Cordless Tool Batteries

EBEBRATT-Ed

I understand that "Batteries Plus Bulbs" (and probably other places)can rebuild cordless tool batteries. Has anyone ever done this or had this done? Is it worthwhile?

Hap_Hazzard

It depends on what type of batteries and what they replace them with. Lithium battery technology is constantly improving, so if they rebuild them with state of the art lithium cells, you can end up with something way better than the original. If they use the cheapest cells they can find, you'll get something that dies in a month.

I haven't had any of my batteries rebuilt, but I made the mistake of buying some "reconditioned" lithium batteries from a Ryobi outlet, and man, they sucked. I took them back and exchanged them and the exchanged ones were worse!

hot_rod

I have had them rebuild some old Hitachi 14v for me. They basically open the case and replace the cells. They offered me a choice of Ah. They warranty them just like new. My branch lets me know if it is better to rebuild or buy new if available.

B_Sloane

you can solder, right ..?
you can diy ..
just buy Panasonic cells, they seem to be the very best

Hap_Hazzard

B_Sloane said:

you can solder, right ..?
you can diy ..
just buy Panasonic cells, they seem to be the very best

They seem to use a special spot-welder to connect the cells together. I don't know if solder will even stick to the terminals or what kind of damage the heat would do to the cell.

hot_rod

B_Sloane said:

you can solder, right ..?
you can diy ..
just buy Panasonic cells, they seem to be the very best

I needed an odd 21.5 V for an old VOM I was trying to restore. The Batteries Plus guy showed me how to stack cells to build my own and offered to build it and enclose it for me.

If you have a branch with knowing and willing employees that makes a difference.

I scratch the date I buy batteries from them in the case so I can track longevity. They rebuilt this 14.4 for me twice, in 2015 and 2018. It runs a small impact driver so it gets a work out.

EBEBRATT-Ed

I just found out they now have a store near me so I will give it a try. Collecting a lot of old batteries. Most of my stuff is Ryobi and some Milwaukee. Used to have a bunch of DeWalt stuff but only have the little circular saw left..........but the battery is dead

hot_rod

I have a few old favorite 12V Dewalt tools. They have those available still. I also have a few 28V Milwaukee tools.

mattmia2

You can solder to batteries. Use a hot iron and flux and sand/scrape before you solder it so you can wet and tin it quickly without heating the rest of it too much.

Hap_Hazzard

I know you can, but should you? I wouldn't recommend it.

mattmia2

It is fine if you're careful with the heat.

EBEBRATT-Ed

Yeah, there are U tube videos about rebuilding your own battery paks.

I got time i might take a chance and try that

ratio

Just to be not completely OT, I watched the development of this (here) if you want to tab batteries like a pro.

Leonard

I don't think much of Nickle-cadmium bats, they go bad with age. I forget I think it was 3-4 years

Bat tabs I've seen look to be stainless steel, can't solder to them unless you use acid as the flux to break oxide coating (even if shinny it's chromium oxide). I dipped a plastic straw into a car bat to get some acid, not a great solder job but it worked. Sand with fine sandpaper first. I used a Welder ~125 watt soldering gun. Try not to let bats get too hot, likely not good for them.

mattmia2

The plating on batteries isn't chrome, it is something that is wettable with solder. the way to do it without heating the battery much is to file or sand a clean spot, but some electronic grade flux on the spot, touch a heavy and moderately hot iron to it just long enough to wet it and leave a pool of solder on it, wait for it to cool, and solder a tinned wire to that pool of solder, should be able to reheat the solder pool and wire just long enough for them to melt and flow together, won't heat the rest of the battery much. if you use 60/40 solder you will have to heat it less than with lead free solder.

ChrisJ

mattmia2 said:

The plating on batteries isn't chrome, it is something that is wettable with solder. the way to do it without heating the battery much is to file or sand a clean spot, but some electronic grade flux on the spot, touch a heavy and moderately hot iron to it just long enough to wet it and leave a pool of solder on it, wait for it to cool, and solder a tinned wire to that pool of solder, should be able to reheat the solder pool and wire just long enough for them to melt and flow together, won't heat the rest of the battery much. if you use 60/40 solder you will have to heat it less than with lead free solder.

I use mostly 63/37 rosin core for electronics. Works at a lower temp than 60/40. The rosin isn't corrosive like acid fluxes.


What I'm confused about is how can you put multiple cells together without them being balanced? I thought you couldn't do this with lithium-ion?

BinDerSmokDat

I watched a documentary or a How It's Made about a seagoing probe that floats around for up to two years and sends back data. It's power source? A whole F*ton of alkaline D cells. Like 20-30. They put all of the D cells in a ring and then lay little strips of metal across the tops of the batteries and solder them to make one big battery. Dude used a regular soldering gun, no special tool, no apparent special prep. And this thing survives bobbing in the ocean for a few years.

ethicalpaul

> I don't think much of Nickle-cadmium bats, they go bad with age. I forget I think it was 3-4 years

Name a battery technology that doesn't go bad with age

Hap_Hazzard

ethicalpaul said:

Name a battery technology that doesn't go bad with age

Whatever the Jedi use in their lightsabers. I want some of those!

Hap_Hazzard

Alkaline batteries are crap. I've lost thousands of dollars of equipment because of leakage, and I've had unopened packages of alkaline cells go bad just sitting on the shelf.

Some NiCd cells are better than others. I got a Black and Decker drill years ago, and it's batteries would go all day on a charge. When I got a Ryobi drill a few years later, the Black and Decker batteries still outperformed the brand new Ryobis. They outperformed everything until I finally invested in a couple of Ryobi lithium batteries.

ChrisJ

Hap_Hazzard said:

Alkaline batteries are crap. I've lost thousands of dollars of equipment because of leakage, and I've had unopened packages of alkaline cells go bad just sitting on the shelf.

Some NiCd cells are better than others. I got a Black and Decker drill years ago, and it's batteries would go all day on a charge. When I got a Ryobi drill a few years later, the Black and Decker batteries still outperformed the brand new Ryobis. They outperformed everything until I finally invested in a couple of Ryobi lithium batteries.

I disagree.
Alkalines are ok. Zinc batteries are absolute garbage.

mattmia2

If you put flux on the surface as well as using rosin core solder, the surface will wet and tin faster. With just rosin core solder, you have to melt some solder to release some flux on the surface, if you put flux on the surface first, the solder will wet the surface as soon as it gets hot and you will transfer less heat in to the surrounding parts of the battery.

Leonard

NiCd cells I threw in cellar for storage didn't last many years. Friend is a carpenter , he bought a drill, put it in storage, said it's NiCd bats died in 3-4 years. Taking it apart the cells are all just in series, no balancing. I've read of cell voltage balancing on electric car Lithium bat string in my engineering magazines.

I've got some C and D alkaline cells that are ~ 30-40 years old, they still have power

As far as soldering bat tabs I did use electronics lead solder ~ 60/40 with activated rosin flux core, and ~ 100+ watt soldering gun . It would not wet bat tab, so between that and looking at metal of tab, I'ld say it looks like stainless steel. When I used car bat acid it did wet the surface. But it's possible I am wrong about it being stainless, I didn't test it further.

Len
MSME

mattmia2

rechargeable batteries will store a lot longer in certain partial charge states then full discharged. ideally you would recharge them periodically in storage since they self discharge and will become completely discharged over time.

I have soldered a lot of batteries over the years and had good luck with abrading them then soldering with flux.