Plumbing-Heating Mechanics to work in North/Central New Jersey needed.

JohnNY

Where are the qualified techs? Where are the eager mechanics looking for a great salary and benefits? Is there no one stuck in a dead end shop that would prefer to learn and grow with us in my shop? I'm going to drop dead some day with a bunch of knowledge and field experience buried with me in my coffin.
#truth

SlamDunk

Very cool graphic!

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes

I was installing two on-demand water heaters outside an apartment building at the beginning of the week. Given that I turn 70 next week, I needed some help lifting the heaters up onto the wall brackets, eight feet off the ground and I asked a couple of guys that were going to their apartment if they could help me. If you are near my age, you know that this can be the hardest part of the job. The two guys were very willing and quickly had the heaters mounted on the wall. We started talking; they were from Algeria and were in the glass replacement business. They didn't seem enthused about their work and I told them what I did. One of them asked me if I would sponsor an apprentice. Bingo - just my lucky day!

Yes, it's still in the early stages and they may not like hydronics. And they are not trained journeymen and have a few years of experience needed. I only share my story to see if it sparks any ideas in your head.

Steamhead

It's not just our field. The shop where we get our vehicles serviced- part of a local chain- has been advertising for techs for a couple months now. Even Burger King is hiring in our area.

There doesn't seem to be much of a work ethic anymore.

retiredguy

I worked for a large commercial and industrial boiler sales, service and installation company in Pittsburgh, Pa. for 35 years and in that time we could only hire maybe 10 guys that really wanted to work and get their hands dirty. Most of the new hires wanted to work an easy job, work 8 hours a day and never work weekends or holidays. You guys all know that in this field that is impossible. My day started at 6:00AM or when the phone rang and ended when I got to my home or to the motel that I was staying in. I always stressed that there are no guaranteed days off, no guaranteed holidays, and very few easy jobs, but that they would be paid very well for a good days work. Most of the SISSY'S headed for the door but a few stayed are were well rewarded.

@Alan(california radiant)Forbes; I just turned 77 so I won't be filling out an employment application at your place of business. "SORRY"

SlamDunk

Steamhead said:

It's not just our field. The shop where we get our vehicles serviced- part of a local chain- has been advertising for techs for a couple months now. Even Burger King is hiring in our area.

There doesn't seem to be much of a work ethic anymore.

Can you blame them? There ARE easier ways to make a living..... My co-worker had a package HVAC system installed and the smallest guy on the crew was the newbie. His head was clearly not in the game so my coworker asked if he doesn't like going into crawl spaces. The head of the crew responded by saying the kid just saw his future take a turn. They stopped at a Sheetz gas station and a sign on the door said Now hiring counter person for $13/hr plus sign on bonus. Hmmm crawl spaces and hard, dirty, sweaty work for $10/hr or an easier job for 13?

Mike_Sheppard

There is a severe lack of talent here in the VA, MD, DC area. Plenty of companies and technicians doing it but very little of them have the slightest clue what they are doing.

Companies here are hiring completely green fresh helpers / apprentices for $25 an hour.

tim smith

John, I feel the pain. Been going on for several years here.Worse now. I am concerned for our industry, customers who will be out in the cold(literally) and in general public safety. I can’t figure out the lack of able bodied individuals who would like to learn a trade. My only hint to the shortage is not having shop in our schools, not having parents who work with their hands (not including keyboards) and like repairing things. Just baffles and disheartens me. I am getting ready to retire and there will go 40 yrs of training and knowledge that customers won’t have the benefit of.

unclejohn

The problem with a easy 13 per hour over the 10 per hour is that the 10 leads to a career and the 13 hour leads nowhere. I think this generation has been lead to believe that the world only has maybe 10 years left so why bother.

Tom_133

I remember when I got started only 20 years ago so not much in comparison, but anyways. I went from making 15per hour down to 10 to start plumbing and heating. The work was harder, dirtier, and heavier for the first 6 months I wanted to QUIT. My boss said in 3 years or so you will have a company van, and making considerably more than you are now. He wasn't wrong, but it only took 1 year. Its about the desire to work, and sadly most today dont have the desire, sometimes as I am writing a check for taxes I get that way as well. The incentives to push, and work hard are slipping away. But today I am 43 and own (no mortgage) my house and next will be payoff work truck, so no heavy bills. Thanks to working hard and sticking to this plumbing and heating thing.

JohnNY

$10-$13 per hour are not the numbers I'm paying. My greenest guy gets $17 and in NYC my union guys cost me $70 per hour with their benefits packages.
This is not a **** job and I'm no stranger to a crippling payroll.

In other words, I'm not having it that the salary is the issue. With very little exception, I give people what they ask for. After that it's up to them to cover that salary and send something back to the business. That's how I get paid.

EBEBRATT-Ed

They have been talking about a coming labor shortage in all the trades for the last 15-20 years. Having worked mostly in MA & CT I have to go to a bunch of code update classes and the subject always comes up. You look around the room and all you see is mostly gray hair. They said the average age of plumbers, heating, HVAC and electricians was 56 years old.........and that was a few years ago. Probably higher than that now

I am 68 and would still work part time if I could but my body is too beat up. Dropped most of the 11 state licenses I used to carry now down to 5 and I should dump more but it's hard to let go

The problem started years ago when they closed down the shops in the local high schools and there are fewer trade schools.

The news media has made plumbers etc to be looked down on with all the "Plumbers butt crack " jokes which is not helping and the work ethic is maybe not gone but certainly going.

It's easier to play video games and live in Mom & Dad's basement

SlamDunk

Definately a regional thing. In the rural South, you would have a line of high school graduates looking for a job with $17 to start. Out of ten, you might find one to stick around. The company I was talking about is way out in the sticks. $10/hr isconsidered good money for starting pay.

@EBEBRATT-Ed , here,it is the same. Average age was 48 a few years ago according to the D.O.L.

retiredguy

When I retired in 2007 at the age of 63, (the body gave out), I am sure that you know what I mean, I was making 100K a year including overtime plus benefits. Not too bad for a kid with a high school diploma and 6 years total military time. There was a "draft" in 1964, so I chose the Navy. I went from a starting wage of almost nothing to a pretty good wage before retirement. The work was both hard and easy and I enjoyed all jobs except for working on coal boilers and those firing #6 oil. We fixed and installed anything in the system. I just wish I could go back and do it again.

pecmsg

Its partially Money but mainly work ethic. My first job was pumping gas at the local station at 11. Paper Route, Cutting lawns, shoveling snow all before 16. 47 years commercial refrigeration and semi retired. The kids today don't want or need much, a few days worth $'s and there happy!

PC7060

The minimum wage being flat for decades doesn’t help. So many people are being shunted into bachelors of arts degree so they can make a decent income but end up saddled with debt and none of the technology skills needs in industry.    

Agree with @tim smith; the communities need to appreciate the value of the high school trade programs in partnership with company internships as a solid path to a stable career. 

Our company has combination of degrees engineers and specialists assembly techs. We recruit engineers right out of college and train them in our processes and technology; highly effective program with high retention rates.  

We are currently retooling our recruiting approach for technicians to partner with the high schools and feed them through our training programs. 

JohnNY

Bumping this up.

GW

I recently joined this better practices group, and went to their annual conference recently.

Hiring practices have been turned upside down in the last 10 or so years. The covid threw the whole process into the washing machine. 

Back when we were kids, we busted out tail to get a job and keep a job. Today, not so much.

I just spoke with Video guy earlier today, I’m going to throw some money at making a TV commercial (we are hiring). Which of course can be also used for digital content as well. it will be a little bit outside the box, regular stuff does not cut it these days.

Good luck out there

SlamDunk

A company we use just gave all their techs a 19% raise and a better vacation package. It could be as simple as that.

JakeCK

16% raise at my employer just with in the last couple months. but mainly just for the horrible 24/7 offshift. 

That said I wish those of you looking for help and willing to pay top dollar for green people just starting out were so willing 15+ years ago... Today I couldn't afford to start over with a family and mortgage. But when I was just out of highschool trying to just get enough hours at BK to put gas in the truck these kind of opportunities would have been nice. Back then, and even still today, job listings proudly state "Entry level position, grow with our company! Must have 13.5 billion years experience and a masters degree in everything! And be willing to sell your soul."

DanHolohan

John and David Cataneo own Gateway P&H. I've known them for years. Both spend their evenings teaching plumbing and heating at Mechanics Institute. I am chair of the Institute, which has been offering free nighttime education to those in the trades since 1858. It is the oldest trade school in the U.S. Mechanics Institute is part of The General Society of Mechanics and Tradesmen of the City of New York. I'm am also The Society's current president. We don't hire just anyone to teach at M.I. Our teachers are the best of the best.

If you go to work for this company I believe you will see more interesting things and learn more than you possibly could anywhere else in NYC. You will be mentored by the Cataneo brothers and they will treat you like family. If you're considering making a move, you could not choose a better place.

And they did not ask me to post this. I believe in these guys, and in this company.

JohnNY

My goodness. Thank you, @DanHolohan. My brother and I consider you and the General Society as much family as anyone else.
Very best to all,
John

tim smith

Nice Dan, it’s great to see such respect given to the people who have earned it. Way to go John.
Tim

JohnNY

I had a guy come in for an interview yesterday. My process is to greet the applicant, sit them down in a quiet room and give them the application to fill out which asks for the typical name, address, experience, etc. The back of the application has two pages of 20 plumbing-and-heating questions like "How are copper pipe and fittings joined together in a plumbing system:_____________." and "What is an aquastat?" They get progressively more difficult like "What is a vaporstat?" and "In a heating system, what might be a good application for an electrical relay device?"

This guy, who sold himself as a 25-plus-year field mechanic with extensive heating experience, took one look at the application and said "I'm not going to fill this out." I asked "What do you mean?" and he explained that he was 51 years old, a career plumber, and would not fill out the form beyond his name and phone number.
The rest went like this:

"This is a job interview that we scheduled at your request. It's pretty standard to ask a job applicant to fill out a form listing work experience with some references. The additional questions just give us an idea of where you are in the field in practical terms. You're saying you don't want to fill any of this out?"

"Yeah, I'm not doing any of that."

"So, you understand this is the first time we're meeting each other and this is the very first thing I'm asking you to do and you're telling me you're not doing it. Do I have that right? You're not willing to fill out this job application?"

Shakes his head "Nah."

"Ok, take care."

"Bye." Gets up and walks out.


(The end)

Your want to start your own shop and be your own boss? This is what I deal with.

This numbskull says he worked in several shops in NYC, has recently moved to NJ and wants to work locally.
If you want to know his name I'd be happy to tell you privately. I'm at a loss for words other than that.

ChrisJ

JohnNY said:

I had a guy come in for an interview yesterday. My process is to greet the applicant, sit them down in a quiet room and give them the application to fill out which asks for the typical name, address, experience, etc. The back of the application has two pages of 20 plumbing-and-heating questions like "How are copper pipe and fittings joined together in a plumbing system:_____________." and "What is an aquastat?" They get progressively more difficult like "What is a vaporstat?" and "In a heating system, what might be a good application for an electrical relay device?"

This guy, who sold himself as a 25-plus-year field mechanic with extensive heating experience, took one look at the application and said "I'm not going to fill this out." I asked "What do you mean?" and he explained that he was 51 years old, a career plumber, and would not fill out the form beyond his name and phone number.
The rest went like this:

"This is a job interview that we scheduled at your request. It's pretty standard to ask a job applicant to fill out a form listing work experience with some references. The additional questions just give us an idea of where you are in the field in practical terms. You're saying you don't want to fill any of this out?"

"Yeah, I'm not doing any of that."

"So, you understand this is the first time we're meeting each other and this is the very first thing I'm asking you to do and you're telling me you're not doing it. Do I have that right? You're not willing to fill out this job application?"

Shakes his head "Nah."

"Ok, take care."

"Bye." Gets up and walks out.


(The end)

Your want to start your own shop and be your own boss? This is what I deal with.

This numbskull says he worked in several shops in NYC, has recently moved to NJ and wants to work locally.
If you want to know his name I'd be happy to tell you privately. I'm at a loss for words other than that.

Cannot follow instructions...
Got it.

GGross

@JohnNY
Holy smokes that is nuts! That's the guy the tech service lines hate getting a call from for sure.
"what's your superheat?"
"Nah, not gonna do that"
"Well I can't help you without the correct numbers"
"listen I'm 51, not gonna do it"

On the plus side if you have any competitors you don't particularly like you could recommend him to them

JohnNY

@ChrisJ Not even "cannot". *Will not*!

Steamhead

@JohnNY , I've run into guys like this. It's one reason my company has stayed small. Who needs this sort of trouble?

JohnNY

Steamhead said:

@JohnNY , I've run into guys like this. It's one reason my company has stayed small. Who needs this sort of trouble?

Yeah I'll never be so desperate for employees that I'll need to inflict myself my life with this sort of person. I'll collect cans first.

ChrisJ

JohnNY said:

@ChrisJ Not even "cannot". *Will not*!

Is NJ unemployment the way it used to be, where you need to prove you're actively seeking work?
That's the only thing I can come up with.

He needs to prove he's looking, but doesn't want to work.

Steamhead

ChrisJ said:

JohnNY said:

@ChrisJ Not even "cannot". *Will not*!

Is NJ unemployment the way it used to be, where you need to prove you're actively seeking work?
That's the only thing I can come up with.

He needs to prove he's looking, but doesn't want to work.

I wouldn't call this "actively seeking".

ChrisJ

Steamhead said:

ChrisJ said:

JohnNY said:

@ChrisJ Not even "cannot". *Will not*!

Is NJ unemployment the way it used to be, where you need to prove you're actively seeking work?
That's the only thing I can come up with.

He needs to prove he's looking, but doesn't want to work.

I wouldn't call this "actively seeking".

True,
But what would you call it?

JohnNY

Actively seeking my foot in his ****.

Steamhead

tim smith said:

I can’t figure out the lack of able bodied individuals who would like to learn a trade. My only hint to the shortage is not having shop in our schools, not having parents who work with their hands (not including keyboards) and like repairing things. Just baffles and disheartens me. I am getting ready to retire and there will go 40 yrs of training and knowledge that customers won’t have the benefit of.

Part of the problem is parents who do not teach their children any work ethic.

EBEBRATT-Ed said:

It's easier to play video games and live in Mom & Dad's basement

And the parents who let them. This was unheard of when I was that age.

ChrisJ

JohnNY said:

Actively seeking my foot in his ****.

JohnNY

Aaaand here's today's insanity:

GGross

@JohnNY
He got your company name wrong? El Toro is the cheap tequila with the little hat that you are legally required to take shots from. He's a partier, and missed work, time to pass.

SlamDunk

I know this isn't funny to you business owners, but...seems like you're fishing in the shallow end of the gene pool!

JakeCK

O.o

It's not just the bosses that are having to deal with this. My employer is to the point of hiring anything with a pulse. In some cases rehiring people who previously walked out or were let go. So where does that leave the cogs like me?...

ChrisJ

JakeCK said:

O.o

It's not just the bosses that are having to deal with this. My employer is to the point of hiring anything with a pulse. In some cases rehiring people who previously walked out or were let go. So where does that leave the cogs like me?...

Where does it leave you?

JakeCK

Dealing with people on a daily basis who have to learn the hard way what a setscrew is and what happens when you turn a machine on with the tool holder loose. With the machine guards open none the less.