Fire-rated bolts or fasteners for inside fireplace?

lbeachmike

Can anybody recommend fire-rated bolts or fasteners/anchors that can be used inside a fireplace, above the area where the fire burns? I need to bolt into brick and/or the lentil.

Thanks.

Mike

Jamie Hall

Say what? It depends on two things: how much load you need to carry and what you are bolting in to. If you have relatively small loads, particularly in sheer, and are going into decent concrete or sound brick, Tapcons are fine. Follow the directions.

For larger loads, expansion bolts work well -- again in sound material.

Avoid anything which is epoxy anchored.

Now if the material you are going into isn't sound, I'm afraid there isn't much that I can suggest.

lbeachmike

Sound materials, especially if we can bolt into the lentil, but either way. Not much load.

The Tapcons are not recommended. We spoke with the manufacturer - they are rated only to about 300 degrees. They said there are more suitable metals and that the coating would not be appropriate.

Jamie Hall

Then you are looking at expansion bolts.

lbeachmike

Is there a specific brand / type of expansion bolt I should be looking at? By expansion bolt, do you mean anchors?

Jamie Hall

Don't know what you are putting in -- try here: https://www.concretefasteners.com/?_vsrefdom=adwords&msclkid=fc49aeefaba51be46f26cf36514c7e51&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=AP | Search | Screws&utm_term=concrete expansion bolts&utm_content=*Concrete Fasteners

EBEBRATT-Ed

@lbeachmike

I would suggest looking at McMaster Carr on line catalog

lbeachmike

Thanks guys. I will take a look at both. Our fireplace doors have a extension bracket that has a thumb screw to grip to the lentil, but it has already come loose and will be far more secure to bolt it into place.

Bob Harper

Get some stainless-steel bolts and call it a day. I do fireplaces for a living and have NEVER had a problem with heat on bolts for doors, top damper brackets, etc. We used electroplated 'L' hooks screwed into lead shields on the rear wall at the PMI to retain cast iron firebacks and they didn't fail. Methinks you're over engineering it. FYI, top damper brackets ship with zinc hammer-drive expansion anchors and don't fail.

lbeachmike

Hey Bob - I didn't know you do fireplaces for a living. I'm not trying to over-engineer. I simply have no experience in this area. Even merely bolting into concrete or into the lentil are things I don't have experience with and may not even have the right tools on hand for. Things are always easier when it's your area of expertise.

I can bolt these brackets into the brick or into the lentil, or both. What do you think is the best approach? It sounds like you are recommending the hammer-drive expansion anchors into the brick?

Thanks!

lbeachmike

Here is what things look like -

Photo 1 = right side, pressure pin did not hold - is that enough exposed brick to install an anchor, or should I drill into the lentil?

Photo 2 = left side (it's not bolted to the lentil - that bolt just holds the extension bracket together)

Bob Harper

I would remove the L bracket with the set screw. Flip the bolt so the nut is below the slotted bracket. Plan A is to secure with Tapcons into the mortar joint. If it's too soft and crumbly, consider plan B. Drill and tap the lintel with 1/4 x 20 stainless steel hex cap screws (1 each side). Use a #7 or 13/64" cobalt bit. Push the front in and tighten the bolts. I need be you can anchor a bracket at the bottom or sides. I'd use Tapcons for that. The main thing is to make it removable. Hammer drive anchors aren't.

lbeachmike

Thanks Bob. It sounds like Plan B is a more secure, definitive solution. What is the level of difficulty to drill and tap the lintel?

Bob Harper

The steel is a lot tougher than you'd think. Once through it you'd have to switch to a masonry bit depending upon the length of screws. It's the strongest attachment but the hardest to do. Plan on bolts shearing off, broken taps and bits. Use cutting oil. I've also used #12 self-tapping screws but usually 80% shear off.

lbeachmike

Oh man. From your previous post it sounded like it wouldn't be so bad. I'm not really equipped for this. I have a 12V Bosch and 18V Milwaukee but I think the Milwaukee battery is shot.

So I guess that's why your Plan A was A and not B? It's probably way easier to anchor into the mortar.

I don't suppose you live anywhere near Long Beach, NY?

Bob Harper

120 miles but I work an additional 35 miles further. If you can't handle it any handyman should be able to. Otherwise, you can buy several batteries for the price of hiring someone.

ratio

Going into a steel lintel, look at using a Tek 5 screw (http://fastening-solutions.itwbuildex.com/viewitems/teks-steel-to-steel-self-drilling-screws-3/teks-5-steel-to-steel-self-drilling-screws). They're the hot ticket for that application. I might stop after the drill point pokes through & clear out some of the masonry behind with a drill bit, depending on how hard it is back there.