door, across white carpeting to the door to the cellar which had a turn in the stairs. We covered the carpeting with tarps and plywood. 3 guys 1 long day and never went back.

A job I would like to forget



Then @Daveinscranton added this really great story
@Daveinscranton Member Posts: 108
2:13PM
My great great grandfather grew up starving in the times of Charles Dickens. Ran a push cart as a child with his father dealing junk off the push cart for a drunkard. They bought the business. He eventually became a “metal broker”. Near as I can tell, that meant salvage yard operator. Became quite wealthy. Spent it on alcohol, fast horses, and many marriages. The rest he wasted.

He bid a job salvaging a big boiler from a factory. Got the bid. Everyone thought that he would lose his shirt on the deal. Dynamite had become available a few months prior to the job. At 6 am on a Sunday morning he blew the wall off the factory. Uneventfully. By 8 am the boiler had been cut loose and was being dragged out by a team of horses. By 9 am the bricklayers were bricking up a new wall. By noon, the boiler had been dragged down the street, and sold to its new owner, who was tickled pink.

I suspect that he was quite good at writing contracts. I also suspect that things could have gone terribly wrong. They didn’t.

The above is clearly off topic. I apologize. Ed’s story, which I found fascinating, reminded me of some family history, long ago and far away.

best wishes
ayetchvacker
mattmia2
EdTheHeaterMan
Edward Young
Retired HVAC Contractor from So. Jersey.
Services first oil burner at age 16
P/T trainer for EH-CC.org

CLambErin Holohan Haskell

Comments

  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 4,205
    edited February 20
    OK, I'll be the first to add a story.

    The day I quit the family business.

    I did not like delivering oil, I preferred to do service calls. You dress differently for service calls. After getting off the Oil Truck on any given Tuesday, I asked my Uncle Joe "Will I was driving the oil truck tomorrow or will I be on Service? Unk said SERVICE!

    Wednesday I was dressed to be mostly indoors on a very cold day. Uncle Joe tells me to go in the back room and get some more clothes on because a driver called in sick and I needed to get on B-13 and Deliver some OIL. So I get some layers of oversized pants and shirts and covered them up with a baggy set of coveralls. I felt like (and looked like) Ralphie's litter brother in the red snow suit, only it was blue. Not real happy, i started my deliveries.

    The neighborhood was changing in the area i was delivering from a upper middle class customer on automatic delivery with charge account, to a less affluent Cash On Delivery customer. At that time 100 gallons of fuel was $29.95... A lot of money back then. A pulled up to my 5th or 6th stop and knocked on the door. The customer answered the door and I asked for $29.95. The customer said he would pay after the oil was delivered. It was a company policy that if a driver delivered oil to the wrong house or was unable to get paid for the delivery, the driver was docked for the cost of the fuel.

    Not wanting to be the victim of a deadbeat customer, I returned to the truck and continued on to my next stop. Then a call came over the 2 way radio. "B-13 COME IN... B-13". It was Uncle joe. "Did you just leave a stop on Old York Road with out delivering the oil?" I answered in the affirmative and told Uncle Joe that I had a bad feeling about this customer. Unk assured me that this customer would pay and to return to the customer. So i drove around the block and blocked traffic again and did the trick my dad taught me. Put the ticket in the meter, connect the oil hose to the customers basement fill connection and tell the customer the oil is going in. But don't open the valve on the hose nozzle. Then I asked to get paid because the oil was going in. The customer said after he gets the metered receipt. Well I knew I was not going to get paid so I rolled up the hose and left again.

    Then a call came over the 2 way radio. "B-13 COME IN... B-13 DO YOU READ ME?".
    I replied "This is B-13"
    Unk JOE: "Eddie, this is your Uncle Joe, you left the customer again."
    ME:"Yes sir, I believe this customer will not pay"
    Unk JOE: Go back, they will pay"
    ME: "But they won't pay until the oil is in the tank"
    Unk JOE: "They will pay"
    ME: "As long as it won't come out of my PayCheck"
    Unk JOE: "It won't"
    So I drove back, put the oil in the tank, brought the Receipt to the customer... and the customer refused to pay. They had no money.

    I was already miffed about driving the DARN oil truck that day, then after playing footsie around the block 3 times on a busy Philadelphia street and My Dear Uncle Joe not taking my advise about this deadbeat, I stormed down to my truck and drove away in a rage. There was a odd wherring sound then a bang as I Raced away (As fast as a fuel oil truck could speed anyway) Then there was horn honking, So I looked out the side view mirror. To my surprise there was a 150 ft. long orange tail following me. The delivery hose was dragging behind me. Oil was spilling on the roadway. I stopped and applied the emergency shut off valve, rolled up the hose and discovered there was no nozzle at the end. It was still connected to the house.

    I drove around the block AGAIN and recovered the nozzle from the deadbeat customers home, replaced the fill box cover and returned to the office/shop to have the mechanic repair the nozzle. I told the mechanic, "Al Kelly... There is something wrong with the nozzle on this truck." I took the balance of my delivery tickets to the dispatch office to tell my Dear Uncle that he needed to get someone else to deliver these stops. Uncle Joe was nowhere to be found. I got in my car and drove home.
    Edward Young
    Retired HVAC Contractor from So. Jersey.
    Services first oil burner at age 16
    P/T trainer for EH-CC.org

    ayetchvackerDaveinscrantonSolid_Fuel_Manwmgeorge
  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 6,606
    Were there any non-=family members willing to "agree" to this you're a collection agent policy?
  • ayetchvacker
    ayetchvacker Member Posts: 55
    When I was first starting out as an installer working for a good friend, we stopped to look at a prospective job. A lady came to the door in shorts and a halter top, 100% covered from head to tow in insect bites. She tells us this story about how the house was infested with mice and the mice had mites and fleas. I stood in the doorway since the stench in the house was somewhat repulsive and I had no desire to take any sort of bugs home with me. She claimed the micr had been taken care of and the exterminator had the insect problem under control. I didn’t move. They needed a complete system, duct design, everything. I couldn’t believe this lady was living in this house while being eaten by bugs. I told my friend I wouldn’t do the job because it was a health hazard. He said, “What if you wear a tyvek suit and a respirator?” I said sure. He bid it as such and we didn’t get the job. I was extremely relieved. It’s incredible what some people will tolerate. 
    Fixer of things 
    Lead Service Technician
    HVAC/R
    ‘09Moto Guzzi V7
    ‘72CB350
    ’83Porsche944
    DaveinscrantonEdTheHeaterManSolid_Fuel_Man
  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 4,205
    edited February 20
    mattmia2 said:

    Were there any non-=family members willing to "agree" to this you're a collection agent policy?

    That was the policy when you were hired. There were over 15 drivers. Only 4 were family when I worked there. My older brother, Me, my father, and my Uncle Joe.

    As my younger brother got old enough to drive, he and his friend Ernie, got jobs driving. Ernie made so many wrong deliveries that the office manager needed to issue him an account number to keep track of his mistakes.

    In the city there are so many streets that look the same, it was easy to get on the wrong street, but the correct address. The Drivers knew the rules and this made them more diligent in getting it right. and for the most part, wrong deliveries were eventually collected by the company's bill collector. They had over 60 employees and 5000 automatic delivery accounts at the time the business was sold.
    Edward Young
    Retired HVAC Contractor from So. Jersey.
    Services first oil burner at age 16
    P/T trainer for EH-CC.org

  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 12,630
    I have two good stories.

    #1

    We had a good oil customer (commercial business) who had one of their employees that had a house with oil heat. He wanted to convert to gas so the company called and asked if we would go to his house, pump his 275 empty and take the oil down and put it in their tank. He was going to remove the tank and fill pipe the same day. Usually would decline this but is was summer, not much going on and they were a good customer

    I got on the phone with the employee and told him I would swing by that evening to take a look.

    the next day I got one of the drivers (smart) and a service tech (stupid) and gave the driver written instructions. Address,city town 275 gallon tank in basement, hatchway will be left open no one home etc etc

    The address was Somers Road East Longmeadow, MASS. They went to Somers Road in Somers, CT (adjoining towns) and pumped out a 1000 gallon tank that was buried in the ground. And when THAT owner came home and surprised them they spilt oil on his driveway.

    I had to do some fast talking but got out of it for a little money.

    #2


    This one is my screw up.

    We were installing a couple of 45gph #4 oil burners in a high school. The oil piping all 2" black pipe was a mess and came in the building went up in the air and back down making a huge air trap.

    This I had to fix on a Saturday as we couldn't shut the heat down on a school day.

    So I went out Saturday morning and met the custodian he let me in and then without saying anything he took off and went home. This was before cell phones but I wished I had his # as I had only contacted him at the school.

    I set up the threader and looked over the pipe and fittings I had because once I started sawzalling this stuff I had to get it back and running before I left.

    No valves to drain the 12' 2" risers so i drilled a hole in the pipe and was catching all the oil in buckets. That went pretty well until

    I stood up slipped on some oil on the floor that spilled from draining and fell down on top of the 6 or 8 buckets I had just drained. WHAT A MESS. I quickly exhausted the rags and speedy dry I had brought and had no spare clothes so now I am covered in smelly #4 oil. So I cleaned it up the best I could, I sure wasn't going to walk into a store for rags or more speedy dry although I thought about it.

    After that fiasco I had to work all day piping the thing working in oil soaked clothes leaving oily foot prints on the boiler room floor that I had to clean up.

    ayetchvackerSolid_Fuel_ManAlan (California Radiant) Forbes
  • DanHolohan
    DanHolohan Member, Moderator, Administrator Posts: 16,121
    That’s a good one, Ed! 😉
    Retired and loving it.
    wmgeorge
  • DanHolohan
    DanHolohan Member, Moderator, Administrator Posts: 16,121
    😳
    Retired and loving it.
  • ayetchvacker
    ayetchvacker Member Posts: 55
    I will tell you a funny one I got a phone call around 1:00am from the custodian from the Bald Eagle School District in Center county, Pa. that both boilers had shut down and would not restart in one of their schools and they needed service ASAP. It was a cold and snowy Winter night so I said that I could there in a few hours. I made the trek from My home near Pittsburgh, Pa. Usual drive time is 2.5 hours however the roads were slippery with snow. The custodian said that he would meet me at the school and if he wasn't there he would leave the boiler room door unlocked. I get to the building, the custodian was not there, and there was no door open. What to do? They had a type of awning window that many boiler rooms have that are opened with a chain pull that was open just enough that I thought I could slip through. Well, I got half way through and got stuck. After about 1/2 hour, I was relieved to hear a car pull into the area behind me. Great, I thought, now II can get unstuck. Due to the noise in the boiler room where half my body was I could not hear the commands the person who was outside was giving me. However I did hear the ratcheting of the shot gun and felt the cold barrel of the gun that was jammed into my side. I almost peed myself. They got me out of the window, put me on the ground in hand cuffs, and read me the riot act. Just then the custodian came and told me it was just a "JOKE". The cop was his brother and they were waiting for me to get to the school. We all laughed and drank a cup of coffee. The Joke was on me.
    That sounds like a local PA cop prankster haha! You’re a good humored person to handle it so well after a long drive in the snow!
    Fixer of things 
    Lead Service Technician
    HVAC/R
    ‘09Moto Guzzi V7
    ‘72CB350
    ’83Porsche944
    EdTheHeaterMan
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 12,630
    @retiredguy

    don't think i would have been happy!
    Solid_Fuel_Man
  • retiredguy
    retiredguy Member Posts: 658
    @EBEBRATT-ED When I heard the cliick of that shot gun I was petrified and because of the noise inside where my head was I was afraid of what they would do when I did not respond.
  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 4,205
    I just stole this from another post

    My great great grandfather grew up starving in the times of Charles Dickens.  Ran a push cart as a child with his father dealing junk off the push cart for a drunkard.  They bought the business.  He eventually became a “metal broker”.  Near as I can tell, that meant salvage yard operator.  Became quite wealthy.  Spent it on alcohol, fast horses, and many marriages.  The rest he wasted.

    He bid a job salvaging a big boiler from a factory.  Got the bid.  Everyone thought that he would lose his shirt on the deal.  Dynamite had become available a few months prior to the job. At 6 am on a Sunday morning he blew the wall off the factory.  Uneventfully.  By 8 am the boiler had been cut loose and was being dragged out by a team of horses.  By 9 am the bricklayers were bricking up a new wall.  By noon, the boiler had been dragged down the street, and sold to its new owner, who was tickled pink.

     I suspect that he was quite good at writing contracts.  I also suspect that things could have gone terribly wrong.  They didn’t.

    The above is clearly off topic.  I apologize.  Ed’s story, which I found fascinating, reminded me of some family history, long ago and far away.

    best wishes 

    Could go either way
    Edward Young
    Retired HVAC Contractor from So. Jersey.
    Services first oil burner at age 16
    P/T trainer for EH-CC.org

    CLambIn_New_England
  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 4,205
    edited May 31
    LEARNING THE HARD WAY IS SOMETIMES THE BEST WAY

    Once upon a time there was a new heating contractor who started his own business in 1979. His name was ED. He was experienced in oil burners and did a nice trade in annual tuneup and repair of oil heaters. There was a time that one of those customers wanted a new gas boiler. Since Ed was new to the Gas boiler thing, Ed studied the instruction manual for the Weil McLain CG boiler and decided that this would be something he could do.

    One Thursday afternoon after completing the days service calls, Ed went to the supply house and purchased a boiler, and many other parts loading his 1964 Chevy Van with a 30 gallon gas water heater (they were popular then) and a boiler along with a ton of pipes, fittings and hydronic accessories. You see, Ed was of the opinion that if you were going to get a new heater, you would also get all the other stuff that makes the heater work. No customer wants to hear that a service call was going to cost extra because a new thermostat (or any other valve, fitting, or relay) was not included in the original job. Include all the accessories and cover them under the warranty.

    Well, Friday morning we started early, After installing the new system, Ed was going to commission the boiler by filling the system with water. Within 1 minute the water started to spill all over the basement floor, pouring out of the boiler from god knows where. My first gas boiler had a huge crack in it. I called the supply house right away and told them what I found. It was near 5:00PM and I wanted them to stay open so I could get the replacement boiler.

    A very knowledgeable supply house owner said to look on page 6 of the manual and look for the ½” air vent tapping just next to the supply tapping. Then he asked if ED put a plug in that hole? Of course ED said no. (because the oil boilers ED was used to had no such opening)



    Emergency avoided and after a few minutes we were filling the boiler again. But that was not the last thing that was to cause me grief.

    The automatic fill valve was factory set at 12 psi and after manually filling and venting all the radiators, it was time to fire the boiler. All safety items checked out and after some cleanup ED was able to go home at 7:30 for a Pork Chop dinner. You see, that was a normal occurrence. My new bride would make Shake and Bake pork chops, and I would be late for dinner. It never fails. Over cooked pork chops are like eating shoe leather. I thought that was the way they were supposed to taste.

    That night ED got a frantic call from the customer with the new boiler. Water is pouring from the attic above the bathroom. And ED thought, “what does that have to do with me? All my work was in the basement.” Being a responsible contractor and wanting to have a reputation for “service after the sale," So ED got the the job at about 11:00 PM to find water leaking from the bathroom ceiling. A closer inspection of the bathroom radiator revealed a pipe from the radiator connection was connected to a tee fitting and there was a pipe that extended to the attic. ED never saw that before.

    ED looked in the attic, and what to my wondering eyes did appear, But a small little water tank with 8” gauge glass right near. (This happened in December). And there was a rusted pipe that was leaking water from the top of the tank. My guess is that the leak was just about 28 feet above the autofill in the basement. (Ask Me Why) The fill would not be enough to reach the leak, but when the boiler heated the water, it expanded past the 28 foot mark and poured out on the bathroom ceiling. Once the water cooled down, the water level in the tank would drop below the 28 ft mark and the autofill would replace the lost water. Then the boiler would cycle back on, the water would expand again and leak on the bathroom ceiling again …and so on ... and so on...




    And that is how you learn about open system expansion tanks the hard way.

    Edward Young
    Retired HVAC Contractor from So. Jersey.
    Services first oil burner at age 16
    P/T trainer for EH-CC.org

    In_New_Englandrick in AlaskaSolid_Fuel_Man
  • retiredguy
    retiredguy Member Posts: 658
    Here is another one I just remembered. When I got out of Tech school in 1968 and started with a now closed HVAC company, the head service tech said that I had to learn how to install a T87F Honeywell thermostat on a white plaster wall with dirty fingers and not put any mark on that wall. He had a vertical test board that he made up with a piece of drywall he could replace as necessary. He handed me a new T87F and sub base an was told to install it on his test board but first I had to first wipe carbon black (soot) on my finger tips. he said that I had to be able to mount the T87 and leave no marks on the wall. It took quite a few tries until I could "do it correctly".
    EdTheHeaterManIn_New_EnglandSolid_Fuel_ManMikeAmann
  • GGross
    GGross Member Posts: 327
    @EdTheHeaterMan

    Now that is a good one. Sometimes I wonder who found my secret stash of green army men in the ducts of the little house I grew up in, maybe they are still there waiting.
    EdTheHeaterMan
  • Can we have a new category here on HeatingHelp called, “Funny Stories from EdTheHeaterMan and retiredguy?
    8.33 lbs./gal. x 60 min./hr. x 20°ΔT = 10,000 BTU's/hour
    mattmia2Erin Holohan HaskellEdTheHeaterManPC7060
  • jumper
    jumper Member Posts: 1,906
    Must have been a very old house or really crappy pipe to rust out?
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 12,630
    When I was 6 or 7, I was playing outside, and our 1951 Chevy was parked in the driveway. My father was at work and my mom was inside sewing on her sewing machine. I decided I would start the car up and park it in the garage.

    I managed to do that after backing up and running over the neighbors tomato plants and of course I scraped the car on the garage.

    Another time on a Sunday (I was about the same age) were all supposed to go visit my aunt and uncle and they lived in the country about 7 miles away. I was anxious to get there to play with my
    cousins. So, I kept pestering my father who was trying to read the Sunday paper "when are we going etc.")

    I threatened to go myself and walk there and my father exasperated said "go ahead"

    So I started walking and was 3/4 of the way when they caught up to me in the car.

    My rear end still hurts.

    They say I was the worst one of us four kids.
    Alan (California Radiant) ForbesEdTheHeaterManSolid_Fuel_Man
  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 4,205
    edited July 23
    Here is another good story. from

    Here is a story about a hot water system in a catholic rectory that used to heat but later did not. The company I worked for did a lot of the Catholic Diocese heating work and my boss knew the Bishop. The Bishop is the boss. The Bishop calls my boss and says that a certain Rectory has been having heating issues for the last few years and he wants it fixed. The "company of record" doing their service installed larger pumps, then added numerous zones, raised the operating set point to 220F and still not enough heat. I met the pastor in charge and after a short conversation and survey of the system, I said that the problem was the fairly new ultra expensive carpet and that it had to be lowered or cut away from the bottom of the baseboard units. He refused to acknowledge that as the problem and showed me the door. My boss called the Bishop and the carpet was replaced. The carpet salesman and installers that installed that too thick carpet and pad closed off the bottom of the baseboard radiation not allowing air to flow through the heating units reducing their heat output. Make sure that you do not restrict the air flow through the baseboard radiation.

    He offered that after I posted this:

    I had just acquired a new fuel dealer to do service calls for their customers, some years ago (after his top technician retired). One of my first service calls for the new company was on an unusually cold winter night. They had just installed a new Columbia boiler the previous winter. I looked at the great plumbing job, the site built manifold and the zone valves were very pretty. The only problem was that all the near boiler piping was 3/4". Supply manifold from the boiler to 3 zone valves were all 3/4". Same on the return, All 3/4" teed to 3/4" manifold back to the boiler return. I explained that this would not work because the supply manifold needed to be at least 1" to each zone valve with a 3/4" branch to each zone valve. The customer then told me that the Fuel Dealer just installed the boiler last year. So I told the manager of the fuel oil company what the problem was and gave him a reasonable price to make the correction. This manager wanted to hear nothing about it. "We installed it last year and it worked fine". There was no telling him how to fix it or that they should eat the cost of doing it correctly.

    And I will add this story about a customer in Villas NJ:

    It was an extremely cold winter when i got a no heat call from a new oil heat customer. "Thermostat not working"
    After one of my service techs was unable to find anything wrong, and wanted to collect the minimum "diagnostic" fee, the new customer called to complain.
    I visited the home as saw right away that the shag carpet was blocking the bottom opening of the baseboard convectors. I gave them specific instructions on what was needed and a four figure quote for lifting the baseboards to accommodate the higher floor covering, the customer agreed to pay the minimum fee.

    3 years passed and I got a similar service call in the same neighborhood. I personally did this call and when I arrived, I recognized that same set of old folks on the couch watching the same old TV show and the same old shag carpet on the floor blocking the baseboard opening. I charged them the minimum fee to copy and paste the same 3 year old quote on to a current quote with a higher price ...and they paid the fee.

    Another 2 years passed and again we got unusually cold weather (that's climate change for ya!) Guess who called. I happened to be in the office when that call came in and I remembered it. I called the customer back and asked them if they wanted to pay another minimum service call fee, or can I just email them the 5 year old quote with new prices.

    Since it happens so little, I guess they just forget about it until the next below 15°F event in a few years.


    Mr.Ed
    Edward Young
    Retired HVAC Contractor from So. Jersey.
    Services first oil burner at age 16
    P/T trainer for EH-CC.org

    ratioPC7060
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 12,630
    We used to service a local movie theater. Two different buildings one with 3 theaters was hot water heat. The other building with two theaters was hot air.

    The equipment in both buildings was undersized as far as I was concerned.

    But what I finally figured out was if the theaters were empty, they were always cold, and the equipment ran all the time unless off on night setback.

    I told them to get rid of the setback, which would help but they refused.

    Funny thing was when they were open for movies the heat was fine.

    It's amazing what a little body heat will do.

    To this day I believe they sized the equipment that way on purpose.
    EdTheHeaterManPC7060MikeAmann
  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 4,205
    edited July 24
    Subject: WW2..................history we may know little about.............

    As a side note, during the War, anyone working on Oil Rigs was exempt from the Draft and was required to stay on the job as long as required. If a hand didn't show up for work, the Sheriff was dispatched to find out why. This story was circulated in 2018.

    THE OIL PATCH WARRIORS OF WORLD WAR II

    Seventy-five years ago this month, a Band of Roughnecks went abroad on a top secret mission into Robin Hood's stomping grounds to punch oil wells to help fuel England's war machines.

    It's a story that should make any oilman or woman proud.

    The year was 1943 and England was mired in World War II. U-boats attacked supply vessels, choking off badly needed supplies to the island nation. But oil was the commodity they needed the most as they warred with Germany.

    A book "The Secret of Sherwood Forest: Oil Production in England During World War II" written by Guy Woodward and Grace Steele Woodward was published in 1973, and tells the obscure story of the American oil men who went to England to bore wells in a top secret mission in March 1943.

    England had but one oil field, in Sherwood Forest of all places. Its meager output of 300 barrels a day was literally a drop in the bucket of their requirement of 150,000 barrels a day to fuel their war machines.

    Then a top secret plan was devised: to send some Americans and their expertise to assist in developing the field. Oklahoma based Noble Drilling Company, along with Fain-Porter signed a one year contract to drill 100 wells for England, merely for costs and expenses.

    42 drillers and roughnecks from Texas and Oklahoma, most in their teens and early twenties volunteered for the mission to go abroad. The hands embarked for England in March 1943 aboard the HMS Queen Elizabeth. Four National 50 drilling rigs were loaded onto ships but only three of them made landfall; the Nazi U-boats sank one of the rigs een route to the UK.

    The Brits' jaws dropped as the Yanks began punching the wells in a week, compared to five to eight weeks for their British counterparts. They worked 12 hour tours, 7 days a week and within a year, the Americans had drilled 106 wells and England oil production shot up from 300 barrels a day to over 300,000

    The contract fulfilled, the American oil men departed England in late March 1944. But only 41 hands were on board the return voyage. Herman Douthit, a Texan derrick-hand was killed during the operation. He was laid to rest with full military honors, and remains the only civilian to be buried at The American Military Cemetery in Cambridge.

    "The Oil Patch Warrior," a seven foot bronze statue of a roughneck holding a four foot pipe wrench stands near Nottingham England to honor the American oil men's assistance and sacrifice in the war. A replica was placed in Ardmore Oklahoma in 2001


    It is by no means a stretch to state that without the American mission, we might all be speaking German today.

    Thx, American Oil and Gas History.
    Edward Young
    Retired HVAC Contractor from So. Jersey.
    Services first oil burner at age 16
    P/T trainer for EH-CC.org

    JUGHNErick in AlaskabburdMikeAmann
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 12,630
    Great story.

    Let's hope no one wants that statue down.
    EdTheHeaterManMikeAmann
  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 4,205
    I was just reminded of a story about a plumber that wanted to start putting in air conditioning. At the time I was working at the tech support person for HVAC contractors at a local branch of Weinstein Supply Company in Pleasantville NJ. We were selling HEIL brand HVAC equipment at the time. The factory man from HEIL told me about one of our customers from a different branch of Weinstein in PA was having an unusually high amount of compressor failures. He described the the plumber was following all the factory instruction. He even tested the line set for leaks for 24 hours at 50PSI and found no leaks. Of course the HEIL factory assumed that was 50 PSI nitrogen pressure. or at (least R22 pressure). Eventually a Factor tech guy visited one of his job sites to see a hose bib with a pressure gauge holding 50 PSI. When the plumber was asked "why he is using a hose bib on a refrigerant line?"

    the plumber answered "How else can you put 50 PSI of water pressure in that line?

    If you are a hammer everything looks like a nail. If you are a plumber, everything looks like water!
    Edward Young
    Retired HVAC Contractor from So. Jersey.
    Services first oil burner at age 16
    P/T trainer for EH-CC.org

    GGrossCLamb
  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 6,606
    Isnt 1 compressor failure an unusually high amount?
  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 4,205
    mattmia2 said:

    Isnt 1 compressor failure an unusually high amount?

    For me? Yes. That is why I am happy to boast a zero tolerance for moisture in refrigeration systems I install. But for this Weinstein Supply 1990s customer, there was more than one. Enough to get the factory's attention.

    Edward Young
    Retired HVAC Contractor from So. Jersey.
    Services first oil burner at age 16
    P/T trainer for EH-CC.org

  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 4,205
    edited November 11

    The tail of the wet whistling hatch back.

    A friend of mine works as a mechanic for an auto dealership. Not going to say which brand of automobile. There was a problem with a brand new car with a mysterious whistling noise whenever the car was driven over 30 MPH and it was raining. Never happens when it is dry. Customer would call the dealer and complain about the noise. Of course, the appointment to check out the noise was always made on a following day, when the weather was clear and dry. The mechanic would take the car for a test drive and report "No Noise" and therefore no repairs were made.

    This was very frustrating for the customer and after 4 or more similar occurrences, my friend was the mechanic that this repair fell on. Seeing the history and the frustrated customer at the service desk, My friend personally talked to the customer and discovered the part about "Raining" was never indicated on the previous work orders. This mechanic told the customer that he would perform a series of test drives that entailed making the car wet, using the hose from the detail shop wash bay, where they prep new cars for delivery to the customer, then doing the test drive.

    The customer went on the first test drive and, Viola, The noise was heard by both the mechanic and the customer. Now here is the good part.

    The mechanic performed the same test drive with the addition of a 1 ft section of painters tape covering a section of the door seam in the side doors and rear hatch back door. After adding about 15 feet of tape (15 wet test drives) the noise was eliminated by covering the center top of the rear hatch back. For test drive # 16 All the other tape was removed and only the successful piece of tape remained. The test drive was successful. So now he knew where the noise originated.

    The permanent fix was then applied to the vehicle. In very technical terms he took a 2x4 and placed on the door seam at the aforementioned location and applied a percussion adjustment. (he hit it with a hand sledge). The slight adjustment moved the door seem just enough to eliminate the vibration. This problem happened on less than 5% of the vehicles of this type. A company bulletin was produced and sent to all dealers with this ingenious repair procedure.

    The moral of the story: Changing more than one thing at a time is not the best way to apply the process of elimination. Make one change at a time. Then when the problem is corrected, you will know what the actual cause is/was.



    Edward Young
    Retired HVAC Contractor from So. Jersey.
    Services first oil burner at age 16
    P/T trainer for EH-CC.org

    ratioMikeAmannLarry Weingarten
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 12,630
    My moral to that story is its fixed but unfortunately is a long drawn-out process. That's what it takes some time
    EdTheHeaterMan
  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 4,205
    edited November 24
    looking over this post https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/190078/the-case-of-the-steam-noob-and-the-cold-bedroom#
    I wanted to sum up all that has gone on since last week.
    Here is the story: https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1721807#Comment_1721807
    The players may be a little different but it is a good story.
    @DanHolohan @Erin Holohan Haskell @Jamie Hall and @hot_rod are all in the opening credits.

    There are other players, So many of our regulars have pitched in for the OP Mike.
    I just want to wish everyone at HeatingHelp.com a Healthy, Happy, and Warm Thanksgiving day.

    God Bless you all
    Edward Young
    Retired HVAC Contractor from So. Jersey.
    Services first oil burner at age 16
    P/T trainer for EH-CC.org

    MikeAmannLarry Weingarten