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Wallet cards for clocking gas meters?

JohnNY
JohnNY Member Posts: 2,739
Hello,
Does anyone know where I can purchase or otherwise acquire printed wallet cards for clocking gas meters?
Best to all,
John Cataneo
Contact John "JohnNY" Cataneo, Master Plumber
in New York
in New Jersey
for Consulting Work
or take his class.

Comments

  • rick in Alaska
    rick in Alaska Member Posts: 1,241
    I just use the timer on my phone and then the calculator. I take 3,600,000 and then divide by the time in seconds to make one cubic foot. Seems just as easy as using a chart.
    Rick
  • HVACNUT
    HVACNUT Member Posts: 4,187
    Try getting a printout from the utility. I can't even remotely remember when I laminated this. Keyspan has been gone for a while.
  • Larry Weingarten
    Larry Weingarten Member Posts: 2,281
    Hi, How about taking a picture of what HVACNUT posted and just keeping it on your phone for quick reference? B)

    Yours, Larry
    Zmankcopp
  • STEVEusaPA
    STEVEusaPA Member Posts: 5,301
    Here's @HVACNUT's in a pdf. I have one printed/laminated, and the pdf on my phone.
    steve
    Alan (California Radiant) Forbes
  • JohnNY
    JohnNY Member Posts: 2,739
    So, the takeaway here is I gotta make my own?
    Contact John "JohnNY" Cataneo, Master Plumber
    in New York
    in New Jersey
    for Consulting Work
    or take his class.
  • ratio
    ratio Member Posts: 2,918
    That's what it sounds like. Too bad, I was interested in one also.

    Guess I'll fire up ol' Word the next time I'm idled at the office.

    JohnNY
  • ch4man
    ch4man Member Posts: 247
    its easier to learn the math...
    Ricks math can be off and hvacnuts cheatsheet is only good for 7" gas. you need to modify the formula for 2 lb metering pressure systems....

    7" metering system;
    3600 divided by the seconds to pass 1 cubic foot equals cfh per hr.

    2lb metering system;
    3600 divided by the seconds to pass 1 cubic foot times 1.12 equals cfm per hr.

    multiply either by the heat content of the local gas gives out btuh input.
  • STEVEusaPA
    STEVEusaPA Member Posts: 5,301
    I posted a pdf. Print it, laminate it if you want, or save and look at it on your phone.
    steve
    JohnNY
  • ratio
    ratio Member Posts: 2,918
    ch4man said:

    2lb metering system;
    3600 divided by the seconds to pass 1 cubic foot times 1.12 equals cfm per hr.

    How did you derive this? I'd really like a formula that I could plug in meter pressure & get a correction factor of some kind.
  • JohnNY
    JohnNY Member Posts: 2,739

    I posted a pdf. Print it, laminate it if you want, or save and look at it on your phone.

    Thank you. I think that font is hard to read at small sizes but I'll check it out.

    Contact John "JohnNY" Cataneo, Master Plumber
    in New York
    in New Jersey
    for Consulting Work
    or take his class.
  • ch4man
    ch4man Member Posts: 247
    ratio said:

    ch4man said:

    2lb metering system;
    3600 divided by the seconds to pass 1 cubic foot times 1.12 equals cfm per hr.

    How did you derive this? I'd really like a formula that I could plug in meter pressure & get a correction factor of some kind.
    i know some guys who work for the gas company, very smart guys and the gas co who mfg'd gas that was made on the banks of the Mississippi around the turn of the century.
    as i was told;

    a gas meter will pass 12% more gas at 2 PSI than 1/4 psi.
    a gas meter will pass 2% more gas at 14" WC than 1/4 psi.

    this is why you gas bill has correction factors. most gas meters are temperature compensated but not pressure compensated.

    now think of the physical size of a tank of nitrogen at what a couple few thousand psi. the weld shop sells then as 80 cubic feet. that tank aint that large on the outside
    ratio
  • Mike_Sheppard
    Mike_Sheppard Member Posts: 680
    Pressure correction:

    (14.74 + line pressure) / 14.74 = Y

    (Y x 3600 x Dial Size) / Seconds for revolution = CFH

    Multiply by btu content of the gas to get BTU/hr

    Never stop learning.
    ratioch4manZmanSteve Minnich
  • ratio
    ratio Member Posts: 2,918

    Pressure correction:

    (14.74 + line pressure) / 14.74 = Y

    (Y x 3600 x Dial Size) / Seconds for revolution = CFH

    Multiply by btu content of the gas to get BTU/hr

    Is line pressure inches or pounds? 14.74 is atmospheric pressure & may be corrected for elevation?
  • GW
    GW Member Posts: 4,302
    Just have a pic of the chart and create a folder. I have Google Pics app, I have the chart in my Technical folder. 
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    [email protected]
  • ch4man
    ch4man Member Posts: 247
    my information falls right in line with mike Sheppards math when going from a 7" system to a 2lb system.
    thx Mike, i never knew the math behind the correction factors
  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 3,941
    ratio said:

    Pressure correction:

    (14.74 + line pressure) / 14.74 = Y

    (Y x 3600 x Dial Size) / Seconds for revolution = CFH

    Multiply by btu content of the gas to get BTU/hr

    Is line pressure inches or pounds? 14.74 is atmospheric pressure & may be corrected for elevation?
    You have to multiple/divide like units for them to cancel out.
    ratio
  • Mike_Sheppard
    Mike_Sheppard Member Posts: 680
    edited September 2020
    @ratio sorry about that - yes the line pressure is in PSIG.

    To be more specific:

    (Atmospheric pressure + Line Pressure PSIG) / Atmospheric BASE pressure

    “Atmospheric pressure” gets corrected by you based on your altitude.

    ”Atmospheric BASE pressure” is the atmospheric pressure that your gas company references. The altitude that the gas company uses and the altitude at your job site may not be the same.


    As for the rest of the equation.

    3,600 = The amount of seconds in an hour. Because we are trying to calculate cubic feet per -hour- (CFH) by counting the amount of seconds it takes a certain dial to make a revolution.

    After you get CFH figured out you just have to multiply it by the BTU content of the gas to get BTU/Hr.

    You can call your gas company to figure out the BTU per cubic foot of gas they supply. Where I am at it is about 1,020 btu per cu/f. 

    There is also a temperature correction that I never use because the difference is so small. And I also do commercial/industrial and most of the meters I deal with are already temperature and pressure corrected.

    Never stop learning.
    ratio
  • gerry gill
    gerry gill Member Posts: 3,010
    Talk to the Bacharach rep. They gave me a stack of them many years ago. I don’t know off hand if they still have them or not.
    gwgillplumbingandheating.com
    Serving Cleveland's eastern suburbs from Cleveland Heights down to Cuyahoga Falls.

    JohnNYratio
  • Zman
    Zman Member Posts: 6,965
    edited September 2020
    @Mike_Sheppard , Thanks for posting the formula, that is super useful for both clocking boilers and calculating gas usage on 2# meters.
    The attached doc shows how much the BTU content and specific gravity varies in the high altitude region of the west. The process gets a little more complicated when you throw derated gas into the equation. To determine the PSI at altitude, this is a useful resource https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/air-altitude-pressure-d_462.html
    "If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough"
    Albert Einstein