Flame retention head conversion of Wayne E series burner

MikeAmann

I finished the work on my car and now I'm back on this head conversion.
It's been about 3 weeks since I last touched it.

First I had to reduce the open space between the opening in the combustion chamber and the air tube with some 2100* Superwool to protect the head and tube. Essentially I made my own head protector.
Then I attached the air tube/mounting flange to the boiler. That way I could stick my hand inside the tube and feel around to make sure the 1/4" setback actually agreed with what I had measured beforehand. It did. I attached the burner chassis. Then I remembered what steamhead said about the static plate - I need to use the 2-3/4" plate as this setup now replicates a Burnham SR burner. Did I already do that? Nope. I swapped the plate and buttoned it back up.

Am I really ready to fire it up? I guess so. I decided to flip the switch with the oil turned off at first to make sure there were no problems and that I wouldn't fill the chamber with raw fuel should the burner not fire. Well, the burner fired immediately so I turned the oil on. My viewport is about 2-3/4" in diameter. With the old sunflower burner I couldn't get my face anywhere near close enough to see what was really going on with the flame, and that flame was uncontrolled and all over the place. That flame was also more reddish orange in color and nearly completely filled the entire chamber all the way up to the tubes.



My ceramic combustion chamber (see pics above) is like a round bucket that transitions out to a square funnel to meet the dimensions of the water jacket. Now I can actually get my eyes a couple inches away from the viewport and see what is going on with the flame. It's completely different than before. I am going to describe what I actually saw, and not repeat what I read that it is supposed to look like. First, the color is more of a yellowish orange. The flame is no longer uncontrolled and all over the place. It now fills only the bucket portion of the combustion chamber and is concentrated and controlled, more like a torch.

When the burner first fired, the chamber was cold and I could see smoky tips. I adjusted the air bands for more air and the smoky tips went away. I kept playing with this to get a sense of how the air affected the flame, but this got harder to do because the chamber was now hot and the oil was burning more completely. I was trying to determine if I was at least "in the ballpark" with the new setup by working the air band from stop to stop. In my mind, I would like to see a little smoke (too little air) at one end, and a smaller yet more intense flame (too much air) at the other end. I kept ending up right in the middle between the two stops with that I thought looked like a good flame.

I was about to go outside to see if any smoke was coming out of the chimney and if anything smelled funny, when the burner cut off. The water temp had reached 160 degrees. It's only been about 10 minutes, certainly less than 15. The water temp went from 75 to 160 in that time - nearly the same as before, maybe a little less time. I didn't actually use a stopwatch and record times.

The sunflower head was using a .85 GPH nozzle. I am using a Delavan .65 GPH x 80*A hollow nozzle with the flame-retention head. So if I heated the same amount of water in the same amount of time, and raised the temperature the same number of degrees, then I just did that using 23.5% less fuel. And from my perspective - NO SOOT! ***THIS WAS EXACTLY MY GOAL IN DOING THIS CONVERSION.***

I need your expert comments please. I want to know if I am actually in the ballpark before I call a professional to dial this burner in with the instruments.

Steamhead

I think you're ready for dialing in. I'll add that you want at least 10% CO2 with zero smoke. The rest of the above chart looks OK.

I'm very interested in how this works out- love to do the dial-in myself, but the travel time charge would be a bit much.............

MikeAmann

I would love for you to do it also.
I can't wait to see the efficiency number.
But it really doesn't matter to me what that actual number will be.
I already know that this burner is better now than it was before.

EBEBRATT-Ed

Shoot for 0 smoke. better to be a tad lean and keep the boiler clean.

The right way is to adjust the burner for 0-trace of smoke and take a Co2 measurement. Whatever the C02 is (let's say it's 12%) then open the air band and adjust for 11% Co2 and leave it.

Make sure the boiler and the combustion chamber are hot when you test

MikeAmann

Thanks Ed.

MikeAmann

I played with the burner a little more last night.
Before we get to that, I have a question. When I replaced the combustion chamber, the only one available was a Lynn 1107. http://www.patriot-supply.com/products/showitem.cfm/LYNN_1107 It is a round chamber that has an ID of 12" and is 11" high (the "bucket" portion). I am sure it is larger than the original chamber that I vacuumed out.



This size is recommended for 1.35 GPH firing rates. I am running at half of that. The recommended chamber size for .5 to .65 GPH is 9" round, and 10" round for .75 to .85 GPH. From what I can see, the flame I have now fills the chamber without any impingement. And …..

EdTheHeaterMan said ….. Another trick you may try is to reduce the nozzle size to .60 GPH and increase the pump pressure to 120 PSI. This will make the droplets smaller creating more surface area for the oxygen to mix with the fuel. You will also get a .66 GPH firing rate at that pressure on the smaller nozzle. This may reduce the amount of excess air needed and get you another percent or two of efficiency.
EBEBRATT-Ed agreed ….. I agree with @EdTheHeaterMan , use a smaller nozzle and bump the oil pressure to get the firing rate you want. You will get better combustion, it won't hurt the pump at all.

So I tried turning up the pump pressure last night. I have a gauge in the gauge port. I believe I saw the pressure go up to 155 psi, but at 140 the needle dances wildly, dances a little at 120, and is rock steady at 100. I locked it at 120 because I am comfortable with that, but not with 140. With my .65 nozzle, that gives me a firing rate of .72 GPH, which is approaching the limits of the F0 disc (up to .75 according to the Burnham SR literature). Like you said above, a .60 at 120 will yield .66. I like that.

My air bands, I have locked together with a screw with a fine screen material between the two bands. The basement is also my workshop and I occasionally kick up some dust. The screen allows me to vacuum any dust and debris that would have been sucked into the fan. I might have to play with that to allow more air. Here is why I think that: while the burner was running and boiler sufficiently heated up, I went up on the roof to see what's coming out of the chimney. Storm Henri just passed through, so the temp was 70 degrees with 100% humidity and some wind at 3am. With a LED flashlight, I saw a little smoke. But it's hard to tell because the hot air coming out is hitting the cooler air and forming moisture. But there is a little blue/gray color occasionally. So I opened the air band further to try to reduce that. That seemed to work, but not totally gone.

Now I have to say that before this FR head conversion, there was no way that I could stand there at the top of the chimney with the burner running. The smell was nasty. Not that it was burning badly or anything - there was no smoke, but that smell was strong. Now I could stand there all day with the FR head and cleaner flame.

Using a Harbor Freight infrared temperature gun, I took a few measurements. If I can believe what it says, the flame is 1100+ degrees. I have that heat reclaimer on the output pipe, but I measured 235 degrees at the base of it. I can stick my hand in the barometric damper opening and the exhaust does not burn my hand. The room temp was 75 degrees. Does this mean that the NET temp is 160?
My larger baffles are doing a good job of keeping more heat down in the boiler where it can do better at heating the water. That is as long as I haven't killed the draft. That doesn't seem to be the case.

Steamhead, you said this back in Nov 1993:
Beckett AF burners when well sealed and properly tuned, these units put up some pretty good combustion test results and don't get sooted up over the course of a heating season.

The flue passages are rather large compared to a modern boiler, but can be baffled to make the hot flue gases wipe the cast-iron better. However, the person installing the baffles MUST make sure they do not kill the draft over the fire, or reduce the stack temperature enough to cause the flue gases to condense.

So the question: Wayne and Burnham recommend 80 degree nozzles for my setup. But with the larger diameter chamber, should I be using a 90 degree nozzle? I am guessing that I should be completely filling the chamber with the flame, but without any impingement. I will be testing a .60 GPH nozzle. Boiler techs in the past have used 70 and 60 degree nozzles - most likely to try to keep the flame off of the fractured or missing sides of the combustion chamber. I don't have that problem anymore.

Steamhead

MikeAmann said:

I played with the burner a little more last night.
Before we get to that, I have a question. When I replaced the combustion chamber, the only one available was a Lynn 1107. http://www.patriot-supply.com/products/showitem.cfm/LYNN_1107 It is a round chamber that has an ID of 12" and is 11" high (the "bucket" portion). I am sure it is larger than the original chamber that I vacuumed out.



This size is recommended for 1.35 GPH firing rates. I am running at half of that. The recommended chamber size for .5 to .65 GPH is 9" round, and 10" round for .75 to .85 GPH. From what I can see, the flame I have now fills the chamber without any impingement. And …..

EdTheHeaterMan said ….. Another trick you may try is to reduce the nozzle size to .60 GPH and increase the pump pressure to 120 PSI. This will make the droplets smaller creating more surface area for the oxygen to mix with the fuel. You will also get a .66 GPH firing rate at that pressure on the smaller nozzle. This may reduce the amount of excess air needed and get you another percent or two of efficiency.
EBEBRATT-Ed agreed ….. I agree with @EdTheHeaterMan , use a smaller nozzle and bump the oil pressure to get the firing rate you want. You will get better combustion, it won't hurt the pump at all.

So I tried turning up the pump pressure last night. I have a gauge in the gauge port. I believe I saw the pressure go up to 155 psi, but at 140 the needle dances wildly, dances a little at 120, and is rock steady at 100. I locked it at 120 because I am comfortable with that, but not with 140. With my .65 nozzle, that gives me a firing rate of .72 GPH, which is approaching the limits of the F0 disc (up to .75 according to the Burnham SR literature). Like you said above, a .60 at 120 will yield .66. I like that.

My air bands, I have locked together with a screw with a fine screen material between the two bands. The basement is also my workshop and I occasionally kick up some dust. The screen allows me to vacuum any dust and debris that would have been sucked into the fan. I might have to play with that to allow more air. Here is why I think that: while the burner was running and boiler sufficiently heated up, I went up on the roof to see what's coming out of the chimney. Storm Henri just passed through, so the temp was 70 degrees with 100% humidity and some wind at 3am. With a LED flashlight, I saw a little smoke. But it's hard to tell because the hot air coming out is hitting the cooler air and forming moisture. But there is a little blue/gray color occasionally. So I opened the air band further to try to reduce that. That seemed to work, but not totally gone.

Now I have to say that before this FR head conversion, there was no way that I could stand there at the top of the chimney with the burner running. The smell was nasty. Not that it was burning badly or anything - there was no smoke, but that smell was strong. Now I could stand there all day with the FR head and cleaner flame.

Using a Harbor Freight infrared temperature gun, I took a few measurements. If I can believe what it says, the flame is 1100+ degrees. I have that heat reclaimer on the output pipe, but I measured 235 degrees at the base of it. I can stick my hand in the barometric damper opening and the exhaust does not burn my hand. The room temp was 75 degrees. Does this mean that the NET temp is 160?
My larger baffles are doing a good job of keeping more heat down in the boiler where it can do better at heating the water. That is as long as I haven't killed the draft. That doesn't seem to be the case.

Steamhead, you said this back in Nov 1993:
Beckett AF burners when well sealed and properly tuned, these units put up some pretty good combustion test results and don't get sooted up over the course of a heating season.

The flue passages are rather large compared to a modern boiler, but can be baffled to make the hot flue gases wipe the cast-iron better. However, the person installing the baffles MUST make sure they do not kill the draft over the fire, or reduce the stack temperature enough to cause the flue gases to condense.

So the question: Wayne and Burnham recommend 80 degree nozzles for my setup. But with the larger diameter chamber, should I be using a 90 degree nozzle? I am guessing that I should be completely filling the chamber with the flame, but without any impingement. I will be testing a .60 GPH nozzle. Boiler techs in the past have used 70 and 60 degree nozzles - most likely to try to keep the flame off of the fractured or missing sides of the combustion chamber. I don't have that problem anymore.

Stick with the 80° hollow for now. Combustion test numbers will help tell us if the flame is too small.

EBEBRATT-Ed

The size of the combustion can usually be larger than the minimum without any effect on combustion. The oil pressure bouncing is concerning me a little

MikeAmann

EBEBRATT-Ed
Right now, to me, it looks like the flame is filling the "bucket" area of the combustion chamber quite nicely. The oil supply is all new also. Wool filter at the tank, new line in the floor, and Westwood spin-on filter at the boiler. There are now no kinks or restrictions. The pump has lived it's whole life at 100 psi. Maybe it's getting tired?
I can remove it and give it a good cleaning, but then there is also the chance that I can make it worse. I assume rebuild kits are available?
I am going to try to get a .60 x 80A nozzle tomorrow and set the pressure at 120 to yield .66 GPH.

MikeAmann

I did a little more experimenting last night. Storm Henri came back around and the weather conditions were nearly the same as the night before.

I removed the air bands and reset them so that they now adjust from near fully closed to full open. I thought that the screen material that I had between the bands might be dirty and causing an airflow restriction. Not the case - discolored, but not dirty. I put a new one in anyways.

So like the night before, I made a change, went up on the roof to the chimney, and observed. I started with the slots open 1.6 inches - no smoke. 1.4 - no smoke. 1.2, 1.0, 0.8, 0.6, and 0.4 - all no smoke. I closed the bands, which still has an opening of .100". I saw some smoke. So I locked the adjustment at 1/4" (.250). I was trying to find that point of a trace of smoke and then add just a little more air. I think I have found that. I should also add that I added a gasket to the transformer base, so no air is getting into the combustion chamber there. Many years ago, I added a time-delay relay to the transformer so that it only runs for 11 seconds. I will add some sealant to that electrical knockout passage.


Now, I know that this setting being so little is trying to tell me something - I just don't have the experience that you experts do to know exactly what that something is - and whether it is a good thing or that some other area still needs work.

At this adjustment, the flame is hotter. The HF infrared gun instantly reads HI LIMIT, or whatever it displays. The base of the reclaimer now measures 20 degrees hotter (255).

MikeAmann

I can get nozzles at SupplyHouse for $4.77 ea. I'm sure they will be 3X as much locally.
CRAP - DVAxxxx is temporarily unavailable.
Due to nationwide inventory shortages, this item is on backorder until further notice.

Patriot Supply has them for $6.99 ea. Might be backordered for a while, but I can get (all 80* Delavan)
.50, .55, .60, and .50 GALLON 80* A DEL-O-FLO NOZZLE.

Should I place an order, what should I order for this experiment?
And to make the shipping worth it, should I order a pump "rebuild" kit (if that exists)?

Steamhead

@MikeAmann , you have reached the limit of what you can do by eye. A smoke tester, used by a pro, can pick up amounts of smoke that the naked eye cannot. There's not much point in messing with it any further until a pro is there with proper test equipment. Then you'll see how easy it is to set it up properly- without climbing ladders.

Your time-delay relay scares me. If the burner doesn't light in 11 seconds, and the relay cuts off the ignition, the burner will keep spraying oil into the chamber until the primary control locks out. This will result in a major puffback when the burner finally lights off again. What kind of primary control is on there now?

MikeAmann

Honeywell R8182D Aquastat - 45 seconds I believe. Once the burner is lit - it's lit and stays lit.
When the CDS cell senses no flame, everything stops and the safety botton pops out.
I have been running it this way for maybe 10 years and NEVER once has the flame gone out.
We even did the same to my friend John's Wayne EHA burner, and he never had a problem either.
I discovered sometime later that the newer units have this function built in.

Steamhead

You're skating on pretty thin ice.

I had a similar control on my boiler. It finally died, and this is how I replaced it:

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/176551/nice-job-beckett

I recommend this kit for replacing those integrated controls. I'm pretty sure Wayne uses a standard 1900 box mounted above the motor to hold the standard type of primary control. You can mount one there, or attach the box to the boiler jacket and run a 4-wire cable (motor, ignition, oil valve and neutral wires, plus a ground) to the burner.

MikeAmann

I read and bookmarked your link. Thanks.
Steamhead - You're skating on pretty thin ice.
How do you figure? I am asking, not arguing.

Many years ago, the wirewound ignition transformer died. Service guy replaced it with the electronic Carlin. That died within a couple of months. Replaced again.
At that time, the circulator was still the huge pump and motor combo, not the small Taco.
The transformer and fan/pump motor are wired in parallel. I figured counter EMF from that big motor might be taking out the electronic Carlin transformers. I actually bought a new wirewound just in case. It's still in the box on the shelf. I installed the Taco 007 sometime later.

So it's the middle of winter, burner has no ignition, it's getting cold, and the service guy can't get there for a couple of days. He tells me that I can light it with a piece of newspaper. Once it's lit, it's lit, until it the aquastat is satisfied. That's where I got the idea for the relay.

So let's analyze this. Burner is running and for some reason, the flame goes out. There is no spark to re-light it (relay is already kicked out). So yeah, fuel is still spraying from the nozzle. But the CDS cell has detected no flame and the safety circuit cuts power to the fan motor and ignition transformer, AND THE RESET BUTTON POPS OUT. The only way ignition can happen again is for a person to physically reset the R8182D. I know better than to just keep hitting the button.

Also, if there was a condition where the flame was to sputter (go out, re-light, go out, re-light), with the time-delay relay in that circuit, the flame is not able to do that anymore. This added time-delay relay actually makes this a one-shot deal - flame lost and 45 seconds later the safety button pops out.

Unless I am missing something, this mod has actually made this burner SAFER.

Now I hate to even mention that I have an Intellidyne IntelliCon HW+ connected to the Aquastat. Say what you will, but it's been saving me nearly 30% for about 10 years now. It basically allows me to extend or override (for lack of a better term), the built-in 10 degree HI limit's differential to as much as 60 degrees depending on the heat loss load.
Once you understand it, the concept is simple. Aquastat receives a CFH, but the HW+ says do I really need to fire the burner, or is the water already hot enough to satisfy that CFH? Water IS hot enough, so the HW+ just lets the circulator run and holds off the firing of the burner until it is really needed. It works great.

MikeAmann

I was amazed today. The other day I stuck a mirror and LED bulb in through the viewport to see what the new FR head looks like from the inside of the combustion chamber. I wanted to get a picture, but I didn't have my camera. I remember that port being somewhat sooty. Since then I only ran the boiler one time (15 minutes) on early Tuesday morning when I was trying to find the trace of soot setting of the air bands.

Today I brought my camera to get that picture and that port was almost the clean white like the chamber was when new. Is this possible, or is my mind playing tricks on me? This is burning much cleaner now than it ever did with the sunflower head. Here is that picture and a few others:

Steamhead

MikeAmann said:

I read and bookmarked your link. Thanks.
Steamhead - You're skating on pretty thin ice.
How do you figure? I am asking, not arguing.

Many years ago, the wirewound ignition transformer died. Service guy replaced it with the electronic Carlin. That died within a couple of months. Replaced again.
At that time, the circulator was still the huge pump and motor combo, not the small Taco.
The transformer and fan/pump motor are wired in parallel. I figured counter EMF from that big motor might be taking out the electronic Carlin transformers. I actually bought a new wirewound just in case. It's still in the box on the shelf. I installed the Taco 007 sometime later.

So it's the middle of winter, burner has no ignition, it's getting cold, and the service guy can't get there for a couple of days. He tells me that I can light it with a piece of newspaper. Once it's lit, it's lit, until it the aquastat is satisfied. That's where I got the idea for the relay.

So let's analyze this. Burner is running and for some reason, the flame goes out. There is no spark to re-light it (relay is already kicked out). So yeah, fuel is still spraying from the nozzle. But the CDS cell has detected no flame and the safety circuit cuts power to the fan motor and ignition transformer, AND THE RESET BUTTON POPS OUT. The only way ignition can happen again is for a person to physically reset the R8182D. I know better than to just keep hitting the button.

Also, if there was a condition where the flame was to sputter (go out, re-light, go out, re-light), with the time-delay relay in that circuit, the flame is not able to do that anymore. This added time-delay relay actually makes this a one-shot deal - flame lost and 45 seconds later the safety button pops out.

Unless I am missing something, this mod has actually made this burner SAFER.

Now I hate to even mention that I have an Intellidyne IntelliCon HW+ connected to the Aquastat. Say what you will, but it's been saving me nearly 30% for about 10 years now. It basically allows me to extend or override (for lack of a better term), the built-in 10 degree HI limit's differential to as much as 60 degrees depending on the heat loss load.
Once you understand it, the concept is simple. Aquastat receives a CFH, but the HW+ says do I really need to fire the burner, or is the water already hot enough to satisfy that CFH? Water IS hot enough, so the HW+ just lets the circulator run and holds off the firing of the burner until it is really needed. It works great.

I'm pretty sure there is some UL or other safety requirement that the ignition keep going during the "trial for ignition" period which on that control is 45 seconds. So cutting it off sooner would void the listing. I know that insurance companies don't like this.

I am no fan of keeping the ignition on during the entire time the burner is running. We routinely replace primary controls that leave the ignition on for the entire running time ("intermittent ignition") with ones that shut it down once the burner flame is verified ("interrupted ignition") such as the GeniSys. This saves electricity and extends the life of the ignitor and electrodes, and results in fewer service calls. I like to sleep at night.

But, as a professional service person, I know better than to tamper with safety controls. Again, I like to sleep at night.

It probably wouldn't hurt to set your timer to 60 seconds or so. This way the trial for ignition safety setup would not be changed, and you'd still benefit from reduced ignitor run time. But again, I am not in a position of authority to say for sure.

The Intellidyne control, I believe, is the same basic functionality used in the AquaSmart I linked to. It was also sold as the Beckett Heat Manager. One thing I really like about the AquaSmart is that it can hold the circulator off for a few minutes to let the boiler warm up and get out of condensing range.

Steamhead

MikeAmann said:

I was amazed today. The other day I stuck a mirror and LED bulb in through the viewport to see what the new FR head looks like from the inside of the combustion chamber. I wanted to get a picture, but I didn't have my camera. I remember that port being somewhat sooty. Since then I only ran the boiler one time (15 minutes) on early Tuesday morning when I was trying to find the trace of soot setting of the air bands.

Today I brought my camera to get that picture and that port was almost the clean white like the chamber was when new. Is this possible, or is my mind playing tricks on me? This is burning much cleaner now than it ever did with the sunflower head.

And that is why the flame-retention head became the state of the oil-burner art. There really is no reason to run an older burner design anymore.

For even cleaner running, the newest burners use an oil-delay valve which holds the oil feed back for a few seconds to let the air flow, pump pressure and ignition stabilize. The resulting start produces much less smoke and soot. Beckett makes a kit that will fit most burners to add this feature. We stock these kits.

MikeAmann

Steamhead

You make a good point about setting the ignition cutout time to a longer delay. That way the aquastat is still in control of the trial for ignition as designed. It's actually just a resistor value change - very easy.

The burner always fired quickly before this FR head change, but it is instantaneous now. And the flame is now so stable. It's really a night and day difference.

As I understand it, the Beckett Heat Manager is non-adjustable; the Intellicon HW+ is programmable. There is about an 8% temperature difference between the level that the aquatsat's well and temperature gauge is at, and the output pipe where the HW+ senses. The output pipe is hotter (higher level - heat rises). My R8182D's HI limit is set to 180 degrees (therefore the HW+ reads 194), and when the HI limit is reached and the burner stops, the temp continues to rise to 212 (HW+) without the circulator running. I have the HW+ HLOLIM set for 130 degrees, giving me a huge temperature range for the circulator to operate within.

Steamhead

So- when does your burner get dialed in with an analyzer?

MikeAmann

Soon. Life just threw something else at me.
I need to find the right person to do it.
Might you know of any near me? (Meriden, CT) I tried the "Find a Contractor in your area." NOTHING.
The guy I had was forced to retire (medical issues) and he said that the only place he would trust is Clark's Heating in Middletown, CT.
I am going to try to get a .60 GPH nozzle tomorrow. If I actually get one, I will test it once more.
And I might look inside the pump.

Steamhead

Try @Charlie from wmass . If he doesn't do oil, he might know someone.

SuperTech

I would definitely ditch the antique controls, time delay relay and the Intellicon. Get a modern primary control with interrupted ignition and 15 second trial for ignition. Its safer and code in a lot of areas. The Beckett Aquasmart, Hydrostat 3250 or Honeywell L7224U all have money and energy saving features superior to your worn out control. Your aquastat should be sensing boiler temperature more accurately than the Intellicon which hasn't been great interest of accuracy in my experience. 

You got your moneys worth out of the old aquastat and oil pump. Time for an upgrade. 

MikeAmann

Supertech - noted about the controls. But first we need to dial this burner in with instruments.
And that might even be easier than I thought. I went to F W Webb today to get a .60 X 80A hollow nozzle. There is a national shortage and they just got a shipment last week. Mike, the counter person lives 1 street away from me. I was explaining how I converted my old burner and was looking for an old-school boiler tech to dial it in with the instruments. He recommended Steve xxxxxx, who lives about 8 houses down on my street. Great guy and he has helped me in the past. I thought he was a plumber and had no idea he worked on boilers. I will try to get in touch with him this weekend, ask if he will read this thread first, and then see if he is willing to touch it.

Last night I looked at the time-delay relay. The desired time is set by an external resistor or potentiometer - 20K ohms per second. For 11 seconds I was using a 220K resistor. 60 seconds would need 1.2Meg ohms. I had a 1.0Meg that should give 50 me seconds. So I had the time to solder it in and do a quick test..... 51 seconds, that'll work. While I was in there, I packed some 3M Strip Calk around the wires so that there is no air bypassing the air bands. Now to get a look inside that oil pump.....

SuperTech

I don't really think there's much to see inside the oil pump. They are designed to be replaced rather than rebuilt. I really like all the work that you are putting into this project. I can really appreciate the passion because I am the same way. If you can get that burner dialed in to a true zero smoke, 11-12% CO2, 4.5-5.5% O2 and zero PPM CO during steady state combustion you will be in good shape.  Make sure to dial in the draft first. -.01-.03" over fire, .03-.04" in the breach. I would also recommend going higher than 100 PSI on the oil pump and using the smaller nozzle.  But I would go with a new Beckett clean cut pump to go along with the new interrupted ignition primary control and new aquastat. 15 second pre purge will help establish draft and give the burner cleaner ignition.  15 second post purge also helps keep the boiler clean. Hopefully you can post some pictures of the results of the combustion analysis.  

MikeAmann

Last night I buttoned up the now 51 second cutout time-delay relay.
I installed the .60 GPH nozzle.
Then I pulled the oil pump off and apart. Before I left work, I watched a couple videos about Suntec pumps, so I would know what to expect. BTW, my pump is actually a Sunstrand A1VA-7012. I figured the bouncing gauge needle had to be caused by the pressure adjustment mechanism. If it was anything like a small Chevy oil pump, then I already have a good idea of what's in there. It should be a sleeve, a spring, and an adjustment screw. And that's what I found in there. There was no debris anywhere inside the pump. I cleaned the pump in my parts washer and the passages with a small tubing brush and then blew everything clean with compressed air. That sleeve has a couple of small holes drilled in the sides of it, and I made sure those were clean by using a #52 (.063") drill bit. Then I cleaned the outside of the sleeve with green Scotchbrite. I carefully put it all back together using chain lube spray to coat the moving parts to prevent a dry start up. With everything back together, I attached a clear length of tubing to the air bleed port and stuck the other end in a glass jar.
I hit the switch, the burner fired right up even though the bleed port was open, closed the valve when the air was gone, and read 105# on the gauge - right where it was before I took it apart. Then I tried to increase the pressure to 120#, and it did. Nice and steady with no bouncing needle. I called that good and let the burner run up to the LO limit while I cleaned up.

Now I really need to comment about this old pump. This is almost certainly the original pump to this boiler (56 years) and was MADE IN USA (when that actually still meant something) long before the days of CNC machining. And that really showed. There was virtually NO WEAR inside, only polished surfaces from moving parts. The US shared our technology with "other countries" (nothing against them) in the 1980's and they ran with it. We have been trying to play catch-up ever since. Those old time machinists really knew their craft!

After all of this, I most certainly will post some pictures of the results of the combustion analysis.
I just have to contact Steve and get him to read this and see if he's on board, or wants to run away.

I am already seeing the black soot coating on the underside of the water tank starting to disappear.

MikeAmann

Question: I assume that I should add a hole at the bottom of the heat reclaimer (breach) so that the NET stack temperature could be read? Even if the fan of the heat reclaimer is not running, the reclaimer still draws some heat out of the exhaust. I already have a hole at the top. A short 3/8" stainless steel bolt threads into it. Is that large enough for the probe to fit?

Steamhead

Yes, and that should be the right size.

EBEBRATT-Ed

Slightly over 1/4" will work. Most probes are around 1/4"

MikeAmann

Perfect. Thanks guys.

MikeAmann

Steamhead - Beckett makes a kit that will fit most burners to add this feature. We stock these kits.
I started looking at these fuel solenoid kits. I like the idea.
Since my oil pump is good now, and I doubt that Beckett/Suntec makes a 1725 rpm pump with the solenoid, I would add the kit that installs in the small copper oil line going from the pump to the oil tube/nozzle line. I like that the 4 second delay is built into the cord. Is this it?
https://www.supplyhouse.com/Beckett-2182602U-Beckett-F84-Valve-Kit-w-Precision-Delay-Timer?gclid=Cj0KCQjwg7KJBhDyARIsAHrAXaHH7JiE0ODElt63v5paRwAgiUDogKuLDXdRO0I7ktEBknKmB0i7XPUaAk4BEALw_wcB
What is your price? I would rather give you the sale. And I would get a spare coil. I know those die after a while.

Steamhead

You can get it for the same price online- go for it.

I've put delay valves on SR burners and they work great. You're right that they don't make a 1725-RPM CleanCut.

EBEBRATT-Ed

I am sure you can run a 3450 pump at 1725. Capacity would be the issue it will still build pressure to the pressure reg set point. Just step up to a larger pump maybe, but with you small nozzle you would probably be ok.

But the kit makes more sense.

Seems to me I ran into this on a job years ago trying to find a replacement pump and the OEM pump was not available Can't remember the details

EDIT:

Looked it up. This appears to be true for "j" & "H' pumps only. They can be run at 1725 or 3450 same pump The "A & "B" pumps are different.

MikeAmann

Beckett 2182602U Solenoid Oil Valve Delay kit with PD timer and a spare coil is ordered.

Kickstand55

Huh! A modified Chariot.
Yeah, it's got a Hemi!

MikeAmann

I saw Steve today, and he got out of the heating side of his plumbing business.
But he gave me a name of someone that he thinks can help with dialing it in.
Erosion control up on the hill in my backyard is demanding my time right now.
But I did start the prep for adding the oil delay solenoid. It should arrive today.
Stay tuned........

MikeAmann

Oil Delay Solenoid is installed. It works. Of course it functions - what I mean is that it makes the burner ignite a little "softer". Without the solenoid, the burner lit instantaneously, with a little bigger "bang", if you know what I am trying to say. Now the air gets a chance to start flowing (establish draft) and then the oil is released and gives the burner cleaner ignition. BTW, the oil pressure takes no time at all to get to 120 psi - it's instant.
I do like that the shutoff is no longer like an old man with a prostate problem trying to pee and doing the dribble thing as the motor (and oil pump) winds down. And this solenoid stops any chance of a gravity fed fuel oil leak if an accident were to happen (normally closed).

While I was in there, I removed the motor which gave me a chance to really clean out the housing with carb cleaner. And I swapped the 2x4 electrical box that I have the timer relay in for a 4x4 box. This extra room allowed me to run all the wires to that box and make the connections there, instead of inside the burner housing. It neatens things up a bit.

I mounted the solenoid up out of the way for 4 reasons:
1) I didn't want it blocking my oil pressure gauge
2) I want to be able to fully open my ignition transformer without interference
3) I want the solenoid to be able to have some air around it to to keep it cool(er)
4) I want to be able to vacuum that fine screen I have installed between the air bands.

I let the burner run up to the LO limit. Just heating the water in the tank (no circulators running), it took 19.5 minutes to heat the water from 73 to 157 degrees.

Soon I will get someone to do the combustion analysis and post the results.

EBEBRATT-Ed

@MikeAmann

Solenoid valves make a big improvement, but burners don't continue to "pee" without one. The only time they do is when air is trapped in the nozzle line after a nozzle is replaced or removed or in some boilers if the combustion chamber is red hot the oil left in the nozzle will expand from the heat when the burner shuts down causing some carbon or fouling of the combustion head but that doesn't happen often

The pressure regulator inside the pump does not let oil go to the nozzle until the oil pressure is above approx 80psi which happens almost instantly as the motor comes up to speed.

Same thing on shutdown, the pressure reg stops flow to the nozzle as the motor slows down.

solenoids keep the burner cleaner though and give better stops and starts

Steamhead

EBEBRATT-Ed said:

@MikeAmann Solenoid valves make a big improvement, but burners don't continue to "pee" without one.

Unless the cut-off function in the fuel unit is bad..............

MikeAmann

Ah, I understand now. I made an incorrect assumption. Thanks for explaining it guys.